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Time to Fire Mike Sullivan?

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Old
02-06-2013, 01:42 AM
  #101
NYR Sting
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Maybe Mike Sullivan should be fired (he never struck me as a particularly thorough x's-and-o's guy), but is it his fault that these people simply can't make quick, on-target tape-to-tape passes?

At this point, this is a club with above-average skill. Maybe not up and down the line up, but certainly top heavy with it, which should translate to the power play. It is mindboggling that they are such a poor passing team. Worse teams, much worse teams, seem to have more chemistry offensively than this team.

The guy behind the bench running the PP is surely responsible for developing some sort of scheme for these players to follow, but NHL players shouldn't need anyone to tell them the basic tenets of a power play (or offense in general): keep moving your feet, keep moving the puck, and open space and time will avail themselves to you. Get defenders out of position, and you'll create high quality scoring chances. These aren't the braindead Scott Gomezs or Olli Jokinens of the league, these are mostly players with proven prowess in the decision making aspect of the sport.

The skaters are slow, their passes are frequently a moment too late, a couple of inches off target, or simply the wrong pass to the wrong player or area of the ice at the wrong time.

Renney's buddy who looked like Ronnie the Limo Driver couldn't solve this problem, Sully can't solve it. I don't know who the answer is, because even a great coaching mind can't make up for poor execution.

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02-06-2013, 02:10 AM
  #102
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May as well combine this thread with the "Fire Tortorella" thread because the only way you get rid of Sully is if torts is gone also. We all knew that anyway.

Albert Einstein once said "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results". Sullys PP scheme is obviously insane. They have seemingly done nothing to change the already abysmal powerplay. I think it gets a lot worse before it gets better, then maybe, just maybe we will see some changes. But that likely will not be in the form of coaching personnel.

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02-06-2013, 02:11 AM
  #103
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I like Del Zotto on the rush, but he's TERRIBLE on the point on the PP. Just play Richards and Stralman on the point

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02-06-2013, 03:11 AM
  #104
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Three things to rectify the power play;

1.) Please stop having one player at the side of the goal, or, worse, behind;

2.) Have two players screen the goalie;

3.) And this is also true on even strength: why is it that when one player goes towards the net, no one goes to the other side? If you see someone going to the right, go to the ****ing left!

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02-06-2013, 06:33 AM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
I think so
I'll take it a step further.

If Tortorella is un willing to make THAT move, then I am starting to feel that maybe HE (Torts) should go as well.

You can't know that there is a problem here and be so beligerant in your loyalties to a person that change is not made for the betterment of the team.

If Torts is not willing to make that change, then Sather has to take that decision out of his hands and remove them both.

The lack of a functioning PP and an overall missing offensive scheme since he's been here have been appaling. The fact that we have addressed the players portion of that problem leads me to one reason it's still not fixed...Coaching.

I like what Torts has done accountability wise and what he has done to instill a sense of commitment to getting the job done defensively, but without a clue on what to do in the offensive zone I fear that he has a major hole in his style and it's hurting the teams chances at winning.

Either get rid of Sully, or bring in a PP consultant. Failure to do one of the two, in my opinion, is grounds for removal.


Last edited by pld459666: 02-06-2013 at 08:41 AM.
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Old
02-06-2013, 07:18 AM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GordonGecko View Post
"[I][COLOR="DimGray"]

"Mike Sullivan is in charge of the Rangers power play, and he creates all strategies that have been used on the Rangers man-advantages."
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/5...ish-power-play


[/url]
I wouldn't quote anything from bleacher report. That place has like high school and college students writing for them, its pretty much all opinionated. Its a joke.

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Old
02-06-2013, 08:21 AM
  #107
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Yes please! Fire his ass... I'm tired of this ****. I literally say to myself EVERYTIME we got a PP something like: ''Aw ****... we're not gonna score, yet again... I wish I could bet against the Rangers PP 'cause it's awful''. We get 5 on 3s. 5 vs 4s for 4 minutes and we can't create ****. It doesn't matter who we bring in on the ice. They can't score on the PP. That tells me something is wrong with the coaching.

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02-06-2013, 08:49 AM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
This thread is a great example of why these boards suck. Mike Sullivan is a highly regarded assistant coach who is more likely to leave the team because he's offered a head coaching gig than because he gets fired.
Because he's been so successful as a Head Coach that teams are just lining up to hire him away.

There's a reason he hasn't had a HC job since getting the ax up in Beantown back 05-06

Lets look deeper.

The League average for PP back in 05-06 was 17.68%

The Bruins sported a 14.83% almost a full three % points less.

The league averaged 253 goals against, the bruins gave up 266

The league averaged 253 goals scored, the bruins scored 230

If there's one thing that I am certain from these stats is that Mike Sullivan is NOT a good HC

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02-06-2013, 08:59 AM
  #109
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Anyone else ok with cleaning house and rebuilding? For christ's sake the rookies have contributed more then the veterans at this point.

Let's bring up the entire Whale team and send everone down except Kreider, Miller, Nash and Gabby.

Sorry, I am losing my mind after last night's game.

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Old
02-06-2013, 09:24 AM
  #110
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The Rangers PP is predictable. That is all there is to it.

It was predictable with Jagr as the focus. And having Gabby and now Nash as the focus has not changed a thing and it became crystal clear in last nights game when the Staal/Kreider/Miller PP combo had the best scoring opportunity on that tic tac toe play that had every Devil defender spinning on their heels.

This notion that the PP has to run through one person, the most skilled guy, is too readable.

The predicatbility:

-increases poke through PK breakaways
-causes too few shots where reason suggests dirty goals are just as vital as the skilled ones
-enables defences to keep us on the perimiter and double team the focal point of a set play. (Nash, Gaborki, Jagr)
-helps the goalie cut his angles down, chose his prefered positioning, and dictate where he wants us to shoot the puck on net with decoy openings.

Combine all that and NHL PK units will eat our PP for lunch. Predictability put's the opposing PK in control of our PP, not our players who are running it. It cut's down the already slim NHL scoring percentages.

I'm not saying "set plays" are not nessesary. The Greztky blue line curl to a streaking Leetch was brilliant.... till teams caught on. It's no different in Basketball with constant iso plays. The "set plays" become 100% more effective and utilze top talent when they are not relied on 100% of the time. There has to be consistant chaos, or percieved chaos, with "set skilled playes" peppered in.

I would like to think NHL coaches would get that but apparently the tenured history of our PP going back over a decade now didctates that it must not be that easy of a concept to grasp bcause frankly these players are smart and skilled but ultimatly have to play to the plans the coach gives them. The NHL isn't club hockey. There is a chain of command and either the players shrug it off in the locker room and sodlier on as they are told...or they stop listening to the coach, mutainy, and then his arse is put to the coals.

(which makes me think now, was Sully the assistant in TB when Tort's was let go there too? It would be a shame if Torts was let go twice because of his loyalty to his friend when it seams the rest of the teams functions are fine. The players in TB quit on the coaching staff then which lead to Torts being fired but the majority of the team post-firing all said the loved having him as a coach so...maybe it wasn't Torts then either?)


Last edited by x BEUKEBOOM x: 02-06-2013 at 09:29 AM.
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Old
02-06-2013, 10:13 AM
  #111
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What I notice on the PP is that there's too much deliberation before doing anything. I don't know if that's the result of coaching, fear of making a mistake (and by extension the coaching staff), or what, but if the players just said 'eff it, I'm going to do what I think is right" it might improve the PP tremendously. Too much thinking prior to doing anything.

The other thing I notice is that the manner in which the players are positioned doesn't create a whole lot of space for the shooters and doesn't particularly bother the goalie. It seems, once we're set up, we have a 2-man point up on the blue-line, two forwards hovering in the area of the faceoff circles and one forward near the crease (usually on the doorstep looking, presumably, for a stuff in). They also don't move a whole lot once they're set up.

I know that none of the coaching staff is reading this, but when you have an exceptional passer like Richards (which he is) and a very skilled sniper like Gaborik and the long-reach/soft-hands of Nash, it seems to me you'd want to have more of a 1-3-1 PP set-up. Richards should be the only guy up high, Gaborik should be floating between the slot and the corner, and Nash should be squarely positioned in front of the net (and eventually Cally). Instead of having a system designed to allow for shots from our point man to get through to the net, we should be asking our best passer to find a player in space for a shot, instead of asking our best passer to fire off one timers. At least that's what I'd try.

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02-06-2013, 10:48 AM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
Because he's been so successful as a Head Coach that teams are just lining up to hire him away.

There's a reason he hasn't had a HC job since getting the ax up in Beantown back 05-06

Lets look deeper.

The League average for PP back in 05-06 was 17.68%

The Bruins sported a 14.83% almost a full three % points less.

The league averaged 253 goals against, the bruins gave up 266

The league averaged 253 goals scored, the bruins scored 230

If there's one thing that I am certain from these stats is that Mike Sullivan is NOT a good HC
A head coach is only as good as his team's powerplay percentage? What a crock of ****. You know he led the Bruins to a division win and 104 pts one year, right?

As for his next job:
http://snyrangersblog.com/category/mike-sullivan/

I'm right, you're wrong, the end.

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:49 AM
  #113
pld459666
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
A head coach is only as good as his team's powerplay percentage? What a crock of ****. You know he led the Bruins to a division win and 104 pts one year, right?

As for his next job:
http://snyrangersblog.com/category/mike-sullivan/

I'm right, you're wrong, the end.
I know what he did in his first year with a club he inherited.

I also know what he followed that up with.

I further know that he hasn't gotten a HC job since.

That tells me alot more than your opinion.

The link means nothing.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:06 PM
  #114
Kel Varnsen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
I know what he did in his first year with a club he inherited.

I also know what he followed that up with.

I further know that he hasn't gotten a HC job since.

That tells me alot more than your opinion.

The link means nothing.
The link that shows significant NHL interest in Mike Sullivan as a head coach shows nothing about the NHL's interest in Mike Sullivan as a head coach? Get your head out of your ass, man up, and admit you were dead wrong.

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02-06-2013, 12:14 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by toewsintangibles View Post
I like Del Zotto on the rush, but he's TERRIBLE on the point on the PP. Just play Richards and Stralman on the point
Yeah, at this point I'd take DZ off the PP. You can't say "Del Zotto shot," with it being followed by "wide." I'd rather see Girardi back there. At least he gets shots/passes through and if the lane to the net's closed off, he'll toss it off the end boards. I'm seeing Gabby and Nash holding the puck too much on the PP and Gabby is ALWAYS receiving passes on his backhand. Never in position to fire one off the pass. Ugh.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:17 PM
  #116
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It may be the players' fault. But at the same time, I've seen a point-pairing of DZ-Girardi.
And they were each on their correct side (DZ on the left, G in the right)
I don't like Girardi in the PP, but why are they not in their off sides? There's not even a chance for a one-timer if they're positioned like that. And this falls in the coaching.

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02-06-2013, 12:32 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
The link that shows significant NHL interest in Mike Sullivan as a head coach shows nothing about the NHL's interest in Mike Sullivan as a head coach? Get your head out of your ass, man up, and admit you were dead wrong.
So much interest that they waited to hire Hartley?

FROM THE EFFING SWISS LEAGUE?



you are the one with his head up his ass.

to funny

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02-06-2013, 12:39 PM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Sting View Post
because even a great coaching mind can't make up for poor execution.
Bingo bango bongo, spot on.

Two things I always see in Ranger PP's that roster turnover usually brings - everyone over passes to not appear to be selfish or to employ somekind of fake out that never works, and we overuse our aging guys, Richards on the point for example. Just PLAY HOCKEY ! Look for the openings, and use your instincts. Too many times our players are trying too hard to make a heady play, and some of them don't have the head for it.

Perry Pearn, aka Ronnie TLD, asst coach with Winnipeg now, they are 11th on the PP.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:55 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
So much interest that they waited to hire Hartley?

FROM THE EFFING SWISS LEAGUE?



you are the one with his head up his ass.

to funny
Yeah, you know better than the reporters who cover this stuff for a living.

Go put on your tinfoil hat, because those in power are just out to trick you.

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02-06-2013, 12:56 PM
  #120
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ive been saying to fire him since end of last year...he is garbage

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02-06-2013, 12:59 PM
  #121
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The time to fire this guy has long since passed .

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02-06-2013, 01:06 PM
  #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
Yeah, you know better than the reporters who cover this stuff for a living.

Go put on your tinfoil hat, because those in power are just out to trick you.
funny that all of that interest has gotten him how many HC jobs?

How about you drum up ONE article that shows that he was offered A HC job in the last 7 years.

I'll wait.....

Meanwhile re-treads and rookies get HC jobs all over the NHL. But Sully is SOOOOOvalued throughout the NHL.

Talk about tinfoil hats

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02-06-2013, 01:22 PM
  #123
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Cerny says Sullivan is responsible for the PP

Jim Cerny ‏@JimCerny

Mike Sullivan RT @akg414xls: @JimCerny Jim There seems to be some confusion among fans. Which coach is responsible for the PP ?

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02-06-2013, 01:24 PM
  #124
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While even last season our PP was atrocious, the PK was great, so what gives now? The lack of personal?

In the pp we have so much trouble gaining the zone and make hurried passes and shots that are often blocked and intercepted. Sounds like player's nerve (which might be a symptom of bad play) but at the same time I can't help but feel a fresh perspective might energize the team... the same way it did for LA, WSH, and Anaheim last year (only we keep torts and dump Sullivan).

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02-06-2013, 01:27 PM
  #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Sting View Post
Maybe Mike Sullivan should be fired (he never struck me as a particularly thorough x's-and-o's guy), but is it his fault that these people simply can't make quick, on-target tape-to-tape passes?

At this point, this is a club with above-average skill. Maybe not up and down the line up, but certainly top heavy with it, which should translate to the power play. It is mindboggling that they are such a poor passing team. Worse teams, much worse teams, seem to have more chemistry offensively than this team.

The guy behind the bench running the PP is surely responsible for developing some sort of scheme for these players to follow, but NHL players shouldn't need anyone to tell them the basic tenets of a power play (or offense in general): keep moving your feet, keep moving the puck, and open space and time will avail themselves to you. Get defenders out of position, and you'll create high quality scoring chances. These aren't the braindead Scott Gomezs or Olli Jokinens of the league, these are mostly players with proven prowess in the decision making aspect of the sport.

The skaters are slow, their passes are frequently a moment too late, a couple of inches off target, or simply the wrong pass to the wrong player or area of the ice at the wrong time.

Renney's buddy who looked like Ronnie the Limo Driver couldn't solve this problem, Sully can't solve it. I don't know who the answer is, because even a great coaching mind can't make up for poor execution.
Regarding the PP, the absence of a triggerman on the point is/has been a huge problem. I think theres added pressure to make the perfect play without the benefit of a guy on the back end who can bomb it. How many times do you see a stagnant powerplay get the puck back to the point for a big shot and good things happen?

The answer isnt on the roster right now. Maybe Sather can pull a rabbit out of his hat and find a 3rd pairing defenseman capable of that in one trade. Im thinking something similar to the Brian McCabe deal.

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