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Xbox One / PS4 Discussion

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:14 AM
  #51
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Pass, hello Ps4 and WiiU

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:45 AM
  #52
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Always online?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Does that mean if I'm playing a single player game, and my connection drops for 5 minutes, I can't play (and will lose my progress)?

Or if a kid takes their system to their grandparents place, who don't have internet, their system is useless?

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:53 AM
  #53
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I was actually considering a 720 because I figure the bro-in-law will get one. Not thrilled with these rumors of trying to kill the used game market and always online stuff, though. I'll wait and see what PS4 does, but might just stick with the U.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:15 PM
  #54
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Always online is a joke. Not that I ever play either my PS3 or 360 in an area without internet in this day and age except when moving and having to wait for an installer.

But anything that renders a 400 dollar investment useless is deplorable.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:15 PM
  #55
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Microsoft's problem always seems to be that they design things for the American market, not taking into account that more than half the stuff they hype up that isn't a game doesn't work in other regions.

I was never at any point going to buy a 720 (just like I'd never buy an original Xbox or a 360) but they are really stumbling around. Trying to capture the casual market may work, but the casual game market is always so fickle and will turn it's back on you when the next big thing comes out (See: Wii). If they are stupid enough to go down this route, I really hope Sony doesn't follow suit.

As for the "it can't play used games!", well, that was always coming. It is also inevitable, so might as well get it over with. With that said though, going about it this way (requiring it to always be online, directly attacking the market instead of letting it die on its own) is probably the wrong way to go about it. The system better come with an offline mode that you can use for gaming, or live better be going free, because forcing Xbox live onto people may not be the best idea. Especially when it's becoming more and more apparent that Live is a nickel and dime deal a company uses to block off things a consumer can get for free if they have any tech knowledge.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:24 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Orpheus View Post
Microsoft's problem always seems to be that they design things for the American market, not taking into account that more than half the stuff they hype up that isn't a game doesn't work in other regions.

I was never at any point going to buy a 720 (just like I'd never buy an original Xbox or a 360) but they are really stumbling around. Trying to capture the casual market may work, but the casual game market is always so fickle and will turn it's back on you when the next big thing comes out (See: Wii). If they are stupid enough to go down this route, I really hope Sony doesn't follow suit.

As for the "it can't play used games!", well, that was always coming. It is also inevitable, so might as well get it over with. With that said though, going about it this way (requiring it to always be online, directly attacking the market instead of letting it die on its own) is probably the wrong way to go about it. The system better come with an offline mode that you can use for gaming, or live better be going free, because forcing Xbox live onto people may not be the best idea. Especially when it's becoming more and more apparent that Live is a nickel and dime deal a company uses to block off things a consumer can get for free if they have any tech knowledge.
Funny part is game companies will make less money without Used games. I buy so many used games and buy DLC for them. I would never buy those games for full price. Not even a chance.

The online pass for used games was perfect.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:26 PM
  #57
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I'm sure PS4 will also have the same "no second hand games" policy, which just sucks.

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02-06-2013, 12:32 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Kitten Mittons View Post
I'm sure PS4 will also have the same "no second hand games" policy, which just sucks.
Meh. It'll save me money. I have about 200 (I'd say about 140 used) PS3 games.. and I've played about 40 of them.. and probably only about 15 of them frequently.

No used games = a lot of saved money for me. Especially considering all the DLC I bought for them. I should probably should be thanking the gaming companies rather than hating on them.

Not to mention, used games was a good way for me to try out a series. I would never have tried Uncharted, despite reviews, unless I saw it used. I did.. I ended up buying Part 3 brand new with all DLC, then I bought the Jak & Daxter series because I fell in love with the company, and I plan to buy The Last of Us.

Used games aren't the devil gaming companies make them out to be.

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Old
02-06-2013, 12:53 PM
  #59
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Meh. It'll save me money. I have about 200 (I'd say about 140 used) PS3 games.. and I've played about 40 of them.. and probably only about 15 of them frequently.

No used games = a lot of saved money for me. Especially considering all the DLC I bought for them. I should probably should be thanking the gaming companies rather than hating on them.

Not to mention, used games was a good way for me to try out a series. I would never have tried Uncharted, despite reviews, unless I saw it used. I did.. I ended up buying Part 3 brand new with all DLC, then I bought the Jak & Daxter series because I fell in love with the company, and I plan to buy The Last of Us.

Used games aren't the devil gaming companies make them out to be.
As I said in another thread, companies will need to be very careful if they go into these waters. They'll need to offer good demos of their games as well as good sales on their digital stores so they encourage people to take shots on things while they are cheap (think a console version of steam sales). If that happens, I don't think this will be that big of a deal. But if it doesnt, its just going to drive people who dont buy games at full price to wait even longer for a game to be cheap enough to buy it.

I know what you mean with Uncharted though, I didn't buy it used but I did pick it up in one of those controller + game bundles, and I fell in love with the series from that.

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02-06-2013, 01:32 PM
  #60
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I think they no used game thing will keep game prices high for a longer time since they'll be no incentive to bring the prices down to compete with used sales. Sort of like the old NES games. They stayed at $50 for like a year or longer after their release. With some games the price never dropped. I think you'll see the big games like GTA stay at a high price point while yearly games like NHL,Madden,COD stay high for the first 6 months then slowly drop.

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02-06-2013, 02:26 PM
  #61
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Then I guess I'll just be a year behind the times. No way I pay full price for a game unless it's a tried and true series for me like GTA or NHL.

Although if PS Plus can continue to offer deals the way they do, I'll check things out that way. I would have never bought Tiger Woods 13 if they didn't put it on sale to 10 bucks. Turns out I love the game...

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Old
02-06-2013, 02:31 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Kitten Mittons View Post
I'm sure PS4 will also have the same "no second hand games" policy, which just sucks.
Could be a MASSIVE selling point for them if Sony says "we ARE going to allow the used games market to survive". It will be a nice way to differentiate the two systems and would certainly boost sales for PS4. Never happen though since this is being driven by the software developers.

Killing the used games market is going to HAMMER the game retailers (EB, Gamestop). They make buckets of money from used games while offering a nice service to their customers.

How long do you think it will take for some enterprising computer savvy people to figure a way around whatever code M$ is going to use on their games and open up a massive black market for used games? I bet they will have the code written before the machine is on sale to the public.

As for the "always online" thing, that is ridiculous. What if your internet connection drops? What if you are on a strict bandwidth plan? What if you have your gaming system on another TV and don't have wi-fi and don't have an internet connection in that room? What if you simply have no desire to have your gaming system continuously connected to the internet?

Honestly, I think it's one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.

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Old
02-06-2013, 02:36 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
Meh. It'll save me money. I have about 200 (I'd say about 140 used) PS3 games.. and I've played about 40 of them.. and probably only about 15 of them frequently.

No used games = a lot of saved money for me. Especially considering all the DLC I bought for them. I should probably should be thanking the gaming companies rather than hating on them.

Not to mention, used games was a good way for me to try out a series. I would never have tried Uncharted, despite reviews, unless I saw it used. I did.. I ended up buying Part 3 brand new with all DLC, then I bought the Jak & Daxter series because I fell in love with the company, and I plan to buy The Last of Us.

Used games aren't the devil gaming companies make them out to be.
That is what is great about used games. I'm NEVER going to cough up full price on something I am not crazy about just to "give it a chance" because I've heard good things.

Like you, I bought Uncharted because it was used and ended up buying the next two at full price. Used games are a gateway to other games. I understand software companies being upset about used games, they make no money and the retailers make a bucket full. There had to be a different alternative to getting rid of them all together.

I think a fair compromise would have been to have the retailer and the developer share in the profit of used games.

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Old
02-06-2013, 02:39 PM
  #64
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See, my thing is that stores like Gamespot and EB Games really need to prepare for the death of the Used Game market anyways. It's been dead on PC for ages and will die within this generation for consoles because of things moving towards digital. However, the correct way to go about it is to just let it die, rather than force people down this route and have them kick and scream the whole way.

The used game thing is a market that would have died given another 5 years or so anyway, however, the always online thing people should be much more peeved about. Even Steam, an always online PC service, offers offline play.

I do see one joy of going all digital if the platform holders are smart: Allow digital codes to be a thing to download games and you'll see amazon, GOG and all those websites go to war with each other even more if console games enter the same ring as current PC games. It benefits the consumer too, because with such heavy competition there's always frequent sales.

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Old
02-06-2013, 03:28 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unifiedtheory View Post
Could be a MASSIVE selling point for them if Sony says "we ARE going to allow the used games market to survive". It will be a nice way to differentiate the two systems and would certainly boost sales for PS4. Never happen though since this is being driven by the software developers.

Killing the used games market is going to HAMMER the game retailers (EB, Gamestop). They make buckets of money from used games while offering a nice service to their customers.

How long do you think it will take for some enterprising computer savvy people to figure a way around whatever code M$ is going to use on their games and open up a massive black market for used games? I bet they will have the code written before the machine is on sale to the public.

As for the "always online" thing, that is ridiculous. What if your internet connection drops? What if you are on a strict bandwidth plan? What if you have your gaming system on another TV and don't have wi-fi and don't have an internet connection in that room? What if you simply have no desire to have your gaming system continuously connected to the internet?

Honestly, I think it's one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.
It seems Amazon is already aiming to put some sort of system in place for movies, music, and ebooks. Doesn't seem like a huge step towards finding a way to incorporate games into this as well. Maybe Amazon forces the move and demands the ability to be included in video games if they are sold on Amazon's site. If there's money to be made in this market, I have to expect someone to find a way to leverage it.

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Old
02-06-2013, 03:42 PM
  #66
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And goodbye Xbox for me. I refuse to buy a system that must be online to play. I don't even really buy used games but simply on principle, I will not purchase that machine.

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02-06-2013, 04:07 PM
  #67
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The internet isn't reliable enough around the world to make everyone be online all the time. In Edinburgh it wouldn't be a problem, but when I lived in a collection of houses called Torgormack which was a few miles outside Beauly which is a few miles outside Inverness it was always going down for hours at a time. Would be incredibly frustrating. The reason I use place names is so you can check it on google maps if you like, because it's hardly the back end of nowhere.

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02-06-2013, 04:11 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Orpheus View Post
good sales on their digital stores so they encourage people to take shots on things while they are cheap (think a console version of steam sales).
There is almost no doubt this will happen eventually, but the question is when. I suspect it gets worse before it gets better. You'll see this type of clamp down first, without a large scale digital store type replacement right away. The only question left for me is, does it happen during this next generation or after this one. I suspect at least the first two years of this gen will be pretty bad far as either used games or digital games.

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02-06-2013, 04:17 PM
  #69
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Absolutely terrible. Was considering getting the new consoles at launch, but not anymore.

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Old
02-06-2013, 04:19 PM
  #70
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No way that the always online thing for Xbox is actually happening . Their sales would be horrible . Think of all the people that can't afford or just don't care for online gaming . There's goes 1/3 of the people that bought an xbox 360.

The no used games is also stupid too , I won't be spending half to amount on games that I did for the 360.

2 horrible things so far , makes me want to buy one..................

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02-06-2013, 04:35 PM
  #71
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Sony already patented something to stop used game sales as well.

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Old
02-06-2013, 04:57 PM
  #72
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Sony already patented something to stop used game sales as well.
Yes, but as I've said, Sony has patented stuff like that in the PS2 days and still hasn't used it.

For what it's worth, Edge is sticking by this story and also added a new article claiming Sony is not following suit. They also claim that third party devs pushed for this and Microsoft cracked and Sony didnt.

Article: http://www.edge-online.com/features/...playstation-4/

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02-06-2013, 05:05 PM
  #73
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There's no way it will be always online, its clever marketing so people are happy when its not included.

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Old
02-06-2013, 05:08 PM
  #74
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There's no way it will be always online, its clever marketing so people are happy when its not included.
The second article (one i just posted) suggests that it'll be unobtrusive, such as pinging a server when you put a game in, making sure its legal and you own it, then letting you play it. Even this would have a large amount of issues though.

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02-06-2013, 05:43 PM
  #75
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The second article (one i just posted) suggests that it'll be unobtrusive, such as pinging a server when you put a game in, making sure its legal and you own it, then letting you play it. Even this would have a large amount of issues though.
That doesn't sound as bad (pinging a server), but like you said it would still cause problems. I'll wait for official confirmation before jumping to any conclusions. However, if the new Xbox really does require you be online all the time I might have to jump ship to the PS4. Especially if one allows used games while the other doesn't.

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