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Dion Phaneuf

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Old
01-29-2013, 08:40 PM
  #126
silentprotector
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Chreider View Post
Coyle+Hackett+1st

Cullen might have to come your way to make salary work. Even then you'd still need to keep 1.5M or so. Want a 3rd to do that?

........ signed on the dotted line!

Maybe make a bigger blockbuster by adding kessel from Leafs and Dumba and Granlund from wild!

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Old
01-30-2013, 12:11 AM
  #127
Drydenwasthebest
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I have always wanted Phaneuf in a Habs jersey. How about:

Eller, Kaberle (salary purposes), Diaz, 2013 2nd

How does that sound in terms of value?

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Old
01-30-2013, 12:38 AM
  #128
Phion Keneuf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drydenwasthebest View Post
I have always wanted Phaneuf in a Habs jersey. How about:

Eller, Kaberle (salary purposes), Diaz, 2013 2nd

How does that sound in terms of value?
It sounds bad.

We won't trade Phaneuf to the habs. Period.

Would be a huge mistake

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Old
01-30-2013, 12:39 AM
  #129
Phion Keneuf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Chreider View Post
Coyle+Hackett+1st

Cullen might have to come your way to make salary work. Even then you'd still need to keep 1.5M or so. Want a 3rd to do that?
Swap Coyle with Brodin. What's up with Hackett? Still has #1 potential in your opinion?

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Old
01-30-2013, 01:43 AM
  #130
EucaLEAFtys
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Originally Posted by Pyrophorus View Post
So in 48 games, the Leafs will learn nothing?

I don't think top 5 is in the cards, since the Leafs will eventually adjust to the system.
This is a combination of new system, plus no training camp.
I never saod that they wouldn't learn anything.

What I have been saying (essentally) is that the talent level of the team hasn't really changed much, let alone significantly enough to make anyone honestly believe that this team has a snowball's chance in Hell of making it into the play-offs this season.

When you combine a low-talent team, a new system, and a shortened season with no real training camp, the odds of the Leafs duplicating last season's achievement are quite high.

The point is, this team just doesn't have the talent to be a play-off contender, and if they don't rebuild through the Draft, they probably never will be a legitimate contender for anything other than a top-5 draft pick.

The overall talent level on this team simply HAS to improve, and the best way to do that is through a complete rebuild. The "old guard" of Phaneuf, Kessel, etc. have to be traded to ensure that the Leaf organization has the best chance to gain the high-end assets they desperately need to secure a brighter, sustainable future.


Last edited by EucaLEAFtys: 01-30-2013 at 04:49 AM.
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Old
01-30-2013, 02:12 AM
  #131
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Dion would make a wonderful 2nd pairing D-Man on any team. If he could hit the net he makes a solid contribution to 1st PP - unfortunately his accuracy is extremely poor.

If Brian Burke didn't rush and make him Captain I would lament losing him at any cost - unfortunately thanks to B.B there is no happy ending in Toronto for Dion - he just doesn't have the mental stamina to withstand a demotion the size/scale that would be required to get the best out of him here IE Stripped of Captaincy - Demoted to Second Pairing + 2nd PP Unit.

IMO he would become toxic - more than he already is - and thats the last thing Toronto would want around its emerging young stars (Kadri/Gardner/Reilly/Frattin etc)

In summation: A Veteran Team that doesn't tollerate his foolishness would do wonders for him - his price tag would eventually look like a bargain if given the right situation to put his head down and concentrate on the game of hockey.

Dallas comes to mind as an ideal destination.

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Old
01-30-2013, 02:15 AM
  #132
EucaLEAFtys
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Originally Posted by MastuhNinks View Post
Phaneuf was great in a shutdown role last year playing literally some of the toughest minutes in the entire league. Phaneuf being used in a shutdown role is not the problem, 27 year old career AHLer Kostka is.

People who think Phaneuf doesn't have a strong defensive game are ignorant. And trading him would be just plain stupid. What does the Leafs defense look like without him? Kostka, Gunnar, Liles, Gardiner, Komisarek and Franson? Yikes.
The thing is, he's NOT a defensive defenceman, nor does he think that way. He has always been an OFFENSIVE defenceman (until recently).

The fact that he's supposedly the best defenceman on the team clearly illustrates how poor the defence corp is and how desperately it needs to be improved. It also clearly indicates that Carlyle has little to no faith in guys like Gunnarsson, Franson, etc. to be able to get the job done defensively.

Furthermore, this proves even more how badly this team (and organization) needs a complete rebuild. Moving him (and others) out now will help to facilitate this.

Phaneuf's abilities (such as they are) are being wasted in Toronto on a sub-standard Leaf team. As such, Keeping him mired in an atmosphere of mediocrity when you can get a good return for him in a trade is what's stupid.
.

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Old
01-30-2013, 04:09 AM
  #133
EucaLEAFtys
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Originally Posted by Hennig View Post
I don't need your help. I fully understand that this is a young team and their will be bumps in the road. We looked pretty good in the Buffalo and Pittsburgh games, this team just needs to become more consistent. Phaneuf has been a monster this year defensively, excluding a couple minutes in the Rangers game. So why trade him? Our defense would be a mess without Dion, and would be the softest d core in the league easily.

So what exactly do you want to do? Trade all of our older players, who arent even that old in the grand scheme of things for picks and prospects? Wait 5 more years for them to develop then trade them for more picks and prospects? Rinse and repeat?

The Marlies have implemented a winning culture which will pay dividends in the future. Look at the senators after Bingamton won, if I remember correctly the senators made the playoffs the year after. Instead of throwing everything out the drain, let this team try their hardest to make the post season, which I think they have the best chance of doing in the past 8 years. Wether you believe that or not it doesn't matter.

I know this "sky is falling" mentality is popular with you and some other less intelligent leaf fans, but atleast wait till the games hit double digits for you to put your tin foil hats on.
"Tin-foil hat".. funny. I guess you enjoy watching this low-talent, pathetically less-than-mediocre team futilely struggle toward a goal that they can't possibly achive at this current point in time with the godawful roster they currently employ. Each to his own, I guess.

My opinion isn't a "sky is falling" mentality either; it's the stark realization born from watching this team, year after painful year, continue to use a team-building method that has consistently failed to produce any form of sustainable success over the past 4+ decades. Seriously.. how much longer does this crap have to go on before someone in a position of power realizes that that current method of team-building they're using DOESN'T WORK?!? Aren't 4+ decades of this crap enough?

Expecting mainly averagequality prospects to eventually graduate from the Marlies and be impact players on the Leafs is just mediocrity perpetuated ad mauseum. In fact, most of the current Marlies will never even get a good sniff at the NHL, despite how horrible the Leafs are. Regardless of the culture on the Marlies, even they aren't going to win anything without having several high-end prospects (with legitimate NHL potential) developing on the team.

If I recall correctly, when the Binghanton Senators won the Calder Cup a couple seasons back, the Ottawa Senators were in a better position to make the play-offs last season because they already had more legitimate NHL talent on their roster than the Leafs have had in any of the past 8 or so years!

And what have the Leafs gained from last season's Marlies team that's going to elevate them from a bottom-5 team last season to being a legitimate play-off team this season? Kadri? Fattin? Kostka?!? Yeah.. right.

Keeping the status quo will only perpetuate an endless cycle of mediocrity. The same thing applies to half-assed re-tooling efforts when there's virtually nothing in the minors to re-tool with. The Leafs have already got part of the eqation in place with a decent development program that's been established on their farm team. What they don't have is the other half of the equation: legitimate, high-end prospects wo can become top-line/top-;airing players at the NHL level. That is waht a properly-timed rebuild can do fairly quickly, if done correctly.

What I would love to see is this team "clean house" and finally acquirre the the high-end picks and prospects which can help to strengthen the foundation of this orgainzation and provide the bulk of the high-end talent the Leafs so desperately require to actually reach the play-offs and perhaps the Stanley Cup one day.

But to do that, the Leafs have to bite the bullet and commit to a rebuild. With an excellent Draft just around the corner, the Leafs would be idiots if they wated such a prime opportunity to cash in on all that high-lend talent by NOT trading the likes of Phaneuf, Kessel, and others who talents are currently being wasted on the Leafs anyway.

Capitaizing on other teams' needs now will eventually be more beneficial for the Leafs by giving them the wherewithal to improve more than keeping Phaneuf etal will. And I really don't care if it takes them another 3-5 years to properly rebuild this organization; I've been waiting for over 40 years to see this team win.. what's another 3-5 years if the desired outcome of becoming a legitimate, long-term play-off/Stanley Cup contender (a la Detroit) is achieved?

Not tomention, if the rebuild is done properly, it would only take 3-5 years to see it begin to bear fruit AND the develpment system would be much easier to sustain once the initial group of high-end prospects were gathered together and developing as a group, instead of a individuals.

I hope that's all clear enough for you to understand. If not, ohwell.. not my problem.

Face it.. what this team has done up to now HASN'T DONE SQUAT to prove that they're truly committed to winning; all they've done is maintain the current state of mediocrity surrounding this team and delay the inevitable. It's time for a proper rebuild!


Last edited by EucaLEAFtys: 01-30-2013 at 08:29 AM. Reason: Minor sentence re-structuring and an addition
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Old
01-30-2013, 07:05 AM
  #134
Rielly Good
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EucaLEAFtys View Post
"Tin-foil hat".. funny. I guess you enjoy watching this low-talent, pathetically less-than-mediocre team futilely struggle toward a goal that they can't possibly achive at this current point in time with the gosawful roster they currently employ. Each to his own, I guess.

Expecting mainly averagequality prospects to eventually graduate from the Marlies and be impact players on the Leafs is just mediocrity perpetuated ad mauseum. In fact, most of the current Marlies will never even get a good sniff at the NHL, despite how horrible the Leafs are. Regardless of the culture on the Marlies, even they aren't going to win anything without having several high-end prospects (with legitimate NHL potential) developing on the team.

If I recall correctly, when the Binghanton Senators won the Calder Cup a couple seasons back, the Ottawa Senators were in a better position to make the play-offs last season because they already had more legitimate NHL talent on their roster than the Leafs have had in any of the past 8 or so years!

And what have the Leafs gained from last season's Marlies team that's going to elevate them from a bottom-5 team last season to being a legitimate play-off team this season? Kadri? Fattin? Kostka?!? Yeah.. right.

Keeping the status quo will only perpetuate an endless cycle of mediocrity. The same thing applies to half-assed re-tooling efforts when there's virtually nothing in the minors to re-tool with. The Leafs have already got part of the eqation in place with a decent development program that's been established on their farm team. What they don't have is the other half of the equation: legitimate, high-end prospects wo can become top-line/top-;airing players at the NHL level. That is waht a properly-timed rebuild can do fairly quickly, if done correctly.

What I would love to see is this team "clean house" and finally acquirre the the high-end picks and prospects which can help to strengthen the foundation of this orgainzation and provide the bulk of the high-end talent the Leafs so desperately require to actually reach the play-offs and perhaps the Stanley Cup one day.

But to do that, the Leafs have to bite the bullet and commit to a rebuild. With an excellent Draft just around the corner, the Leafs would be idiots if they wated such a prime opportunity to cash in on all that high-lend talent by NOT trading the likes of Phaneuf, Kessel, and others who talents are currently being wasted on the Leafs anyway.

Capitaizing on other teams' needs now will eventually be more beneficial for the Leafs by giving them the wherewithal to improve more than keeping Phaneuf etal will. And I really don't care if it takes them another 3-5 years to properly rebuild this organization; I've been waiting for over 40 years to see this team win.. what's another 3-5 years if the desired outcome of becoming a legitimate, long-term play-off/Stanley Cup contender (a la Detroit) is achieved?

Not tomention, if the rebuild is done properly, it would only take 3-5 years to see it begin to bear fruit AND the develpment system would be much easier to sustain once the initial group of high-end prospects were gathered together and developing as a group, instead of a individuals.

I hope that's all clear enough for you to understand. If not, ohwell.. not my problem.

Face it.. what this team has done up to now HASN'T DONE SQUAT, except maintain the current state of mediocrity surrounding this team and delay the inevitable. It's time for a proper rebuild!
You done? lol

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Old
01-30-2013, 07:39 AM
  #135
EucaLEAFtys
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Originally Posted by Rielly Good View Post
You done? lol
Whatever, dude(tte). If you don't like what I've been posting here, then don't read or respond to it. Now run along, unless you actually have something intelligent to contribute.


Last edited by EucaLEAFtys: 01-30-2013 at 08:03 AM.
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Old
02-06-2013, 07:06 PM
  #136
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Bill Watters ‏@RealBillWatters - When you acquire "Building blocks"that you can't build upon,you must change blocks.Ovechkin,Kessel & Phaneuf are 3 such "Blocks"TML can move

Just wondering what Carolina would have to give up..
2013 1st, Jamie McBain and Victor Rask for Phaneuf?


Last edited by jeromeo87: 02-06-2013 at 07:16 PM.
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02-06-2013, 07:08 PM
  #137
CarvinSigX
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Why is Ovechkin in that list?

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02-06-2013, 07:20 PM
  #138
calcal798
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
Swap Coyle with Brodin. What's up with Hackett? Still has #1 potential in your opinion?
Brodin + Hackett + 1st?

Me like.

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Old
02-06-2013, 08:02 PM
  #139
Qward
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
Bill Watters ‏@RealBillWatters - When you acquire "Building blocks"that you can't build upon,you must change blocks.Ovechkin,Kessel &Phaneufare 3 such "Blocks"TML can move


Quote:
Originally Posted by CarvinSigX View Post
Why is Ovechkin in that list?
This is a valid question lol

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Old
02-06-2013, 08:05 PM
  #140
Phion Keneuf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
Bill Watters ‏@RealBillWatters - When you acquire "Building blocks"that you can't build upon,you must change blocks.Ovechkin,Kessel & Phaneuf are 3 such "Blocks"TML can move

Just wondering what Carolina would have to give up..
2013 1st, Jamie McBain and Victor Rask for Phaneuf?
Lol wtf?

Is Watters that dumb?

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02-06-2013, 08:13 PM
  #141
johnny_rudeboy
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This is a valid question lol
I just think he is a bad twitter. Do any one realistically believe that he believe that Ovi is a Leaf? No, of course not. I think he just pointed out that none of those players are good building blocks for a team. And he is right btw.

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