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02-06-2013, 02:02 PM
  #176
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Loved Ballard's play this season. Hopefully he keeps it up.

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02-06-2013, 03:05 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by VeteranNetPresence View Post
playing in a weak division, and our genius GM thought it would translate into the western conference happened. look at some of bouwmeester's goals in florida, and he is not able to do the same in calgary (sutter gave him the green light to do this so don't give me this coaching stuff)
Uh...The North West is arguably the worst division in the NHL. The NW and SE divisions are both bad.

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02-06-2013, 04:05 PM
  #178
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Big play to keep the puck in OT tongiht.
fo shizzle, that skate pass to Daniel is unreal! czech it...


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02-06-2013, 04:12 PM
  #179
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This thread needs a change of title...

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02-06-2013, 04:52 PM
  #180
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This thread needs a change of title...
I concur, and echo this statement...

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02-06-2013, 05:10 PM
  #181
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keith ballard is playing like a man possessed XD

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02-06-2013, 05:30 PM
  #182
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Ballard has been playing his best hockey as a Canucks to start this season. I'm glad to see him having some success because he seems like a good teammate and a heart and soul guy.

If he could switch to playing right-handed that would be especially great.

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02-06-2013, 11:12 PM
  #183
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http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/h...967/story.html

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After trying to be a player he is not, he is finally the player he needs to be for the Canucks.

“Part of the problem is I just was never really sure what I was supposed to do,” Ballard said Wednesday.

“I spent so much time last year on the mental side of things, working with a sports psychologist, because until I came here I never had any adversity in hockey. Going back to five years old, I just went out and played and didn’t worry about anything.

“I’ve put in so much work on the mental aspect of it that I feel like such a different person, on and off the ice. Coming into this year, I just felt like myself again.”

...

“What he has stopped doing is chasing the game all over the ice,” Canuck associate coach Rick Bowness said. “So now the game comes to him and he’s in control.”

Bowness, an assistant coach in Phoenix when Ballard began his NHL career with the Coyotes, remembers the defenceman when he was a minor-league prospect during the 2004-05 lockout.

“I’ve known Keith a long time,” Bowness said. “What I remember from Keith ... we saw an earnest kid who wanted to learn and wanted to work and wanted to do well. You never forget those guys. You know deep in their heart, they really want to do well. And you want to see them do well. I’ve got a lot of time for people like that.”

...

“My game fell apart for a year and it was a battle to get all that back,” Ballard said. “Last year, I focused on building my foundation back — being reliable and consistent and using my strengths. But I was very conservative last year. I wasn’t playing to just not make mistakes, but I wasn’t playing to make things happen. This year, we talked about taking that next step.”

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02-06-2013, 11:20 PM
  #184
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Outside of the quotes from Ballard, the spin of that article really irritates me. Our media guys are just completely clueless when it comes to watching and understanding hockey.

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02-06-2013, 11:39 PM
  #185
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The mental side of things seems to have been a long standing battle for Ballard going back to at least his college days.

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02-07-2013, 12:27 AM
  #186
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Outside of the quotes from Ballard, the spin of that article really irritates me. Our media guys are just completely clueless when it comes to watching and understanding hockey.
I agree totally. This quote really disturbs me:

“Part of the problem is I just was never really sure what I was supposed to do,” Ballard said Wednesday."

Why in the hell didn't one of the coaching staff tell him what he was supposed to do? This isn't the first article where Ballard has indicated that there wasn't much communicated from the coaching staff to him.

Also, despite being 'overpaid', would you take Komisarek instead? IMO his price is completely fair for a young mobile defenceman.


Last edited by mossey3535: 02-07-2013 at 12:46 AM.
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02-07-2013, 12:27 AM
  #187
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Good for Ballard... Been nothing but a great soldier for us the entire time regardless of his role. Would like nothing more than to see him succeed here.

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02-07-2013, 12:36 AM
  #188
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I am hoping the Ballard-Tanev pairing can keep things up, but their play has definitely been helped by the .982/.981 save % they are getting when they are on the ice. Granted they aren't getting much help offensively at the other end from the forwards they are on the ice with, but as a comparison Hamhuis has received .918 save % when he has been on the ice. That's a pretty substantial difference.

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02-07-2013, 12:41 AM
  #189
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Originally Posted by mossey3535 View Post
I agree totally. This quote really disturbs me:

“Part of the problem is I just was never really sure what I was supposed to do,” Ballard said Wednesday."

Why in the hell didn't one of the coaching staff tell him what he was supposed to do? This isn't the first article where Ballard has indicated that there wasn't much communicated from the coaching staff to him.
I dont take it as the coaching staff didnt tell. They most likely did and he did not understand.

The quote that I find more interesting is:

Quote:
“I spent so much time last year on the mental side of things, working with a sports psychologist, because until I came here I never had any adversity in hockey. Going back to five years old, I just went out and played and didn’t worry about anything.
Which based on what Ive read about him doesnt seem to be the case.


Maybe Ballards a bit clueless.

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02-07-2013, 12:43 AM
  #190
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Originally Posted by 94eleven View Post
I am hoping the Ballard-Tanev pairing can keep things up, but their play has definitely been helped by the .982/.981 save % they are getting when they are on the ice. Granted they aren't getting much help offensively at the other end from the forwards they are on the ice with, but as a comparison Hamhuis has received .918 save % when he has been on the ice. That's a pretty substantial difference.
Hamhuis is playing more,is facing better competition and more PK time isn't he?

Obviously Hamhuis has a better chance of being out for goals against than Ballard. And save % can depend on quality of shots so really using one stat like that tells us nothing at all.

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02-07-2013, 12:47 AM
  #191
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Originally Posted by 94eleven View Post
I am hoping the Ballard-Tanev pairing can keep things up, but their play has definitely been helped by the .982/.981 save % they are getting when they are on the ice. Granted they aren't getting much help offensively at the other end from the forwards they are on the ice with, but as a comparison Hamhuis has received .918 save % when he has been on the ice. That's a pretty substantial difference.
Maybe because the Ballard Tanev pairing have been better defensively to allow the .982/.981 save %?...

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02-07-2013, 12:53 AM
  #192
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Hamhuis is playing more,is facing better competition and more PK time isn't he?

Obviously Hamhuis has a better chance of being out for goals against than Ballard. And save % can depend on quality of shots so really using one stat like that tells us nothing at all.
Yeah. So many of these 'advanced metrics' essentially just boil down to an extravagant way of stat-watching. There are aspects of them that are interesting and worth taking a look at, but i don't see a whole lot of validity in many of them.

It's not baseball, there are so many factors at play in this game.

It's stuff like the above mentioned, but also stuff like the fact that SV% while on the ice can be pretty heavily influenced by the type of scoring chances a pairing is giving up. A high SV% on ice might indicate some flukey above average goaltending...but it could also just as easily indicate that high quality scoring opportunities are being limited and a lot of weak shots from the perimeter, due to quality defensive play.

The way some of these metrics are treated like gospel around here...it's like some folks watched 'Moneyball' one too many times.

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02-07-2013, 01:01 AM
  #193
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Originally Posted by 94eleven View Post
I am hoping the Ballard-Tanev pairing can keep things up, but their play has definitely been helped by the .982/.981 save % they are getting when they are on the ice. Granted they aren't getting much help offensively at the other end from the forwards they are on the ice with, but as a comparison Hamhuis has received .918 save % when he has been on the ice. That's a pretty substantial difference.
You are not wrong, but I think credit needs to be given to Ballard and Tanev for not allowing teams to get good shots away. They may not have the same quality of oppression however. And in the case of Hamhuis hes had KB3 and Edler who can be terrible at times.

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02-07-2013, 01:06 AM
  #194
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Yeah. So many of these 'advanced metrics' essentially just boil down to an extravagant way of stat-watching. There are aspects of them that are interesting and worth taking a look at, but i don't see a whole lot of validity in many of them.

It's not baseball, there are so many factors at play in this game.

It's stuff like the above mentioned, but also stuff like the fact that SV% while on the ice can be pretty heavily influenced by the type of scoring chances a pairing is giving up. A high SV% on ice might indicate some flukey above average goaltending...but it could also just as easily indicate that high quality scoring opportunities are being limited and a lot of weak shots from the perimeter, due to quality defensive play.

The way some of these metrics are treated like gospel around here...it's like some folks watched 'Moneyball' one too many times.
I don't think I said anywhere that it was the gospel, it was a piece of information I found interesting. I agree that it doesn't take into consideration the fact that Hamhuis plays better opposition, I didn't want to start calling Ballard and Tanev sheltered because I figured that would start a bigger ****storm. Last season behind one of the best tandems in the NHL Ballard got a .937 save% and Hamhuis got .927. So all I was trying to say was that I don't think .982 is sutainable and want people to keep that in mind if that pairing starts being on the ice for some more goals against.

Also these numbers are 5 v 5 so PP and PK aren't taken into consideration.

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02-07-2013, 01:18 AM
  #195
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The highest save % any defenseman who played at least 50 games last year had was .948. So unless they are going to be a record-breaking pairing, all I am saying is expect some regression.

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02-07-2013, 01:42 AM
  #196
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http://canucksarmy.com/2013/2/4/the-...n-player-usage

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This is a trend that Cam Charron began to point out last week, actually. The Keith Ballard - Chris Tanev pairing is playing a whole whack of minutes for the Canucks at even-strength, but they're doing so while playing entirely against the bottom end of opponent's rosters.

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02-07-2013, 01:42 AM
  #197
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I think it's a confluence of factors.

1)The obvious poor system fit. Ballard's high risk, puck rushing game just doesn't jive with the more measured, controlled, predictable style that this team embraces when they're on top of their games.

2)Injuries and lack of Confidence. You can practically see the guy second guessing himself out there. It just compounds the mistakes. And the injuries seem to crop up every time he looks like he might be turning a corner here.

3)He was never that great in the first place. It was my impression from the start, that Ballard was a real fringe top-4 guy on a quality team. He was a high-risk 2nd pairing type d-man on a bad team. A glorified offensive defenceman with a relatively limited offensive skillset. I mean, the guy was part of an Olli Jokinen trade not that long ago. Essentially, Ballard is to 'top-4 defencemen', what Jokinen is top 'top-6 center'. I think the #s and the big contract mislead some people into thinking he was something more than he was.


That said, i don't think he's been as terrible as many people seem to think. Value for the dollar wise, yes, he's absolutely atrocious...but he's still a much better blueliner than the Barkers/Vandermeers/Alberts of the world, and has more ability to step up to a larger role in an emergency than those guys, by far.

But Ballard suffers from the same fatal flaw that Bad-Bieksa does. When Ballard ****s up...it's extremely noticeable. His high-risk style means that when he's wrong...he's often really wrong, and it leads to very prominent, glaring mistakes. People seem to latch onto this sort of highly visible screw up and remember the glaring mistakes above all else. For better or worse, Ballard is never going to be a 'fly under the radar' type player.



Yeah. There was a lot of accusations of Grabner fanboyism and the like being tossed around when posters weren't overly keen on that deal when it went down. And in balance, it's really not the end of the world that the deal didn't pan out, as we ditched a bad contract, and only gave up a guy in Grabner who likely would never have caught on in Vancouver under AV, and a relatively weak late 1st rounder. But it's still funny to think back to the backlash there was against those who weren't overly sold on Ballard and the price at the time.
Great summary - very nicely put. I just think it's a shame they haven't found a way to utilize his talents in some form in the best way possible - isn't that what coaches are supposed to do?

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02-07-2013, 01:45 AM
  #198
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I don't think I said anywhere that it was the gospel, it was a piece of information I found interesting. I agree that it doesn't take into consideration the fact that Hamhuis plays better opposition, I didn't want to start calling Ballard and Tanev sheltered because I figured that would start a bigger ****storm. Last season behind one of the best tandems in the NHL Ballard got a .937 save% and Hamhuis got .927. So all I was trying to say was that I don't think .982 is sutainable and want people to keep that in mind if that pairing starts being on the ice for some more goals against.

Also these numbers are 5 v 5 so PP and PK aren't taken into consideration.
Sorry. I wasn't directing that specifically at you or anything. You definitely made good mention of some of the weaknesses of the stats there. And in regards to what you're saying about eventually coming back down to earth in terms of that stat...there's plenty of validity to that.


It's just something i've noticed a lot lately (the reliance on elaborate statistics as the ultimate measure of a player), and it seems fairly misguided to me in a lot of cases. And it often just ends up being something not particularly relevant to the actual play on the ice.

ie. That on ice SV% could (and as you said, likely will drop), leading to more goals while Ballard-Tanev are on the ice...but that kind of thing can happen almost entirely independent of the quality of their play.

And the idea that sooner or later, they're going to end up on the ice for a few more goals...seems fairly common sense. I don't feel like i need an advanced metric to tell me that.

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02-07-2013, 02:06 AM
  #199
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Sorry. I wasn't directing that specifically at you or anything. You definitely made good mention of some of the weaknesses of the stats there. And in regards to what you're saying about eventually coming back down to earth in terms of that stat...there's plenty of validity to that.


It's just something i've noticed a lot lately (the reliance on elaborate statistics as the ultimate measure of a player), and it seems fairly misguided to me in a lot of cases. And it often just ends up being something not particularly relevant to the actual play on the ice.

ie. That on ice SV% could (and as you said, likely will drop), leading to more goals while Ballard-Tanev are on the ice...but that kind of thing can happen almost entirely independent of the quality of their play.

And the idea that sooner or later, they're going to end up on the ice for a few more goals...seems fairly common sense. I don't feel like i need an advanced metric to tell me that.
It is common sense...however common sense doesn't usually dissuade the "OMG Ballard suckz again !!!111" crowd once that save % inevitably starts to drop. I was just trying to get out ahead of that by stating their save% and how they probably can't sustain it.

One "advanced stat" that points to how well Ballard and Tanev are playing is that they are finishing shifts in the offensive zone at a much higher rate than they are starting them. So even though they may be playing weaker opposition than the other D, they at least are pushing the play forward and not backwards like some of our D.

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02-07-2013, 02:29 AM
  #200
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Yeah. So many of these 'advanced metrics' essentially just boil down to an extravagant way of stat-watching. There are aspects of them that are interesting and worth taking a look at, but i don't see a whole lot of validity in many of them.

It's not baseball, there are so many factors at play in this game.

It's stuff like the above mentioned, but also stuff like the fact that SV% while on the ice can be pretty heavily influenced by the type of scoring chances a pairing is giving up. A high SV% on ice might indicate some flukey above average goaltending...but it could also just as easily indicate that high quality scoring opportunities are being limited and a lot of weak shots from the perimeter, due to quality defensive play.

The way some of these metrics are treated like gospel around here...it's like some folks watched 'Moneyball' one too many times.
Regardless of what you think of these stats, there are clearly sustainable ones and unsustainable ones. A .981 sv% is not sustainable over the long haul. No matter how well they play, Ballard and Tanev are not going to finish the season being on the ice for only 5 ES GA which is what they're currently on pace for.

The good news is Ballard and Tanev could triple or quadruple their GA/G and still be in pretty good shape for their 5 on 5 play even when you factor in the competition they're facing.

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