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Old
02-06-2013, 10:19 PM
  #326
johnjm22
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It sucks, but Bernier has very little trade value right now.

I'm still in favor of dangling Dwight King.

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02-06-2013, 10:25 PM
  #327
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Nonis is apparently listening to calls regarding Kessel. Wow.

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Old
02-06-2013, 10:44 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
I considered them but I am thinking they want someone more proven than Bernier in net, considering that they already have two inexperienced netminders currently on the roster.
I agree. McPhee needs to turn that ship around immediately, or he's gone. Hard to phathom he thinks replacing two goalies with a total of 139 games between them with one who has 49 total games. He's going to go for a Luongo type (proven netminder) or hang his hopes on Holtby/Neuvirth.

From your other list Ziggy, I think the two that make sense is NJ and Calgary. Carolina I think will stick out with Ward for now, and Edmonton I think will give Dubynk a try as a full-fledged starter before looking elsewhere. if we are thinking about how much time we've put into Bernier, think about how much Edmonton has put into Dubnyk.

New Jersey though has Hedberg and Broduer locked in for two years (I think) so not sure how they'd do it since I think hedberg also has a NTC. I think Calgary could be the real target. At some point that team will have to embrace a rebuild, and they need someone for the future in place of Kipper. Irving doesn't seem to be cutting it at all.

Could be a prime piece to deal in a rental for Iggy.

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Old
02-06-2013, 11:08 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by CandianKingsFan14 View Post
Darren Dreger said on TSN tonight about the Kiprusoff injury that if they were looking at a goalie and was intrested in Bernier, Lombardi's asking price is a top young player/prosect and a 1st round pick.
This is the happy news for me tonight as I proberly more then most on this board try to deal with fans trying to get bernier. I was right to what dean is asking according to what dreger is saying. If anything i was slightly under

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Old
02-07-2013, 04:18 AM
  #330
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Man I would like to get ROR...

Is there any realistic scenario im which Kings trade for him?

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Old
02-07-2013, 04:28 AM
  #331
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I agree. McPhee needs to turn that ship around immediately, or he's gone. Hard to phathom he thinks replacing two goalies with a total of 139 games between them with one who has 49 total games. He's going to go for a Luongo type (proven netminder) or hang his hopes on Holtby/Neuvirth.

From your other list Ziggy, I think the two that make sense is NJ and Calgary. Carolina I think will stick out with Ward for now, and Edmonton I think will give Dubynk a try as a full-fledged starter before looking elsewhere. if we are thinking about how much time we've put into Bernier, think about how much Edmonton has put into Dubnyk.

New Jersey though has Hedberg and Broduer locked in for two years (I think) so not sure how they'd do it since I think hedberg also has a NTC. I think Calgary could be the real target. At some point that team will have to embrace a rebuild, and they need someone for the future in place of Kipper. Irving doesn't seem to be cutting it at all.

Could be a prime piece to deal in a rental for Iggy.
It's possible Winnipeg has interest in Bernier. They just signed Pavelec to a long term extension, but he has been pretty terrible this season. He was below average last year as well, a .915 goalie and WPG likely makes playoffs last year.

Doesn't seem to be in GM Kevin Chevaldayoff's wheelhouse to overpay in trades though, so not sure what they would be offering up. WPG does have 3 2nd Rounders and 2 3rd Rounders in the upcoming draft though, to go along with their 1st Rounder.

Could see something around Bernier for CHI 2nd + D Paul Postma/D Zach Redmond + G Al Montoya. Postma is a smooth skating defenseman with a wicked shot, great first pass, can put up points, fantastic on PP, but is only average defensively. Redmond is more of twoway guy, solid positionally, solid first pass, kind of jack of all trades (kind of like a Martinez). WPG does not really have room for both longterm, but both are solid youngsters playing great for WPG. Gives Kings depth now with the injuries and in the off-season they can likely deal Martinez for a solid return. Or you can change for that for impending UFA D Ron Hainsey, solid defensively, has played tough minutes the past couple of years for WPG, solid #4 guy. But WPG would probably want to drop the pick in that case.

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02-07-2013, 05:06 AM
  #332
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Quote:
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Loktionov should have fetched more. He is a 5th rounder, but we spent more than 4 years developing him.
Or you could say we've spent 4 years developing him into a player that hasn't been able to crack the NHL. He's been given chances and he hasn't seized them. Now the clock is ticking down on him in North America ... why would anyone feel the urge to pay a high price for that ?

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02-07-2013, 09:13 AM
  #333
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Or you could say we've spent 4 years developing him into a player that hasn't been able to crack the NHL. He's been given chances and he hasn't seized them. Now the clock is ticking down on him in North America ... why would anyone feel the urge to pay a high price for that ?
Not to mention the fact that Jersey sent him to their AHL affiliate even though the guy has NHL experience

Seems a 5th round pick is about right, actually happy they got that.

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Old
02-07-2013, 09:52 AM
  #334
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Originally Posted by Holden Caulfield View Post
It's possible Winnipeg has interest in Bernier. They just signed Pavelec to a long term extension, but he has been pretty terrible this season. He was below average last year as well, a .915 goalie and WPG likely makes playoffs last year.

Doesn't seem to be in GM Kevin Chevaldayoff's wheelhouse to overpay in trades though, so not sure what they would be offering up. WPG does have 3 2nd Rounders and 2 3rd Rounders in the upcoming draft though, to go along with their 1st Rounder.

Could see something around Bernier for CHI 2nd + D Paul Postma/D Zach Redmond + G Al Montoya. Postma is a smooth skating defenseman with a wicked shot, great first pass, can put up points, fantastic on PP, but is only average defensively. Redmond is more of twoway guy, solid positionally, solid first pass, kind of jack of all trades (kind of like a Martinez). WPG does not really have room for both longterm, but both are solid youngsters playing great for WPG. Gives Kings depth now with the injuries and in the off-season they can likely deal Martinez for a solid return. Or you can change for that for impending UFA D Ron Hainsey, solid defensively, has played tough minutes the past couple of years for WPG, solid #4 guy. But WPG would probably want to drop the pick in that case.
I don't see it. Pavelec is due to get a lot of coin in the coming seasons and I doubt Winnipeg will buy him out, so they are either stuck with him or they trade him. The trade market for a goalie paid that well who is struggling isn't very good, ask Bryzgalov. And if he turns it around, then why deal him?

And if he doesn't turn it around, the Jets will give him every chance to do so before they give up. As such, I'd be shocked if he's not essentially guaranteed to be the Jets starter until sometime into next season, no matter how bad he is.

Bernier will likely be moved by then.

As for the deal, on a pure value aspect, I'd be all over the 2nd+Postma+Montoya deal. Postma I think is a severely underrated prospect who will be a very good two-way defender, but that said, that's not what the Kings really need and would just be to much behind Doughty, Voynov and Martinez. Redmond meanwhile would fit in a bit better, but his cost likely shouldn't be very much.

I can't see Winnipeg on the radar for Bernier, but if he was, and if a defenseman was part of the deal (which seems very likely under the current situation) I'd imagine the defenseman coming the other way would be Mark Stuart. His cap hit is very reasonable ($1.7 mill) and he's signed into next year and plays a style somewhat similar to Rob Scuderi, who is a UFA after the season. And odds are DL is looking to trim some payroll while staying competitive for next year as we will be very tight to the cap.

Bernier for Stuart and a 2nd?

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Old
02-07-2013, 10:08 AM
  #335
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Bernier for Stuart and a 2nd?
Who would back up Quick? I don't think Jones or Montoya would be adequate.

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Old
02-07-2013, 10:29 AM
  #336
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Who would back up Quick? I don't think Jones or Montoya would be adequate.
Montoya would be. Honestly, performance wise, either will do. The Kings aren't going anywhere without Quick, so all we need is someone to come in and make a start from time to time. Bernier hasn't shown enough to be given any more faith really as a backup. As a regular starter I think bernier will be very good, but coming off the bench he's been sketchy for last year and this year.

Also, I was more meaning for that trade to come late in the season or in the off-season, not right now. I doubt DL is to worried about trading for a D-man until we either start to really get in trouble record wise or until he knows Greene and/or Mitchell won't be back this season.

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02-07-2013, 10:53 AM
  #337
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Stuart and Montoya would be a good return for the here and now, except that Stuart would likely go to waste next year (I suspect Scuderi gets re-signed for a couple years).

However, the situation completely changes if Willie Mitchell is totally lost to us.

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02-07-2013, 11:16 AM
  #338
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The Kings aren't going anywhere without Quick, so all we need is someone to come in and make a start from time to time. Bernier hasn't shown enough to be given any more faith really as a backup. As a regular starter I think bernier will be very good, but coming off the bench he's been sketchy for last year and this year.
Let's be fair here, the rust factor would set in for just about any player when you're sitting for long stretches with sporadic, spots starts here and there. Practice time can only keep you on top of your game to a certain extent in the absence of game time conditions and pressures involved.

I think you would want someone able to keep the ship from sinking rather than lowering the bar for any warm body able to make a handful of starts. Reason being that if the gap in level of quality between your starter and backup is too big then in the case of an injury situation to Quick the team is toast.

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02-07-2013, 11:32 AM
  #339
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I can see NYI being interested in Bernier. Maybe a deal around Bernier and Nino

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02-07-2013, 12:15 PM
  #340
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Let's be fair here, the rust factor would set in for just about any player when you're sitting for long stretches with sporadic, spots starts here and there. Practice time can only keep you on top of your game to a certain extent in the absence of game time conditions and pressures involved.

I think you would want someone able to keep the ship from sinking rather than lowering the bar for any warm body able to make a handful of starts. Reason being that if the gap in level of quality between your starter and backup is too big then in the case of an injury situation to Quick the team is toast.
I'm not disputing the rust factor at all and I agree with you. The fact remains though that as long as Quick is our number one and Sutter is behind the bench, no goalie is likely getting more than 10-15 starts a season. That's the way Sutter is, and has road his starter for 70+ games a season many times. See Belfour, Nabokov and Kiprusoff. Only Nabokov of those three didn't start 70+ games a season under Sutter, but he was typically at 66-67 games a season, so not far off.

An ideal backup would be someone like Clemenssen in Florida, who can sit for a month then come in and play well, something he's done a lot of over his career. He's the ideal backup. But who has a guy like that, nevermind a team we'd trade with?

I don't think Bernier will be able to be an above average goalie as a backup due to irregular starts (rust factor), but neither will anyone we bring in in all likelihood. As such I stand by my assertion that in all likelihood, if Quick goes down, we are screwed. About the only way i say we don't is if Quick got hurt early in the season and Bernier can get a chance to get into a groove. He's been a slow starter but got better as the season wears on, so he might be able to get into a groove enough to salvage our season, but only if he got a while to get there. I'd have no faith in him, or any other goalie we'd likely land as a backup, saving us if Quick is injured late in the season or in the playoffs.

About the ony goalie I could see working under that situation is if we picked up someone like Nabokov from the Islanders, someone who has a great level of experience but who is also a UFA after the season and is on a team that (on paper) shouldn't make the playoffs. Nikolai Khabibulin would be another. Not that I'm advocating for either to be acquired by the Kings, just giving examples.

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02-07-2013, 12:18 PM
  #341
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#NHL *Trade Rumor*-- #Leafs Phil Kessel is being shopped with #Caps, #LAKings and #NHLDucks all kicking tires atm.

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02-07-2013, 12:22 PM
  #342
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not sure about Bernier's trade value now, but I'm pretty sure DL wants to get back into the 1st round of the draft, and is holding out for a team to offer it. In our minds, Bernier should probably be worth more than a mere 1st (he was a first and a potential #1 G), but can't imagine his value being much higher than that now.

But also hard to imagine a good trading partner at this point. A team willing to trade good pieces for a young, unproven goalie will itself be a young, developing team. In that case, it'll most likely be a prospect swap. Unless a team like CHI or TOR who's willing to gamble.

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02-07-2013, 12:22 PM
  #343
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Not a shock we're 'kicking the tires' but I can't imagine what we'd give up to get him. I doubt Toronto is going to move him for just picks, etc. so early in the season, so one would figure it'd have to be for some proven assets. I can't imagine what we'd want to give up off this roster that they'd want (IE, no Penner, Richardson, Lewis, etc.)

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02-07-2013, 12:25 PM
  #344
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not sure about Bernier's trade value now, but I'm pretty sure DL wants to get back into the 1st round of the draft, and is holding out for a team to offer it. In our minds, Bernier should probably be worth more than a mere 1st (he was a first and a potential #1 G), but can't imagine his value being much higher than that now.

But also hard to imagine a good trading partner at this point. A team willing to trade good pieces for a young, unproven goalie will itself be a young, developing team. In that case, it'll most likely be a prospect swap. Unless a team like CHI or TOR who's willing to gamble.
I imagine it will be done closer to the trade deadline or in the off-season. If at the deadline, I could see him going for a rental, such as Iginla. If in the off-season, could be similar to the Lindback deal, which was mostly for picks.

Honestly, I can't think of any area where the Kings need to add prospects at. We could use an upper level prospect as we don't have a blue chipper, but I doubt anyone will move a blue chipper for Bernier.

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02-07-2013, 12:36 PM
  #345
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I'd love for them to get back into the 1st round. This draft is pretty deep, you could get a guy like Hartman or Lazar in the low 1st round, both are complete Kings type of players.

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02-07-2013, 12:41 PM
  #346
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Who would back up Quick? I don't think Jones or Montoya would be adequate.
we'll play without one

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02-07-2013, 12:42 PM
  #347
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I can see NYI being interested in Bernier. Maybe a deal around Bernier and Nino
Doubt it. They've got about 3 goalies waiting behind Nabokov.

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02-07-2013, 12:50 PM
  #348
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I'd love Kessel, but besides not knowing what we could give-up for him, adding his cap hit would cause a serious problem next off-season.

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02-07-2013, 12:51 PM
  #349
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#NHL *Trade Rumor*-- #Leafs Phil Kessel is being shopped with #Caps, #LAKings and #NHLDucks all kicking tires atm.
Kessel on Kopitar's wing? Good LAWD!!!

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02-07-2013, 01:01 PM
  #350
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I'd love Kessel, but besides not knowing what we could give-up for him, adding his cap hit would cause a serious problem next off-season.
Now, Nonis is in charge, maybe we can get him for New Jersey's 5th

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