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How bad does Pegula look now?

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02-06-2013, 11:29 PM
  #76
sabrefan27
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He's kept the same stale GM and coach who clearly lost the team years ago. Haven't won a playoff series since 2007. Off to a terrible start. Regier gets an extension BEFORE this debacle even started. And people are still making excuses for him. It's insane.

Yeah he's done everything right, you know, except the whole hockey thing.

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02-06-2013, 11:36 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
He's kept the same stale GM and coach who clearly lost the team years ago. Haven't won a playoff series since 2007. Off to a terrible start. Regier gets an extension BEFORE this debacle even started. And people are still making excuses for him. It's insane.

Yeah he's done everything right, you know, except the whole hockey thing.
Pegula made it clear when he took over and Regier and Ruff were being given a completely fresh start. He's providing them all the resources they could ever want and all the opportunity. Now he's giving them the time and patience any decent boss would give a new employee.

Giving a GM 2-3 years minimum to make their case is pretty standard for this league and most other professional sports leagues.


You may disagree with him on giving them the fresh start in the first place, finding it important to factor in their previous successes and failures under prior ownership. That's fine. But fault Pegula for that, not for letting things play out and not making knee-jerk decisions before a reasonable time frame has passed.

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02-06-2013, 11:40 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Layne Staley View Post
Pegula is garbage until he wins a playoff series. Ted Black is a clown too. They can shove their fireplaces and big Sabre logo in the locker room up where the sun don't shine. I'm already sick of this whole franchise top to bottom. Pegula is the savior around here (and Golisano evil) yet what has Pegula done? Waste millions on Leino? Build a locker room (LoL) and a fireplace? Tell us "They aren't going anywhere"? Ted Black is just a tool, a Penguins cast off who obviously was not the reason for there success as he has brought nothing here.

Oh I get it, he went around delivering season tickets so in the boards eyes here he can do no wrong. If Pegula supports Ruff then he should be judged on Ruffs successes and failures end of story.

I bought the Pegula kool aid. I remember I was at the game where durin a break they put a spotlight in the 300 level and Pegula was sitting there waving his hand like he was the ****ing king. Pegula isn't a good owner, he's a Ruff/Sabre fanboy who made enough to buy the team. He has no logical thinking , or else he would have fired Ruff as soon as he became owner

Please..please, find another team to root for!!. Unbelieveable hyperpole with people.

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02-06-2013, 11:43 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by vcv View Post
Pegula made it clear when he took over and Regier and Ruff were being given a completely fresh start. He's providing them all the resources they could ever want and all the opportunity. Now he's giving them the time and patience any decent boss would give a new employee.

Giving a GM 2-3 years minimum to make their case is pretty standard for this league and most other professional sports leagues.


You may disagree with him on giving them the fresh start in the first place, finding it important to factor in their previous successes and failures under prior ownership. That's fine. But fault Pegula for that, not for letting things play out and not making knee-jerk decisions before a reasonable time frame has passed.
Knee-jerk reactions?? You can't be serious. This whole "fresh start" BS is the first problem. These two clowns have been around long enough and it's not working. Pegula is failing as an owner when it comes to the hockey side.

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02-06-2013, 11:49 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
Knee-jerk reactions?? You can't be serious. This whole "fresh start" BS is the first problem. These two clowns have been around long enough and it's not working. Pegula is failing as an owner when it comes to the hockey side.
My point is that most owners give a GM a 2-3+ year window and from all indications when Pegula took over, that's what he planned with Regier. You obviously think Regier didn't deserve that, but I think it's mostly irrelevant to the point.

If this ****-show keeps on through the season and/or into next and Regier and Ruff are both still here at the start of or deep into next season, then I will completely agree that Pegula is failing as an owner, from the hockey side.

"Knee-jerk" meaning that you, and many others, have your conclusion already and are expecting Pegula to come to the same conclusion, despite still being in the middle of that "window" I talked about before.

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02-06-2013, 11:52 PM
  #81
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Well, there's a false belief that the GM and coach deserve more opportunity simply because there's a new owner around. It has contributed to the Sabres failings over the years. It's a shame.

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02-07-2013, 12:04 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
Well, there's a false belief that the GM and coach deserve more opportunity simply because there's a new owner around. It has contributed to the Sabres failings over the years. It's a shame.
I guess I'm struggling with the jump from "wrong decision" to "failing as an owner".

I'm somewhere on the line of the first one, but no where near the second one yet, where as you seem pretty comfortably in the "failing as an owner" camp. I can't get there without at least giving the guy time, and yes, slack.

Look at Mike Iltich. He took over the Red Wings in 1982 and they didn't win a single playoff series in the first 4 years, in fact only winning a single playoff game.

Granted, he started with a fresh GM in 1982, but he gave the guy 4 full years of failed seasons and still didn't give him the boot! He in facts stayed in the organization in 1990, 8 years after starting. He came back on as a GM 4 years after that and ends up winning the Stanley Cup with them a few years later.

Would you have said, during that time, that Iltich was a failure as an owner?


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02-07-2013, 05:08 AM
  #83
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I'm not seeing why this falls on the owner?

It's the GM's job to make decisions on the bench boss. Regier has the roster in a decent position now, and going forward, to take progressive steps to put a winning product on the ice. The coach is the one who's supposed to manage these bodies accordingly, handle ToI and roster situations with regards to who dresses and sits, who plays in what situations, etc.

Placing blame on a guy who has done nothing but inject financial support and enthusiasm into the organization is annoying. I don't want my owner making hockey decisions, especially when said owner has no hockey background.

Stop complaining to complain, and pick appropriate and legitimate things to whine about. Our owner isn't one.
As frustrating as all of this is I echo this to be honest. Well said.

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02-07-2013, 07:22 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by vcv View Post
I guess I'm struggling with the jump from "wrong decision" to "failing as an owner".

I'm somewhere on the line of the first one, but no where near the second one yet, where as you seem pretty comfortably in the "failing as an owner" camp. I can't get there without at least giving the guy time, and yes, slack.

Look at Mike Iltich. He took over the Red Wings in 1982 and they didn't win a single playoff series in the first 4 years, in fact only winning a single playoff game.

Granted, he started with a fresh GM in 1982, but he gave the guy 4 full years of failed seasons and still didn't give him the boot! He in facts stayed in the organization in 1990, 8 years after starting. He came back on as a GM 4 years after that and ends up winning the Stanley Cup with them a few years later.

Would you have said, during that time, that Iltich was a failure as an owner?
You already noted that he started with a fresh GM, so it's not a comparable situation. And, I wasn't even alive and I never experienced that situation so I won't bother with it.

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02-07-2013, 07:25 AM
  #85
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They just let some real frustrated fans get some time to rant to Ted Black on WGR. Surprised they did that, normally all softball.

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02-07-2013, 08:44 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
You already noted that he started with a fresh GM, so it's not a comparable situation. And, I wasn't even alive and I never experienced that situation so I won't bother with it.
It IS comparable because Pegula chose to treat it as if it were a fresh GM. Regier has had success here before, with limited resources, so Pegula wanted to see what he could do with virtually unlimited resources.

Again, you may not agree with the decision to do so, but I don't think it's completely unreasonable and a failure as an owner.

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02-07-2013, 08:47 AM
  #87
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They just let some real frustrated fans get some time to rant to Ted Black on WGR. Surprised they did that, normally all softball.
Ted's a big boy...unlike Larry Quinn.

Speaking of which, just for fun, can we have another annual "**** Larry Quinn" thread so we can vent how the organization is still messed up because of him?

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02-07-2013, 08:48 AM
  #88
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People who buy businesses generally fall into two categories.

1. Those who instantly want to clean house, and put all their own people in place.
2. Those who want to see what they have first, and then make decisions.

Pegula is clearly the second type. Frankly, he's the one who put up $200M, so he can do whatever he wants.

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02-07-2013, 08:52 AM
  #89
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They just let some real frustrated fans get some time to rant to Ted Black on WGR. Surprised they did that, normally all softball.
I'd imagine a lot of the callers were calling about Ruff, what did Black say to that?

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02-07-2013, 08:56 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by vcv View Post
It IS comparable because Pegula chose to treat it as if it were a fresh GM. Regier has had success here before, with limited resources, so Pegula wanted to see what he could do with virtually unlimited resources.

Again, you may not agree with the decision to do so, but I don't think it's completely unreasonable and a failure as an owner.
I like to use the Ilitch comparison when trying to think about the time it will take Pegula to change the organization into what we all want it to be.

This isn't a quick fix situation.

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02-07-2013, 08:58 AM
  #91
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Just speculating

Maybe it was the question for Pegula to see what Lindy and Darcy are able to do with some financial backup.
If this was the case, Pegula should have an answer very soon: Not much.

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02-07-2013, 09:29 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by vcv View Post
It IS comparable because Pegula chose to treat it as if it were a fresh GM. Regier has had success here before, with limited resources, so Pegula wanted to see what he could do with virtually unlimited resources.

Again, you may not agree with the decision to do so, but I don't think it's completely unreasonable and a failure as an owner.
I don't care what Pegula chose to do. He doesn't know crap about hockey. Regier is not a fresh GM and it's not the same situation even a little bit.

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02-07-2013, 09:39 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
I don't care what Pegula chose to do. He doesn't know crap about hockey. Regier is not a fresh GM and it's not the same situation even a little bit.
I'd venture to guess that Pegula knows more about hockey than a vast majority of NHL owners.

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02-07-2013, 09:45 AM
  #94
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I'd imagine a lot of the callers were calling about Ruff, what did Black say to that?
Sadly I didn't get to hear his entire segment, but the few callers he did hear, he seemed a little flustered by. He did re-group and go on to say that he isn't going to try and understand going through 15 years of the same thing and he's glad the fan base is so passionate because if it was the other way around, he would be worried. He didn't really respond with much substance in the time that I was listening, but he was staying on for another segment. I'll have to check out the audio vault later tonight.

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02-07-2013, 09:49 AM
  #95
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Oh lord he's been the owner for essentially 2 seasons now.

Come off the ledge people. This fanbase has gone completely insane.

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02-07-2013, 09:53 AM
  #96
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I'd venture to guess that Pegula knows more about hockey than a vast majority of NHL owners.
Which doesn't say much. He kept these 2 clowns because he was a self proclaimed huge fan, which he let cloud his judgement on what's best.

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02-07-2013, 10:02 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
Which doesn't say much. He kept these 2 clowns because he was a self proclaimed huge fan, which he let cloud his judgement on what's best.
You don't know any part of Pegula's decision making process aside from his public comments, in which he said he did research on Ruff and Regier and found that they were well respected in many hockey circles. THAT is why he decided to keep them, not some fanboy girl crush.

Now that the going is rough, we'll see what he does. Making all these assumptions about what he will or will not do is frankly making this fanbase look more insane than normal.

And that's saying something.

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02-07-2013, 10:13 AM
  #98
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The fanbase is insane for calling out Pegula? That's rich. If Regier and Ruff were still around in other cities (with the same track record) that have even some standards, these guys would have been run out of town years ago. The patient and understanding fans giving them even more time are the insane ones.

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02-07-2013, 10:19 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
Which doesn't say much. He kept these 2 clowns because he was a self proclaimed huge fan, which he let cloud his judgement on what's best.
Or because he realised changing the Coach and GM when he was lacking any real experience to find suitable replacements was a recipe for disaster.

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02-07-2013, 10:33 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by sabrefan27 View Post
The fanbase is insane for calling out Pegula? That's rich. If Regier and Ruff were still around in other cities (with the same track record) that have even some standards, these guys would have been run out of town years ago. The patient and understanding fans giving them even more time are the insane ones.
This thread is about Pegula, not the 39 years before he got here.

Maybe he believes in doing his own analysis under his way of operating, instead of judging them both under previous ownership. Or maybe he has some other reason for the current situation that you would never know about.

My problem with what some of you are doing is assuming you know more about Terry's thought process than you actually do. That's what is insane to me.

Give Pegula time. Saying he looks bad now is typical Buffalo sports fan.

Good god we need a championship.

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