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Calgary Flames @ Columbus Blue Jackets, 5PM on SNET-W and the Fan 960

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02-07-2013, 08:54 PM
  #376
MuffinMerc
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This team needs to do a better job in their own zone. The Jackets were brutal.

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02-07-2013, 08:55 PM
  #377
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Snipniak > Whirling Dervish

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02-07-2013, 08:55 PM
  #378
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Originally Posted by Autograph View Post
Irving has many deficiencies not found in a steady #1 NHL-calibre goaltender.
In fact, the win tonight, especially with the last-minute powerplay, had less to do with Irving playing spectacularly and making the big save and much more to do with a slow and unmotivated Columbus team giving up a 4 on 2 in early OT.

He can make the routine saves, but he is also quite obviously not up to NHL speed yet - a good play makes him look like he was burned and had no chance, while I would say that a regular like Kiprusoff, Brodeur, Luongo, etc., would have at least had a fighting chance due to experience and regular play at the NHL level.
You do understand Irving has played <10 NHL games, right? How is this a critique of him in any way? I'm not sure what you're getting at here...

He played in the exact manner that was expected and hoped for. First start of the season, had some nerves and gave up a soft goal, but got the win. This is literally the best and most reasonable outcome we could possibly ever have hoped for. I literally do not understand people wringing their hands over Irving.

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02-07-2013, 08:55 PM
  #379
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I thought he was bad. He's awful on the glove side and always went down early.
That sounds familiar!

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02-07-2013, 08:56 PM
  #380
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That sounds familiar!
Haha, more so than Irving though.

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02-07-2013, 08:56 PM
  #381
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Over the last few years, the team relied on Kipper making the big save just to stay competitive. I'd much rather the team get its act together and not have to rely on the goalie to bail them out that way. If the team in front is good enough, you don't need the goalie to make the spectacular save all the time - they just need to be solid enough to not cost the team the win. And Irving did that.
While I agree with your general sentiment/assessment of how skilled an NHL goaltender should be behind the team's play, I would really like to KNOW that our team's goaltender has the pure, natural ability to be a clutch savemaker, just as certain skaters have the ability to be a clutch goalscorer.

I'm not saying I've studied how well Irving has played in the past, but I wonder if he has the ability to stone cold rob a save.

I guess what I'm saying is, I feel like that's the difference between a Niemi and a Leighton in the Stanley Cup Final.

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02-07-2013, 09:00 PM
  #382
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Originally Posted by Autograph View Post
While I agree with your general sentiment/assessment of how skilled an NHL goaltender should be behind the team's play, I would really like to KNOW that our team's goaltender has the pure, natural ability to be a clutch savemaker, just as certain skaters have the ability to be a clutch goalscorer.

I'm not saying I've studied how well Irving has played in the past, but I wonder if he has the ability to stone cold rob a save.

I guess what I'm saying is, I feel like that's the difference between a Niemi and a Leighton in the Stanley Cup Final.
Ask D.Sedin what he thinks... (or was it H?)

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02-07-2013, 09:01 PM
  #383
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Originally Posted by Autograph View Post
While I agree with your general sentiment/assessment of how skilled an NHL goaltender should be behind the team's play, I would really like to KNOW that our team's goaltender has the pure, natural ability to be a clutch savemaker, just as certain skaters have the ability to be a clutch goalscorer.

I'm not saying I've studied how well Irving has played in the past, but I wonder if he has the ability to stone cold rob a save.

I guess what I'm saying is, I feel like that's the difference between a Niemi and a Leighton in the Stanley Cup Final.
HE HAS PLAYED LESS THAN 10 NHL GAMES. god. This is his chance to do so. His first start of the season is not going to be indicative of his ultimate potential and his pure ability. At this point, he has demonstrated he can start a game. Up to this point, he has performed in the best possible manner that could be hoped for from a guy in Irving's situation.

I don't understand this site sometimes.

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02-07-2013, 09:04 PM
  #384
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Originally Posted by fallsviewafro View Post
You do understand Irving has played <10 NHL games, right? How is this a critique of him in any way? I'm not sure what you're getting at here...

He played in the exact manner that was expected and hoped for. First start of the season, had some nerves and gave up a soft goal, but got the win. This is literally the best and most reasonable outcome we could possibly ever have hoped for. I literally do not understand people wringing their hands over Irving.
He's the closest player we have until next season to an NHL-calibre goaltender in Calgary's system.
Brust and Taylor are great at the AHL level but haven't proven anything at the NHL level either.
Broissoit and Gillies are kids with potential to make the big show... just like Irving is/was.
Ramo is unavailable due to contractual obligations until next season, although he is the most experienced goaltender the Flames have, especially in regards to playing at a high level with men.

In other words, outside of Kiprusoff, all Calgary has is a boat-load of what-if's and maybes, and knee injuries are no joke. If Kiprusoff aggravates his MCL during his rehabilitation period, then he will be out for even longer. And at his age, getting into game shape and really recovering from knee injuries isn't as easy.

My concern lies at the point of where Irving must be leaned on as a #1 - I want to give him a chance, but it's not easy when you have had a wonderfully consistent player such as Kiprusoff the last 8 seasons perform as well as he has behind a lackluster, offence-deficient team.
Now that we have a team that understands how to finish a play, the focus is on the defence and the man between the pipes.

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02-07-2013, 09:05 PM
  #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Autograph View Post
While I agree with your general sentiment/assessment of how skilled an NHL goaltender should be behind the team's play, I would really like to KNOW that our team's goaltender has the pure, natural ability to be a clutch savemaker, just as certain skaters have the ability to be a clutch goalscorer.

I'm not saying I've studied how well Irving has played in the past, but I wonder if he has the ability to stone cold rob a save.

I guess what I'm saying is, I feel like that's the difference between a Niemi and a Leighton in the Stanley Cup Final.
Well, he made more than a few of those last season as the backup. He hasn't played a full game apparently since November. Given that, he had a pretty good game. Give it time, there should be no doubt that Irving has the potential to be a starter in the NHL. At the very worst, he'll be an average one.

Also, you can't reasonably expect every goaltender to be on the same level as a Kipper, Luongo, Brodeur, etc. Yes, guys like those are nice to have, but they're not exactly common.

And as far as I see it, the Niemi/Leighton comparison is reversed. Leighton's AHL quality, while Irving, at worst, can be a Niemi-like goalie for a team. Not elite by any means, but good enough to get his the win.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Autograph View Post
He's the closest player we have until next season to an NHL-calibre goaltender in Calgary's system.
Brust and Taylor are great at the AHL level but haven't proven anything at the NHL level either.
Broissoit and Gillies are kids with potential to make the big show... just like Irving is/was.
Ramo is unavailable due to contractual obligations until next season, although he is the most experienced goaltender the Flames have, especially in regards to playing at a high level with men.

In other words, outside of Kiprusoff, all Calgary has is a boat-load of what-if's and maybes, and knee injuries are no joke. If Kiprusoff aggravates his MCL during his rehabilitation period, then he will be out for even longer. And at his age, getting into game shape and really recovering from knee injuries isn't as easy.

My concern lies at the point of where Irving must be leaned on as a #1 - I want to give him a chance, but it's not easy when you have had a wonderfully consistent player such as Kiprusoff the last 8 seasons perform as well as he has behind a lackluster, offence-deficient team.
Now that we have a team that understands how to finish a play, the focus is on the defence and the man between the pipes.
Kiprusoff's time may be coming to an end and that's something the organization and the fans will have to prepare for.

Also, people are reading waaay too much into Ramo's stats in the KHL. Keep in mind, Emery put up a 2.12 GAA and 0.926 save percentage in that league.

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02-07-2013, 09:05 PM
  #386
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Zero. He's young and drinks his malk.



My favourite post in this thread.

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02-07-2013, 09:06 PM
  #387
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Pretty impressed with Brodie in this game. Glad to see Irving get the W.

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02-07-2013, 09:07 PM
  #388
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Not in anyway hating on Irving, he was alright.. He didn't let in a deflating softie and stood his ground early in overtime when the pressure was on. The team was obviously horrendus today (not like the BJs deserved the win anymore). My concern is can Irving hold his own against real threats like the Canucks and Wild coming up? And whats going to be the status on Backlund?? and Cammaleri? If they miss significant time this team could be in a lot of trouble. Theres already 0 margin for error to make the playoffs so if we ain't going all the way we might as well tank now.

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02-07-2013, 09:07 PM
  #389
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Originally Posted by Autograph View Post
He's the closest player we have until next season to an NHL-calibre goaltender in Calgary's system.
Brust and Taylor are great at the AHL level but haven't proven anything at the NHL level either.
Broissoit and Gillies are kids with potential to make the big show... just like Irving is/was.
Ramo is unavailable due to contractual obligations until next season, although he is the most experienced goaltender the Flames have, especially in regards to playing at a high level with men.

In other words, outside of Kiprusoff, all Calgary has is a boat-load of what-if's and maybes, and knee injuries are no joke. If Kiprusoff aggravates his MCL during his rehabilitation period, then he will be out for even longer. And at his age, getting into game shape and really recovering from knee injuries isn't as easy.

My concern lies at the point of where Irving must be leaned on as a #1 - I want to give him a chance, but it's not easy when you have had a wonderfully consistent player such as Kiprusoff the last 8 seasons perform as well as he has behind a lackluster, offence-deficient team.
Now that we have a team that understands how to finish a play, the focus is on the defence and the man between the pipes.
Say Kipper is out long-term, then we will cross that bridge when we get to it. The Danny Taylor thread is 99% full of people thanking God and all things holy that we didn't go out and make an unnecessary trade for another goalie. The point of having to lean on Irving as a #1 is not here, and probably will not be here for at least another season if not longer. There is NO point to fretting over his capacity as a #1 - if he blows the next few games, then sure, let's fret. RIGHT NOW, he has done everything expected of him. You literally have zero reason to be questioning the guy at this point since the chance of him being a #1 at any time in the near future is extremely slim to absolutely nil.

This is the chance for our what if's and maybe's to sort themselves out. This is Irving's chance. I cannot fathom how you could possibly be judging the guy or getting concerned over his ability to perform as a #1. In every game he has played in the NHL thus far, he has played up to the expectations that were laid upon him.

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02-07-2013, 09:09 PM
  #390
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I would only blame Irving on the 1st goal, the 2nd no goaltender would have had IMO. The 3rd was a poor play by Giordano to screen his own goaltender. It was a pretty average start but he got the win, I woukd rather see that than him steal the show in Florida or Ottawwa and lose in overtime like happened last year.

Cervenka & Hudler were fantastic tonight. Wideman and Brodei were quite good as well.

A stat that might go unnoticed is even though the Flames were only credited with 7 blocked shots, 4 of them were credited to Butler.

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02-07-2013, 09:11 PM
  #391
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I would only blame Irving on the 1st goal, the 2nd no goaltender would have had IMO. The 3rd was a poor play by Giordano to screen his own goaltender. It was a pretty average start but he got the win, I woukd rather see that than him steal the show in Florida or Ottawwa and lose in overtime like happened last year.

Cervenka & Hudler were fantastic tonight. Wideman and Brodei were quite good as well.

A stat that might go unnoticed is even though the Flames were only credited with 7 blocked shots, 4 of them were credited to Butler.
Yup. When I was driving home listening to 960, I hear Pete say "A shot, blocked again by Butler". Good thing helping out his goalie, but the defense as a whole needs to do a better job in their own end.

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02-07-2013, 09:13 PM
  #392
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Originally Posted by Flames92 View Post
Not in anyway hating on Irving, he was alright.. He didn't let in a deflating softie and stood his ground early in overtime when the pressure was on. The team was obviously horrendus today (not like the BJs deserved the win anymore). My concern is can Irving hold his own against real threats like the Canucks and Wild coming up? And whats going to be the status on Backlund?? and Cammaleri? If they miss significant time this team could be in a lot of trouble. Theres already 0 margin for error to make the playoffs so if we ain't going all the way we might as well tank now.
Like last year when we stop 29 of 30 shots versus the canucks, he played playoff teams 5 times last year and had above a .918 sv% in all but the boston game. He was fine last year and will be this year.

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02-07-2013, 09:16 PM
  #393
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Like last year when we stop 29 of 30 shots versus the canucks, he played playoff teams 5 times last year and had above a .918 sv% in all but the boston game. He was fine last year and will be this year.
Plus one million.

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02-07-2013, 09:18 PM
  #394
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Not sure what it is with Flames fans and Irving. All through his career so many of us have cast doubt on him and he always proves them wrong, hopefully he continues to do so. People seem to forget he is 24 yrs old. That's young for a tender, Kipper wasn't Kipper until his late 20s.

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02-07-2013, 09:19 PM
  #395
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With that win, the Flames now sit in 12th, tied with three other teams at 8 points, but have the fewest games played of them. Assuming Nashville holds on to be LA.

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02-07-2013, 09:21 PM
  #396
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Originally Posted by Autograph View Post
While I agree with your general sentiment/assessment of how skilled an NHL goaltender should be behind the team's play, I would really like to KNOW that our team's goaltender has the pure, natural ability to be a clutch savemaker, just as certain skaters have the ability to be a clutch goalscorer.

I'm not saying I've studied how well Irving has played in the past, but I wonder if he has the ability to stone cold rob a save.

I guess what I'm saying is, I feel like that's the difference between a Niemi and a Leighton in the Stanley Cup Final.
Last year Irving looked like a future starter in the NHL. He had very good fundamentals and was a quick and flexible butterfly goalie. All he lacks is experience. He needs to learn our system, learn the habits of our defensemen, and know the opposition.

Kipper has been playing against players like the Sedins for over a decade, hence he brings a level of poise to his goaltending. Irving has not. Keep in mind that Irving has been sitting on the bench to start the season.

He won the game. Take' er easy.

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02-07-2013, 09:22 PM
  #397
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With that win, the Flames now sit in 12th, tied with three other teams at 8 points, but have the fewest games played of them. Assuming Nashville holds on to be LA.
and only 3 points back of 8th in 3 less games.

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02-07-2013, 09:27 PM
  #398
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I think the most important part of this win is that we get to rub **** in Erixon's face.

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02-07-2013, 09:30 PM
  #399
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I think the most important part of this win is that we get to rub **** in Erixon's face.
We have been able to do that since the minute the Rangers traded him.

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02-07-2013, 09:33 PM
  #400
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and only 3 points back of 8th in 3 less games.
tied for 8th if you look at win percentage.

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