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Game 9: Kings vs. Predators Shutout Loss

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Old
02-07-2013, 11:49 PM
  #51
Shellz
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Or maybe he can walk on water too.

Once again, the last thing we want to do with our most promising offensive prospect is have him anywhere near Jarret Stoll, on or off the ice.

Let the kid play with good players and spend time with a guy like Brown to see how a real pro acts on and off the ice.

If he is in over his head ship him back to Manchester, hell there is no way he could be any worse than Stoll, Penner or King have been this year.
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Originally Posted by Chazz Reinhold View Post
There's no point in bringing Toffoli up if he's not put in a position that plays to his strengths, which is scoring goals and finding open areas around the net. Putting him on a grinding unit is not beneficial to him or the team.
Well.. I see where you guys are coming from. But, I disagree with throwing him on the first line. I don't like that idea at all. I don't want to see him with Stoll either. But, I believe the best way to grow a prospect is to be patient. People are going to expect goals from him and then he won't produce. Of course the Kings could always put him back in Manchester.. but, that's not the point. You put him with the club because you intend him to stick. I don't even think we will see him this season.

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02-07-2013, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Shellz View Post
Well.. I see where you guys are coming from. But, I disagree with throwing him on the first line. I don't like that idea at all. I don't want to see him with Stoll either. But, I believe the best way to grow a prospect is to be patient. People are going to expect goals from him and then he won't produce. Of course the Kings could always put him back in Manchester.. but, that's not the point. You put him with the club because you intend him to stick. I don't even think we will see him this season.
Which is fine with me. I don't think he should be called up this season. However, if they decide to do it for whatever reason, it's not to stick him on Stoll's line, even if just for a few games. They're calling him up to put him in a position to score goals.

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02-08-2013, 12:01 AM
  #53
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Some problems here TG.

1. 9 Games is alot in this lockout shortened season. The Kings have dug themselves a massive hole here with their play so far.

2. Time to bury last year, the Kings had a magical run, but that team is nowhere to be found, and this idea that a switch will be flipped is a little ridiculous.

3. Bringing everyone back was not a good thing. For one, Penner and Stoll are barely NHL players at this point, a total waste of over $6 million this year, and $6 more for Stoll the next two years. And in addition there doesn't seem to be very much hunger anywhere. Where is the Dwight King from last year? It just seems everyone is way to comfortable going through the motions.

4. The problems on the ice, well you mention injuries on the back end and that is valid until you consider the Kings are 30th in goals. It's the same problem it's been in the past, the Kings are built on strength down the middle and they are getting zilch from their centers. Kopitar is playing poorly, probably still not 100% recovered from the injury, but that is an excuse, he looks invisible many nights. The Kings second line has done nothing 5 on 5, Mike Richards going forward has to be looked at as being a really good 3rd line center, and whether the answer is slotting Carter over and getting a winger or trading for a center, they can't keep getting nothing from that spot, especially since it's a given they will get nothing from #28 and the 3rd line.

Hey Herby

I will give you my best shot but it is late where I am so bare with me a bit.

1. I guess I have to say that we are 3-4-2 and not out of anything just yet. I understand that we need help and to get healthy but we have 39 games left to play. Its just too early to panic for me.


2. Last year and winning the cup is still relevant because of the fact that we have the same coaching staff and the same team that just won the cup. Nobody is so old that they can no longer play at the same level and our coaches with the exception of Kompon know what is required to make this team win the cup. So it is still relevant. Now I am not saying that we should all just point at the cup at the start of every game and then send out kids who have never played the NHL game before because it no longer matters what we do, I am saying that we are the same team and have the same core in tact that just won the cup so it isn't like we need to keep searching for that magical formula that is needed to win the cup.

3. I have to admit that I am/was surprised that we brought back Penner especially when he was sought after by TO and Pit but that is what seems to happen when a team wins a cup. They get all sentimental and do some things that make you wonder. I still think that Penner will move along before the season is out but that is just me. Stoll is Stoll. I think we have players on the team and in the system who can do the same thing but he is who DL and DS believe should be there so I will give the benefit of the doubt.

I guess I am saying I agree that bringing back a few of the players outside of our true core wasn't entirely necessary but I will say again that the season though short is only 9 gams old. I mean Edm is 4-3-3 and DLS is 5-5-1 both have played more games than us and are easily within striking distance. The very fact that EDM is where it is in the standings makes my position for me sort of. If they are where they are it proves that the season has a long way still to go and that things will sort themselves out.

4. Missing the guys that we are missing causes our forwards to try and do too much to help play responsibly (or what I call too cautiously and without confidence) making us weaker all around. I was on a team once that had both of our goalies injured early on and had to bring on a kid who had quit hockey a couple of months prior.

He was brutally awful and the entire team struggled trying to keep any shot from getting on goal (his best game saw him give up four goals on 5 shots total for the game). Everyone played differently, not more defencively, just differently all around and we struggled as a result. That is what I am seeing with us more than anything else.

As for Kopitar he should have sat out until he was ready. I know that he is playing but it is easy to see he doesn't have any real confidence in his injured leg and he isn't playing close to his capabilities. I am worried a bit about MR and the way he is starting this season. He clearly still has the ability to be an elite talent in the game but it seems he is picking and choosing when he wants to bring it and that goes against what the guy is supposed to be about.

Our bottom 6 is overcrowded. I was asked who we have on the farm who is ready and would help us on our bottom 6 for energy types and I would of course go with AA and Kozy but I wouldn't bring them up right now either.

I would move Richardson for whatever I can get (this is being tried) and keep Lewis on the fourth line but that's another subject. I do like the idea of moving Stoll and having Carter slot over to second line center and MR taking over 3rd line responsibilities but not just yet. I would like to see us play healthy first.

We obviously will have to move (up down or out) one of our additional LW's and I think that Penner is the better choice but that is me. One way or another when we are totally healthy we have too many forwards and will have to do something.

We are a young team about to get younger at the end of the season and to me it is just too early to hit the panic button. We are 7 points out of first place right now so we are far from out of it. It doesn't look great right now but we have what it takes and no what it takes to win a cup and that is proven. Now can we do what it takes? That is yet to be seen but I think we will.

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02-08-2013, 12:01 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chazz Reinhold View Post
Which is fine with me. I don't think he should be called up this season. However, if they decide to do it for whatever reason, it's not to stick him on Stoll's line, even if just for a few games. They're calling him up to put him in a position to score goals.
Looks like we are stuck here then. I would just rather not see him this season because of Stoll. If he was paired with Richards, it wouldn't be the end of the world... but, at the end of the day, if he's going to be playing anywhere... it's going to be with Kopitar. I just don't want to see him rushed.

I'd love to know how long Jarret is destined to stick with the Kings though.

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02-08-2013, 12:09 AM
  #55
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This will cheer everyone up


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Old
02-08-2013, 12:09 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Shellz View Post
Looks like we are stuck here then. I would just rather not see him this season because of Stoll. If he was paired with Richards, it wouldn't be the end of the world... but, at the end of the day, if he's going to be playing anywhere... it's going to be with Kopitar. I just don't want to see him rushed.

I'd love to know how long Jarret is destined to stick with the Kings though.
Hopefully not the duration of his contract. I'm sure Lombardi realizes the Kings are going to be tight up against the cap with it dropping to $64.3 million next season, so Stoll's contract is a legitimate target to be moved for some breathing room.

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02-08-2013, 12:14 AM
  #57
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Thanks for the reply TG.

On this rare occasion I am even ahead of you as far as time goes. I am in Rio for Carnaval with some college buddies. I went back to my room at 11 to watch that disaster, and it kind of soured my night. Considering they are all Wings fans, Sunday could be ugly for me in the **** talking category.

You bring up some good points, but I am still really concerned. Especially when it comes to the 2nd and 3rd lines who have been nothing short of awful.

I realize the Kings aren't built like Chicago, but eventually you have to start scoring goals, and on a team built on centers, it's a disaster with Richards and Stoll right now, they are getting squat. We can expect Kopitar to get better, but he can't carry the offense like in years past. Right now Richards is scoring even less than the 08-11 Stoll did in the second line spot.

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02-08-2013, 12:19 AM
  #58
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Unfortunately this just isn't a good team right now. I hope that changes but it's telling when the only games we come out of feeling good about ourselves is when we are playing one of the few bad teams of the west.

I think DD has been very good defensively but he's making huge errors on the PP and he has given up either a goal or a should be goal off a turnover the last 4 games. Quick has been his best friends because these are all ending up right in the slot and there is nobody home at that point.

Kings defense has been lacking in the forward ranks. Too much watching the puck and not taking a man.

The screening is nonexistent. Rarely are our guys going to the dirty areas.

4th line has been downright poor since the third game. King is nonexistent. I don't know what happened to Frasor. They have been liabilities.

3rd line only has one goal this year. The puck possesion has been good on the third although Clifford is good for a penalty in the offensive zone a game.

On to the next one. I don't have high hopes for the Kings winning any of the next two but lets hope our boy Sutter sparks something.

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02-08-2013, 12:20 AM
  #59
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Toffoli time?



It certainly couldn't hurt
Completely agree.

Time to trade the worthless pieces, seriously. Lets get some drafts or something else in a package.
Penner, Stoll, Lewis, Fraser too,richardson. Put in toffoli vey nolan or clifford 3rd line . Do something our bottom 6 is terrible with exceptions to Nolan and Clifford. Lets get some speed, get staalberg or something. Even mix it up, try putting Toffoli on the first line. At this point Im willing to see if Toffoli will swim and excel in the NHL. I think he will. We gotta take the risk cause our team has no offense. Vey and Toffoli need to come up, trades and waivers should be done for some of our bottom 6 players.


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02-08-2013, 12:29 AM
  #60
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02-08-2013, 12:31 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Thanks for the reply TG.

On this rare occasion I am even ahead of you as far as time goes. I am in Rio for Carnaval with some college buddies. I went back to my room at 11 to watch that disaster, and it kind of soured my night. Considering they are all Wings fans, Sunday could be ugly for me in the **** talking category.

You bring up some good points, but I am still really concerned. Especially when it comes to the 2nd and 3rd lines who have been nothing short of awful.

I realize the Kings aren't built like Chicago, but eventually you have to start scoring goals, and on a team built on centers, it's a disaster with Richards and Stoll right now, they are getting squat. We can expect Kopitar to get better, but he can't carry the offense like in years past. Right now Richards is scoring even less than the 08-11 Stoll did in the second line spot.
WOW!!

Well have a truly great Carnival and in Rio wrap it twice just to be nice. Traveling with Wing fans to a religious event? Aren't you concerned knowing that you are traveling with the already dead inside?

I think we share the same concerns, I am just willing to wait a bit longer to see how things go. We need to get our bottom 6 back on track for certain and we also need to get our team back into playing overall stingy hockey but that will come.

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02-08-2013, 12:32 AM
  #62
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This team is a joke right now, they are horrible. I can just hear other teams talking...'these are the Stanley Cup Champions, right???'

I guess we can always hope for a magical run, right? I mean yeah, that should happen every year.

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02-08-2013, 12:34 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Axl Rhoadz View Post
This team is a joke right now, they are horrible. I can just hear other teams talking...'these are the Stanley Cup Champions, right???'

I guess we can always hope for a magical run, right? I mean yeah, that should happen every year.
I hate when people are so chill about sucking just cause we won the cup last season.

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02-08-2013, 12:34 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Axl Rhoadz View Post
This team is a joke right now, they are horrible. I can just hear other teams talking...'these are the Stanley Cup Champions, right???'

I guess we can always hope for a magical run, right? I mean yeah, that should happen every year.
Yes, 16-4 run to the cup is magical?

ok

That is sort path nevermind.


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02-08-2013, 12:41 AM
  #65
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Yes, 16-4 run to the cup is magical?

ok

That is sort path nevermind.

lol tg i got to admit i love he new avatar I seem to recall posting something like that in a couple of threads Nice to see we re on the same page. I m not in panic mode yet. If i hear mitchell is out for more then a week or two i may but not ready to yet.

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02-08-2013, 12:42 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
Yes, 16-4 run to the cup is magical?

ok

That is sort path nevermind.

Wait, it's not? Your second comment is not English, me no thinks.

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02-08-2013, 12:42 AM
  #67
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As crappy as the Kings are playing right now, the Nashville Predators have to be the most boring team in the league.

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02-08-2013, 12:53 AM
  #68
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I hate when people are so chill about sucking just cause we won the cup last season.
Well what, we should get as mad as we got before? That would be pointless. It's just too early to get mad right now, but if this continues for the whole season, there's going to be a lot of frustrated people here. I don't think very many people would be happy with a non-playoff season and no first round pick. There's no positives to be found in that.

Here's the way I see it. The team started the season on the road, they've only played 3 home games. Lots of people think that's a good thing but I don't, you start off with a whole bunch of road games you'll be lucky to come back home with a good record. We also suffer from having these two d-men out, and it's not because of what they do defensively, it's how much better both of them are moving the puck than Davis and Muzzin who just don't read the game as fast as them. I am just hoping this team is in decent position before that huge run of home games starts. Once it does the team can string together a lot of wins and set themselves up for a good finish.

DS also has to shake up the bottom two lines. I would put Nolan on the third and Lewis on the fourth or in the press box. He is a decent checking forward but we cannot continue to get this kind of production from third line players. He isn't and is never going to be able to put up a 20 point season which is what we have to get at minimum from third line players.


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02-08-2013, 01:01 AM
  #69
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I definitely agree that the Kings need to move some personnel, but I doubt that Dean will do it. I think he's loyal to a fault, and DL won't move players like Stoll; King and Nolan worked hard to play in the NHL, and I think DL wants to reward that.

I really wish Stoll would go, and Fraser has been brutal defensively. Penner should just be traded/waived, because if he's not going to play, it's not worth keeping him in the line-up. Sutter clearly isn't fond of his play right now.

But I don't think we'll see any core pieces moved. However, if moves are to be made, this is the absolute best time. There's a two day break in between games, and the Kings are geographically located close to the teams in the Eastern Conference if they are going to make an inter-conference trade; however, they're also close to Manchester where a call-up can quickly meet up with the team.

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02-08-2013, 01:04 AM
  #70
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So, how exactly is Lewis flying so under the radar around here? I know he is saddled with Stoll, but he's just not very good. He's played in every game on what has no doubt been our absolute worst line, he's just kinda there...
Probably because he gets paid 1/4 the cost of Stoll to be Stoll.

Before the game i started writing a post about how bad the 3rd line has been, but deleted it because i didn't want to be a negative nancy.

Its not just a case of they aren't scoring, but they are playing against bottom 6/bottom pairs and are getting destroyed out there. I had the corsi numers and such in my original post, but the essentials are they get favourable matchups, offensive zone starts, yet the opposition controls the puck the majority of the time they are on the ice.

All 3 have been awful, King mostly

Trading King would be ideal, he has high value at the moment, and Penner can do what he does with a tiny bit more skill.

Lewis I don't expect much out of anyway. Only difference i'd see is moving him to the 4th line and max his pk time, while giving Nolan his ES time.

Stoll stays on the 3rd unit to maximize boarding penalties/60 minutes

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02-08-2013, 01:04 AM
  #71
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Yep, Its just too soon to be so overly upset. If we are at the same point near the halfway point then sure, it might get tense but even then panic moves like risking destroying your top prospects by rushing them into the NHL before even they themselves believe they are ready is just nonsense.

Knee jerk over reacting is what lead us to over 40 years of fail. This team and these coaches have earned enough respect from me by winning the cup to where I am willing to let them do their jobs. I may not like what I am seeing anymore than anyone else but panicking and freaking out just doesn't do anything for anyone.

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02-08-2013, 01:08 AM
  #72
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Thanks for the reply TG.

On this rare occasion I am even ahead of you as far as time goes. I am in Rio for Carnaval with some college buddies. I went back to my room at 11 to watch that disaster, and it kind of soured my night. Considering they are all Wings fans, Sunday could be ugly for me in the **** talking category.

You bring up some good points, but I am still really concerned. Especially when it comes to the 2nd and 3rd lines who have been nothing short of awful.

I realize the Kings aren't built like Chicago, but eventually you have to start scoring goals, and on a team built on centers, it's a disaster with Richards and Stoll right now, they are getting squat. We can expect Kopitar to get better, but he can't carry the offense like in years past. Right now Richards is scoring even less than the 08-11 Stoll did in the second line spot.
Maybe you all should talk Michigan football and the coming collapse of Ohio State. Opps.

You're right about the centers. None of them are playing well right now, and for a team built like the Kings that just isn't acceptable. Mitchell and Greene also leave some pretty big holes to fill.

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02-08-2013, 01:21 AM
  #73
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King (whose worse than Penner), Lewis and Fraser continue to escape criticism.

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02-08-2013, 01:26 AM
  #74
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18 Games. Pro-rated, that's around the time the other shoe fell and Murray got fired last year. I'll take that as my official dejection/panic point. We turned it around after that last year, so I'd say we have a good long 2 or 3 weeks to right the ship. More than enough time.

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02-08-2013, 01:29 AM
  #75
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It's been a while since we saw a solid 60 minute outing from this team. May have to go back to 2012...

After Sunday's game, about 20% of the season will have passed. If this team is going to gear up for the playoffs, they better snap out of it quickly or they're going to be left in the dust.

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