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Berger: Leafs, Sens Targeting Stephen Weiss

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Old
02-07-2013, 11:45 PM
  #126
Emerica
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Spez out indefinitely this season, thus why they're asking, I imagine. He's a center, he's not a winger
If we're trading for Weiss, it better not be a rental.

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02-07-2013, 11:53 PM
  #127
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well the panthers definitely wouldnt trade him now, IF they do itll be more towards the deadline and we would have to be out of it. then if thats the case a 1st in this years draft will start get things going. dont see a move of some "good" prospects and lesser picks, only way prospects are included and not a 1st is if its a really strong prospect, and i dont see a team offering that. and a playoff team looking to get him will not offer any strong position players for him either.

in other words, he wont be moved now, possibly towards deadline time, only if the panthers are decently out of it, then a 1st in '13 would be the basis of a potential trade. unless the leafs are willing to trade kessel now for him haha but that wont happen.

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02-07-2013, 11:53 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Spez out indefinitely this season, thus why they're asking, I imagine. He's a center, he's not a winger
And when Spezza gets back later in the season he's getting booted to wing, hence the question.

I love Weiss, was a guy I wanted Ottawa to trade up for in his draft year, but he's not a fit right now unless he'll go for Ottawa's spare parts (which he won't for obvious reasons).

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02-07-2013, 11:59 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by FrolikFan67 View Post
well the panthers definitely wouldnt trade him now, IF they do itll be more towards the deadline and we would have to be out of it. then if thats the case a 1st in this years draft will start get things going. dont see a move of some "good" prospects and lesser picks, only way prospects are included and not a 1st is if its a really strong prospect, and i dont see a team offering that. and a playoff team looking to get him will not offer any strong position players for him either.

in other words, he wont be moved now, possibly towards deadline time, only if the panthers are decently out of it, then a 1st in '13 would be the basis of a potential trade. unless the leafs are willing to trade kessel now for him haha but that wont happen.
Ya, I have a feeling you'll be extremely disappointed with the return if Weiss does indeed get traded.

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02-08-2013, 12:15 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Emerica View Post
If we're trading for Weiss, it better not be a rental.
Then expect Spez or Turris to be moved somewhere, Weiss isn't a winger. It's a dumb question.

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Originally Posted by stempniaksen View Post
And when Spezza gets back later in the season he's getting booted to wing, hence the question.

I love Weiss, was a guy I wanted Ottawa to trade up for in his draft year, but he's not a fit right now unless he'll go for Ottawa's spare parts (which he won't for obvious reasons).
He won't be, slide Turris.

Tallon wants Weiss re-signed, he sure as hell isn't going for spare parts.

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Originally Posted by Emerica View Post
Ya, I have a feeling you'll be extremely disappointed with the return if Weiss does indeed get traded.
Perhaps, but Panthers need him and are in the hunt, so unless there's a cant say no trade offer, he'll be in a Panther sweater all season.

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02-08-2013, 12:31 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Then expect Spez or Turris to be moved somewhere, Weiss isn't a winger. It's a dumb question.



He won't be, slide Turris.

Tallon wants Weiss re-signed, he sure as hell isn't going for spare parts.



Perhaps, but Panthers need him and are in the hunt, so unless there's a cant say no trade offer, he'll be in a Panther sweater all season.

Good. I don't want him in Ottawa.

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02-08-2013, 01:12 AM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Emerica View Post
Good. I don't want him in Ottawa.
Neither do I.

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02-08-2013, 01:43 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
He won't be, slide Turris. Tallon wants Weiss re-signed, he sure as hell isn't going for spare parts.
We won't slide Turris for the same reasons you advocate keeping Weiss at center. I don't think anyone in this thread has said that he will go for spare parts, just that the two teams Berger said have interest are bad fits rights now.

This is one of those threads where everyone can move along, as it doesn't seem there is a fit for Weiss to move to these teams, or for the Panthers to move him in the first place.

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02-08-2013, 01:44 AM
  #134
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02-08-2013, 01:54 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by stempniaksen View Post
We won't slide Turris for the same reasons you advocate keeping Weiss at center. I don't think anyone in this thread has said that he will go for spare parts, just that the two teams Berger said have interest are bad fits rights now.

This is one of those threads where everyone can move along, as it doesn't seem there is a fit for Weiss to move to these teams, or for the Panthers to move him in the first place.
Agreed, and I didn't expect him to move, just trying to point out why Weiss would stay at the C

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02-08-2013, 06:27 AM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Spez out indefinitely this season, thus why they're asking, I imagine. He's a center, he's not a winger
Yeah... but are you REALLY going to give up the substantial rental price for Weiss, a player you have no space to resign?

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02-08-2013, 06:37 AM
  #137
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Please take him Ottawa.

He is an upgrade, sure. But I don't see him in our future; Just another patch work, like always.
My thoughts exactly.

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02-08-2013, 06:40 AM
  #138
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The leafs need a proven first line centre. This could turn out to be another Connoly, not a first line centre, just another centre

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02-08-2013, 07:29 AM
  #139
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The thing that confuses me though is, what is the point of acquiring him? I don't see Weiss making the Leafs any better than are right now. Is he a replacement for Bozak? Is he really any better than Bozak?

I see the Leafs are a fringe playoff team and are missing a couple of pieces to be a legitimate team and Weiss isn't one of those pieces.

And like you said what would be the cost of acquiring him? Florida is still a rebuilding team and I think Tallon would be looking for draft picks/NHL ready prospects for him - something the Leafs absolutely cannot trade for anyone.
I have watched Bozak from day 1, I have no issue saying Weiss is better then Bozak. Weiss deserves to be in a teams top 6 Bozak does not Weiss is a 55-60 point player and that with the panthers put him with phil I see him hitting 65 points Bozak not a chance. Weiss is not the perfect solution but he is without ANY question an upgrade.

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02-08-2013, 07:47 AM
  #140
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Can we please stop with the "Don't need Weiss, Grabo is better" ****? It doesn't matter if he's better or not, Grabovski and Kessel don't work together. Weiss would get a shot at playing with Kessel, and I think we can all agree that he'd do a better job than Bozak in that offensive role. He's a great playmaker, and between Kessel and Lupul/JVR, it'd give the Leafs a great 1st scoring line.

Comparing two players like that isn't a helpful representation of how successful they can be when you're totally changing the situation they will be playing in.

I for one don't believe Nonis has any intention of tanking this year, and I think the fans who want that aren't thinking realistically. The East is wide open this year, and if you can improve your team in any way, a GM like Nonis will do it. Moving a good prospect, a young player and picks wouldn't be out of the question.

Maybe deal like Ross/McKegg + Blacker/Percy + 2nd (could be conditional, becomes a 1st if the Leafs advance to a certain round of the playoffs.

I must admit, I don't know heaps about the Florida farm system, and Hockey's Future can only provide so much info.

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02-08-2013, 07:47 AM
  #141
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Trading for Weiss would be a terrible move for Toronto, unless only roster players were involved.

Toronto should be SELLING this year, NOT buying. We don't have a single franchise player, and overall a pretty weak core. We should be trying trade proven players for picks/prospects that MIGHT get us the franchise player(s) we need.

It's the choice between going with players proven to give us mediocrity, or take a chance at some picks/prospects, and if they don't turn out, so what, we're still mediocre so we didn't exactly get much worse.

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02-08-2013, 07:56 AM
  #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
Yeah... but are you REALLY going to give up the substantial rental price for Weiss, a player you have no space to resign?
Um, who says we have no space to resign him? You mean the people reporting these rumors about Weiss who are perpetuating the idea that FL can't afford him? Cause those are untrue and Florida has plenty of cap space & money to re-sign Weiss (I know firsthand since I work for the Panthers owner but not for the Panthers). Tallon has expressed several different times that they intend to re-sign him and it doesnt sound like money is a huge issue at all (most likely term). They just want to sign him to a fair deal where they dont break the bank (aka being budget conscious) and don't cause too much of a roadblock for the future prospects like Bjugstad, etc. And Weiss has expressed at several junctures that he wants to be like his idols (Yzerman, etc) who stayed with one team their entire career.

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02-08-2013, 08:00 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
Trading for Weiss would be a terrible move for Toronto, unless only roster players were involved.

Toronto should be SELLING this year, NOT buying. We don't have a single franchise player, and overall a pretty weak core. We should be trying trade proven players for picks/prospects that MIGHT get us the franchise player(s) we need.

It's the choice between going with players proven to give us mediocrity, or take a chance at some picks/prospects, and if they don't turn out, so what, we're still mediocre so we didn't exactly get much worse.
What are the odds that our prospects turn into Weiss, a player that would not only improve the Leafs now, but would be a helpful piece for years to come. Do you really think that management are going to support a full-on fire sale? Has that happened through the last 25 years? 30 years?

While the team has useful pieces, they will attempt to get to the playoffs. In a shortened schedule, without Burke's "Don't get into the 8th spot and get slaughtered" philosophy, Nonis will try to improve the team to make the post-season.

This isn't the best way to go about things, I just think it's the most likely outcome with the current management, ownership and league situation. IMO.

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02-08-2013, 08:02 AM
  #144
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Haha, you guys make me laugh on this board. We already have a Weiss, his name is Tim Connoly.

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02-08-2013, 08:04 AM
  #145
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Weiss isn't getting moved to either of these teams, if Tallon wanted to trade him which is highly unlikely considering Weiss wanted to stay for the rebuild, he would demand a first at the very least. The leafs already have Grabovski, and the Sens are stacked at center for the future. Not worth the price it would cost to get him as a rental.

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02-08-2013, 08:06 AM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Morlesio14 View Post
The leafs need a proven first line centre. This could turn out to be another Connoly, not a first line centre, just another centre
Well he's not just another centre. He's a solid second line centre. Plays in the 1st line cause Florida is in the same boat as toronto. You say toronto needs a 1st line centre. How long would you like to wait because it has been years since they had one. I would rather have Weiss and grabovski 2 solid second line centres then having 1 solid second line centres and a bunch of 3c and 4c. But you sit there and enjoy watching this team without a 1c for the next little while. Maybe years.

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02-08-2013, 08:16 AM
  #147
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Originally Posted by david999 View Post
Haha, you guys make me laugh on this board. We already have a Weiss, his name is Tim Connoly.
You make me laugh too. Compare a guy who cleared waivers to a guy helping his team into a playoff spot.

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02-08-2013, 08:19 AM
  #148
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Well he's not just another centre. He's a solid second line centre. Plays in the 1st line cause Florida is in the same boat as toronto. You say toronto needs a 1st line centre. How long would you like to wait because it has been years since they had one. I would rather have Weiss and grabovski 2 solid second line centres then having 1 solid second line centres and a bunch of 3c and 4c. But you sit there and enjoy watching this team without a 1c for the next little while. Maybe years.
I'd rather move Kadri up the line-up tbh. I agree that Weiss on the cheap is an ok move for us but not worth moving much for.

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02-08-2013, 08:26 AM
  #149
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Haha, you guys make me laugh on this board. We already have a Weiss, his name is Tim Connoly.
Stop.

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02-08-2013, 08:45 AM
  #150
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What are the odds that our prospects turn into Weiss, a player that would not only improve the Leafs now, but would be a helpful piece for years to come. Do you really think that management are going to support a full-on fire sale? Has that happened through the last 25 years? 30 years?
.
I do agree Weiss can be a useful piece. But I'd prefer to not trade for him. I think we could do a good job selling off assets, and then in the offseason target (trying to remain somewhat realistic, aka not putting down Getzlaf/Perry):

- Backstrom (short term goalie upgrade)
-a forward with a mix of size/skill (Clowe, Morrow, Horton, Penner, Clarkson, etc)
- a veteran defensive Dman (Lydman, Scuderi, Smid, etc)
- an upgrade at C (Weiss, Filpulla, etc)

I think we can get assets at the trade deadline via selling players off, and then fill some holes in the offseason with some smart free agent signings. As opposed to trading away assets to try and fill those holes. If it's just a secondary piece (like Weiss), then that's the type of piece we should pick up in free agency or an offseason trade, not one we should buy at trade deadline prices when prices are literally the highest they'll be all year.

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