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The Winger Acquisition Thread | Part III: In Search of Wingers with Reverent Hands

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02-08-2013, 01:25 PM
  #51
66-29-33
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Originally Posted by Lost in Crafton View Post
the quibbling over draft picks is truly astounding.
The first 2 rounds are 1st round talent deep, that's why. We need to draft 2 forwards in this draft.

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02-08-2013, 01:29 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
The first 2 rounds are 1st round talent deep, that's why. We need to draft 2 forwards in this draft.
I said the same last week, people don't care about picks. It's win now mode for them and Sid and Geno are still young, that's what I don't get. The window isn't closing anytime soon

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02-08-2013, 01:33 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by IcedCapp View Post
I'm all for this, but people are unhappy with the Geno Line's 5-on-5 production, and it has slipped recently.

The one thing I would say is: I think giving Boychuk 10 games with that line would be nice. That's a preseason/training camp. Now, you don't have forever, because the shortened season means you can't throw games away, but I still think Boychuk has a place on this team.

edit: but I don't consider a trade for kulemin panicky.
Well, it's about 70% of last year's production for Malkin and Neal at ES. Malkin is even on the year and pointless with Boychuk. Neal is a minus player. But, he's 6th in scoring, so it's no biggie for some, WarmCocoa

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02-08-2013, 01:33 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
The first 2 rounds are 1st round talent deep, that's why. We need to draft 2 forwards in this draft.
If we can find 2 long term options for the wing slots, I have zip zero problem trading high draft picks. They can't be for guys who will be here for a year or two...they need to be here for 5 or 6 years.

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02-08-2013, 01:33 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Le Magnifique 66 View Post
I said the same last week, people don't care about picks. It's win now mode for them and Sid and Geno are still young, that's what I don't get. The window isn't closing anytime soon
malkin and letang aren't guarantees to be here in 3+ years.

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02-08-2013, 01:34 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Le Magnifique 66 View Post
I said the same last week, people don't care about picks. It's win now mode for them and Sid and Geno are still young, that's what I don't get. The window isn't closing anytime soon
It is win now, but you can't trade picks every year. Don't waste picks on the Seto/Stewarts, put it towards the Perrys. As long as we have Crosby/Malkin, it will always be win now mode, so some years it's ok to keep the picks (like this year, unless we get Perry).

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02-08-2013, 01:35 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
The first 2 rounds are 1st round talent deep, that's why. We need to draft 2 forwards in this draft.
Richard Park was the last meaningful Pens second rounder (forgot Goligoski and the last two look good, but historically we've been putrid in the second round). forgive me if i find the pick expendable. moreover if the some incredible talent does fall, there's always the possibility of trading the likes of Martin at the draft.

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02-08-2013, 01:35 PM
  #58
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I feel like the fans are getting brainwashed by Shero. We must keep every single prospect dman! They are all sure things.

Some of these guys won't pan out. Some won't make this team for years. It took Whitney and gogo 7 years from the time they were drafted until they were valuable enough to trade.

If you guys want to wait around until Sid and geno are in their 30s until they are surrounded with proper players and can continue to watch experiments fail year after year, more power to you.

Boychuk makes a play along the boards and he deserves to play with Geno. Do you realize how much of a joke it is that he plays with geno? It's pathetic.

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02-08-2013, 01:35 PM
  #59
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Understandable. If we could do it with a 2nd+lesser asset then great.
Someone on the trade forum thread suggested making it a 2nd that can become a 1st if the Pens make the stanley cup finals this year.

Frankly, the only way that happens is IF Kulemin kills it with Malkin, because the Pens don't get to the finals without Geno clicking on all cylinders, which is to say it would be worth it then.

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02-08-2013, 01:36 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
I believe they were taken out of play all together.

Tampa series saw neither Sid or Geno, and how does this matter now that they're back?

The Tampa series can't be compared to anything they're going through now. Nothing.

Both Sid and Geno scored last playoffs against the Flyers, and it was their defensive body of work all together that cost them their most recent 1st round exit. They've been knocked out of the 1st round both with and without their centers and with good enough wingers.
The Tampa series proved how little offensive talent we have outside of Sid/Geno.

And Sid was largely shutdown when Philly decided to play some semblance of defensive hockey. Geno had two top 6 linemates and couldn't consistently produce at ES against Philly's matchup.

We have secondary scoring issues whether you see them or not.

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02-08-2013, 01:37 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by nhindian View Post
Maybe I'm not as familiar with Stewart, but that kinda seems like a lot to give up.

If people around are to be trusted, Harrington is a future stud D with captain potential. Even went so far as to be called a "sure thing"
Every Penguins top defensive prospect is a future stud, and legit top six winger options for the Pens to pluck from within or from around the league are limitless.

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02-08-2013, 01:38 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
It is win now, but you can't trade picks every year. Don't waste picks on the Seto/Stewarts, put it towards the Perrys. As long as we have Crosby/Malkin, it will always be win now mode, so some years it's ok to keep the picks (like this year, unless we get Perry).
And people who want to horde picks believe that every winger will turn into a Perry, or a Hossa, or a Giroux. Fact is, it's a complete crap shoot. At least with an NHL player, you know what you're getting, and hopefully Shero trades the picks for a guy who is young and has some potential to realize still.

I have more confidence in trading for Setoguchi and Stewart and having them turn into legitimate top 6 forwards than drafting one, waiting 2 or 3 years (and probably more for a pick late in each round), then letting them get their wits about them in the NHL, and then maybe, 6-8 years down the line they turn into a top 6 forward.

That's just my theory on things. We can trade picks, potentially sacrifice the future (potentially being the key word) to find guys who could help now and later.

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02-08-2013, 01:39 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
It is win now, but you can't trade picks every year. Don't waste picks on the Seto/Stewarts, put it towards the Perrys. As long as we have Crosby/Malkin, it will always be win now mode, so some years it's ok to keep the picks (like this year, unless we get Perry).
Hint, hint, Shero did nothing last year with anything of significance. The year before he traded Goligoski for Neal & Niskanen plus a 7th for Kovalev.

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02-08-2013, 01:39 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
Letang, Despres, Bortuzzo, Engelland, Dumoulin, Morrow. And that's if all three of Orpik, Nisky and Martin are shipped out. He's not making an impact on this team for quite some time.

If it gets us Sid's longterm winger, Scott Harrington who.
Heck, someone asked me last night what happens with Kennedy and Boychuk if we get two top six wingers and slide Duperstar to L3 RW.

I suggested that they could go dance the hully gully for all I cared.

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02-08-2013, 01:39 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
Someone on the trade forum thread suggested making it a 2nd that can become a 1st if the Pens make the stanley cup finals this year.

Frankly, the only way that happens is IF Kulemin kills it with Malkin, because the Pens don't get to the finals without Geno clicking on all cylinders, which is to say it would be worth it then.
I'd be down with that.

But hey, why should we make things easier for our star players in the playoffs. Let's keep all of our D prospects and high picks and hope for the best. Maybe they'll make an impact in a few years.

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02-08-2013, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
And people who want to horde picks believe that every winger will turn into a Perry, or a Hossa, or a Giroux. Fact is, it's a complete crap shoot. At least with an NHL player, you know what you're getting, and hopefully Shero trades the picks for a guy who is young and has some potential to realize still.

I have more confidence in trading for Setoguchi and Stewart and having them turn into legitimate top 6 forwards than drafting one, waiting 2 or 3 years (and probably more for a pick late in each round), then letting them get their wits about them in the NHL, and then maybe, 6-8 years down the line they turn into a top 6 forward.

That's just my theory on things. We can trade picks, potentially sacrifice the future (potentially being the key word) to find guys who could help now and later.
Trade for Perry, sign him for 8 years, win-win.

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02-08-2013, 01:41 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Le Magnifique 66 View Post
I'm telling you the price some people would be willing to pay for some of these players let's just be happy they're not the GM of this team!
Yes, let's be happy with Dupuis and Boychuk in the top six for the playoffs of another year of Sid's and Geno's prime. After all, Maata could be somebody before Geno turns 30.

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02-08-2013, 01:42 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
Hint, hint, Shero did nothing last year with anything of significance. The year before he traded Goligoski for Neal & Niskanen plus a 7th for Kovalev.
I'm more talking first 2 rounds. Not worried about a later pick, unless the team that got ours drafts a Datsyuk.

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02-08-2013, 01:42 PM
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Staal and Talbot. What happens when Sid/Geno are completely taken out of the play by proper shutdown units. Kunitz and Dupuis had a combined two goals in that Tampa series.

Staal is gone, we didn't replace his offense at ES. One move is absolutely necessary. Two, ideal.
Look what Philly did. They mugged Malkin and dared Kunitz/Neal to make plays and support Malkin properly. That's why I want a guy like Kulemin there.

What happens this year when they mug Sid and dare Kunitz and Dupuis to make plays.

Maybe Shero will say this summer 'but I've still got Olli Maatta.

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02-08-2013, 01:44 PM
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Heck, someone asked me last night what happens with Kennedy and Boychuk if we get two top six wingers and slide Duperstar to L3 RW.

I suggested that they could go dance the hully gully for all I cared.
TK will be gone. And Boychuk either back on waivers with the confidence knowing he can be an NHL player or as a reserve forward if Tangradi/Jeffrey are moved.

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02-08-2013, 01:44 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
I believe they were taken out of play all together.

Tampa series saw neither Sid or Geno, and how does this matter now that they're back?

The Tampa series can't be compared to anything they're going through now. Nothing.

Both Sid and Geno scored last playoffs against the Flyers, and it was their defensive body of work all together that cost them their most recent 1st round exit. They've been knocked out of the 1st round both with and without their centers and with good enough wingers.
If you think the Pens only problem was their defensive work and that Sid and Geno would've scored on anyone with the linemates they had even if the other team's goalie didn't leak like a sieve, then let me have a few ounces of whatever you're snorting.

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02-08-2013, 01:45 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Til the End of Time View Post
malkin and letang aren't guarantees to be here in 3+ years.
Maybe if we still have Olli Maatta and Scott Harrington?

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02-08-2013, 01:47 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
And people who want to horde picks believe that every winger will turn into a Perry, or a Hossa, or a Giroux. Fact is, it's a complete crap shoot. At least with an NHL player, you know what you're getting, and hopefully Shero trades the picks for a guy who is young and has some potential to realize still.

I have more confidence in trading for Setoguchi and Stewart and having them turn into legitimate top 6 forwards than drafting one, waiting 2 or 3 years (and probably more for a pick late in each round), then letting them get their wits about them in the NHL, and then maybe, 6-8 years down the line they turn into a top 6 forward.

That's just my theory on things. We can trade picks, potentially sacrifice the future (potentially being the key word) to find guys who could help now and later.
Apparently, your (our) theory is flawed.

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02-08-2013, 01:50 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
And people who want to horde picks believe that every winger will turn into a Perry, or a Hossa, or a Giroux. Fact is, it's a complete crap shoot. At least with an NHL player, you know what you're getting, and hopefully Shero trades the picks for a guy who is young and has some potential to realize still.

I have more confidence in trading for Setoguchi and Stewart and having them turn into legitimate top 6 forwards than drafting one, waiting 2 or 3 years (and probably more for a pick late in each round), then letting them get their wits about them in the NHL, and then maybe, 6-8 years down the line they turn into a top 6 forward.

That's just my theory on things. We can trade picks, potentially sacrifice the future (potentially being the key word) to find guys who could help now and later.
Yep. It's either one or the other with this board. If we can't get Perry or Iginla, we might as well just stick with what we got.

I was all for Parise in the summer b/c you don't pass up the opportunity to get a guy like that. But that's free agency and Shero didn't see any other upgrades. If a deal is there for a longterm solution before Perry/Iggy are available, you take it.

As a GM, it's just smart asset management to move expendable assets for longterm solutions at positions of weakness.

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02-08-2013, 01:52 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
Yep. It's either one or the other with this board. If we can't get Perry or Iginla, we might as well just stick with what we got.

I was all for Parise in the summer b/c you don't pass up the opportunity to get a guy like that. But that's free agency and Shero didn't see any other upgrades. If a deal is there for a longterm solution before Perry/Iggy are available, you take it.

As a GM, it's just smart asset management to move expendable assets for longterm solutions at positions of weakness.
But, Maatta, Harrington, Bennett, Niskanen, a 1st, and Iceburgh aren't expendable.

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