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Old
02-07-2013, 07:56 PM
  #101
topchowda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post
How about games played and cap hit? Or is that inconsistant too...?

As for Dubnyk vs, Schneider, please, start a poll. I'll get the MJ-popcorn .gif ready.
Didnt say that Dubnyk is as good as Schnieder overall, just saying he was using two different set of stats. Yes Schneider has put up better numbers in the past but Dubnyk is currently playing as a similar level.

So by going of the idea that past stats indicate future preformance Hemsky would be much better.

If you wanted to bring in a cap hit per games played then on that basis one could say Gagner = Kesler (lol hes not) but if your gunna reach for an argument then that can also be brought up

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Old
02-07-2013, 08:00 PM
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilersfan87 View Post
Dubnyk>Schneider


Oh my god. I'm in tears.

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Old
02-07-2013, 09:45 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by CanuckCity View Post
This has got to be the worst responses as a whole from Edmonton fans i've ever seen. For the rest of your fan base's sake i hope this thread gets buried and deleted faast. I usually try to avoid posting but after reading the 1st page i couldn't resist. Hate to label a teams fan base off of several posters...but this was just absolutely embarrassing. Thank god you aren't ever going anywhere near your team other than in the stands.

I'm speaking out of generalization here i know some of the edm posters weren't as delusional as the rest.
Shouldn't you be saying the same about the Vancouver fanbase for saying the following:

Schneider + Ballard = Yakupov.

And to have another poster, saying they would not take Yak + Petry + draft for Schneider?
lol

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Old
02-07-2013, 09:48 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilersfan87 View Post
Why would the oilers do this?
Hemsky>>>Higgins
Fistric>>>Ballard (when you take contract into account)
Dubnyk>Schneider (Dubynk is an average starter while Schneider is an elite backup)
Schneider is an elite backup. He's also an above average starter.

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Old
02-08-2013, 03:00 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by rockinghockey View Post
We have Schultz, Schultz, Smid and Petry in our top 4, I don't see Ballard taking any of those spots. So we are going to pay Ballard 4.2mil to play on the 3rd pairing when we can pay Fistric about 1.75mil plus Fistric is exactly what we need on the 3rd pairing. It would also be nice to have Crosby, Malkin, Tavres and Getzlaf as your 4 centremen but a team can't afford that can they and there are only so many minutes to go around.
Well Schultz & Smid -Ballard would be an upgrade on both IMO.

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Old
02-08-2013, 03:08 AM
  #106
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With how Dubnyk has played over the course of last year and this year I would not trade him straight up for Schneider.

Schneider has done nothing to warrant his overrated value. The starting position was his and he has already blown it.

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Old
02-08-2013, 03:12 AM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakydave View Post
Well Schultz & Smid -Ballard would be an upgrade on both IMO.
Pretty debatable most who watch all likely disagree.

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Old
02-08-2013, 03:19 AM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
With how Dubnyk has played over the course of last year and this year I would not trade him straight up for Schneider.

Schneider has done nothing to warrant his overrated value. The starting position was his and he has already blown it.
You couldn't be more correct or in tune with reality. Canucks have no hope whatsoever in goal - close to the worst goaltending in the league. And the rest of the team is even worse. Canucks only hope is to blow the team up and start from scratch. Maybe if they are lucky they can become such losers that they fall into last place three years in a row and pick up the rewards of being losers - 1st overall picks. One day - dare I say it - they may be as great as the Edmonton LotteryDrafts.

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Old
02-08-2013, 12:05 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by MessierII View Post
Pretty debatable most who watch all likely disagree.
You mean most edm fans.I'm not saying anything disparaging about those 2 players.The 3 of them (their respective stats)are pretty comparable N.Schultz .17ppg & a( -) player in his last 6 seasons- L. Smid .14ppg( - )player 4 of his last 6 seasons
K.Ballard .31 ppg(-) player in 3 of his 7 seasons.
Again I am not saying Smid or Schultz are poor players but Ballard is just as good defencively & playing in the top 4 will put up more points(read upgrade).
I'll grant you he has had a couple of seasons where he could not get into the top 4 struggled with the system & injuries but that seems to be behind him now & neither Smid nor Schultz would be in vancouvers top 4 either.

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Old
02-08-2013, 12:11 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Socratic Method Man View Post
You couldn't be more correct or in tune with reality. Canucks have no hope whatsoever in goal - close to the worst goaltending in the league. And the rest of the team is even worse. Canucks only hope is to blow the team up and start from scratch. Maybe if they are lucky they can become such losers that they fall into last place three years in a row and pick up the rewards of being losers - 1st overall picks. One day - dare I say it - they may be as great as the Edmonton LotteryDrafts.
Sarcasm. The lowest form of humor.

But all that matters are the facts:

Schneider - .908
Dubnyk - .923

And that actually includes the 6 goal drubbing he got from San Jose.

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Old
02-08-2013, 12:27 PM
  #111
freakydave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Sarcasm. The lowest form of humor.

But all that matters are the facts:

Schneider - .908
Dubnyk - .923

And that actually includes the 6 goal drubbing he got from San Jose.
41-19-4 gaa 2.27 SV.926 Schneider
40-46-16 2.83 .911 DD

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Old
02-08-2013, 12:56 PM
  #112
MessierII
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakydave View Post
You mean most edm fans.I'm not saying anything disparaging about those 2 players.The 3 of them (their respective stats)are pretty comparable N.Schultz .17ppg & a( -) player in his last 6 seasons- L. Smid .14ppg( - )player 4 of his last 6 seasons
K.Ballard .31 ppg(-) player in 3 of his 7 seasons.
Again I am not saying Smid or Schultz are poor players but Ballard is just as good defencively & playing in the top 4 will put up more points(read upgrade).
I'll grant you he has had a couple of seasons where he could not get into the top 4 struggled with the system & injuries but that seems to be behind him now & neither Smid nor Schultz would be in vancouvers top 4 either.
Ballard has never put up points in Vancouver. He can't block shots like Smid, doesn't play as physical as Smid, doesn't have the stick and gap controll of Schultz is more injury prone and more expensive. Debatable at best.

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Old
02-08-2013, 01:07 PM
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Sarcasm. The lowest form of humor.

But all that matters are the facts:

Schneider - .908
Dubnyk - .923

And that actually includes the 6 goal drubbing he got from San Jose.
Stop with the ridiculousness.
Schneider has been better than Dubnyk at every level in their respective careers except for the short sample size of this season. Lets not make Oilers fans look bad with comments like these.
I'm encouraged by Dubnyk's play this season but just looking at pedigree, raw ability and the eye test, Schneider is and will likely always be the better goalie.

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Old
02-08-2013, 01:13 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commie View Post
Shouldn't you be saying the same about the Vancouver fanbase for saying the following:

Schneider + Ballard = Yakupov.

And to have another poster, saying they would not take Yak + Petry + draft for Schneider?
lol
I wrote that. But then again, I have watched GENERATIONS of players grow up, get drafted, pan out , or not pan out. Have good seasons, have lousy seasons, get injured dont get injured. Be high maintenance be low maintenance, switch coaches, switch GMs switch owners , get traded, not get traded. Get dog housed, not get dog housed. Get adored, get hated .

Yakupov is a total mystery. To sit there and say that this russian player, who is not going to be LOW maintenance, who can at any time BOLT back to the KHL , is going to be some sure fire NHL super star is bananas.

The oilers have NO IDEA if he is going to pan out in the dressing room or mesh with the system. He is a total mystery .

I didnt say Schneider and Ballard was worth RNH . I didnt say they were worth Jordan Eberle.

Nor did I offer up Schneider and Ballard for Taylor Hall.

But yeah, I offer them up for Yakupov.

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Old
02-08-2013, 01:19 PM
  #115
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Ballard would be Edmonton's best Defensemen.

Schneider would be Edmonton's best player for the next 10 years.

That is all.

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Old
02-08-2013, 01:23 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
Stop with the ridiculousness.
Schneider has been better than Dubnyk at every level in their respective careers except for the short sample size of this season. Lets not make Oilers fans look bad with comments like these.
I'm encouraged by Dubnyk's play this season but just looking at pedigree, raw ability and the eye test, Schneider is and will likely always be the better goalie.
Just because you've bought into the hype and feel you must abide by the unwritten HF rule that you must bow down to the status quo doesn't mean I have to.

Schneider might have been good playing back up on a team with huge depth on defense, but Dubnyk's been doing it since the last half of last year and all of this year minus that one game against SJS.

This is a "what have you done for me lately" world and the reality is Schneider blew his chance at taking the reigns of start position in Vancouver with his shoddy play this season. As it stands, I don't care what Schneider did playing limited sheltered games behind stellar D when Dubnyk has been shining in the spot light behind what most on HF considered to be the worst D corp in the league.

So until we see Schneider actually man up and show he can handle more than a handful of games here or there like Dubnyk is showing, then there is no way I'd ever consider trading him just because you don't want to "make Oil fans look bad". Grow a pair.

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Old
02-08-2013, 01:49 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MessierII View Post
Ballard has never put up points in Vancouver. He can't block shots like Smid, doesn't play as physical as Smid, doesn't have the stick and gap controll of Schultz is more injury prone and more expensive. Debatable at best.
Smid >> Ballard > Nick Schultz

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Old
02-08-2013, 02:02 PM
  #118
freakydave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
Smid >> Ballard > Nick Schultz
Just curious as to why your of that opinion?
If Smid >>Ballard--do you think smid could crack vancouver's top 4 & who would he displace ?

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Old
02-08-2013, 02:07 PM
  #119
Flair Hay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Just because you've bought into the hype and feel you must abide by the unwritten HF rule that you must bow down to the status quo doesn't mean I have to.

Schneider might have been good playing back up on a team with huge depth on defense, but Dubnyk's been doing it since the last half of last year and all of this year minus that one game against SJS.

This is a "what have you done for me lately" world and the reality is Schneider blew his chance at taking the reigns of start position in Vancouver with his shoddy play this season. As it stands, I don't care what Schneider did playing limited sheltered games behind stellar D when Dubnyk has been shining in the spot light behind what most on HF considered to be the worst D corp in the league.

So until we see Schneider actually man up and show he can handle more than a handful of games here or there like Dubnyk is showing, then there is no way I'd ever consider trading him just because you don't want to "make Oil fans look bad". Grow a pair.
This post is what I would show someone if I needed to define how to make a compelling, sound argument based on a false premise. The "what have you done for me lately world" is for the media to keep driving stories. Dubnyk is progressing nicely for sure, but as long as you continue to hold it against Schneider that he was playing behind a top 5 goalie from the last 3 years, everything you base off of tht is just wrong. He managed to increase his playing time because of his play.

"Already blew it"...it's pretty clear what your trying to accomplish here. Something tells me you'd e signing a different tune if his logo was different.

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Old
02-08-2013, 02:08 PM
  #120
freakydave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MessierII View Post
Ballard has never put up points in Vancouver. He can't block shots like Smid, doesn't play as physical as Smid, doesn't have the stick and gap controll of Schultz is more injury prone and more expensive. Debatable at best.
He's playing 3rd pairing with little to no PP time in Vancouver??? Seriously

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Old
02-08-2013, 02:13 PM
  #121
topchowda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarko2004 View Post
Ballard would be Edmonton's best Defensemen.

Schneider would be Edmonton's best player for the next 10 years.

That is all.
Ballard might take Nick Schultzs spot. But IMO Smid is a much better defenseman. YOu can bring in all the ppg stats you want but Smid is a pure defensive defenseman

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Old
02-08-2013, 02:13 PM
  #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
Just because you've bought into the hype and feel you must abide by the unwritten HF rule that you must bow down to the status quo doesn't mean I have to.

Schneider might have been good playing back up on a team with huge depth on defense, but Dubnyk's been doing it since the last half of last year and all of this year minus that one game against SJS.

This is a "what have you done for me lately" world and the reality is Schneider blew his chance at taking the reigns of start position in Vancouver with his shoddy play this season. As it stands, I don't care what Schneider did playing limited sheltered games behind stellar D when Dubnyk has been shining in the spot light behind what most on HF considered to be the worst D corp in the league.

So until we see Schneider actually man up and show he can handle more than a handful of games here or there like Dubnyk is showing, then there is no way I'd ever consider trading him just because you don't want to "make Oil fans look bad". Grow a pair.
Come back when you have watched Schneider play. He has play exceptional during his time in Vancouver aside from his first period this season. You make these ridiculous assumptions like "Schneider blew his chance" when he started last game and is likely to start the next one and "shoddy play this season" are you kidding me with this crap? Yes, Dubnyk is having a good start and very well could become a very good goalie, but that's no reason to make **** up about Schneider and look at the stat line after the first 10 games to determine someone's worth.

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Old
02-08-2013, 02:15 PM
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by topchowda View Post
Ballard would be bottom pairing still. Its sad to see to comments like these
I don't know, he would be fighting for a top 4 role for sure. Just like any oiler defenseman would be on our bottom pairing.

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02-08-2013, 02:17 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by live playoff hockey View Post
I don't know, he would be fighting for a top 4 role for sure. Just like any oiler defenseman would be on our bottom pairing.
Except for Schultz that guy is sick and still getting better.

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Old
02-08-2013, 02:19 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by freakydave View Post
Just curious as to why your of that opinion?
If Smid >>Ballard--do you think smid could crack vancouver's top 4 & who would he displace ?
I think he's more reliable in his own end and better at taking away scoring chances. The only player he would have a chance at displacing is Garrison, but if Jason performs up to his potential I'd rather him than Smid.

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