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Evgeny Kuznetsov to Edmonton

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Old
02-08-2013, 04:21 PM
  #151
InjuredChoker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr John Carlson View Post
Playing in the NHL(which has 30 more games), Peter Forsberg never scored more than 30 goals. Terrible argument.
He did in 98-99 season.

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02-08-2013, 04:25 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Mr Tarkanian View Post
Yak also played almost 30 less games then Kuznetsov



This thread went off the rails
Well according to the poster who said Kuz has never hit 20 goals it doesn't matter how many games are played.

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02-08-2013, 04:28 PM
  #153
Sojourn
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I find a little ironic seeing some of the arguments about how Kuznetsov has no NHL games played, but it was vehemently argued during the off-season and lockout when the same was said about Yakupov or Schultz.

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02-08-2013, 04:35 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Jamin View Post
There is no point on doing any trade on HF because its literally if it involves the oilers.

"What would it take to get Mark Fistric to the oilers?"

Start with one of the big 4 or schultz or no deal.

Fistric gets traded for a 3rd rounder.

It doesnt matter who is involved in the trade, it could be a 7th dman, it could be a 4th line center, it could be an overseas prospect, could be a top 6 player and its always one of the big 4 or nothing.
find me an example of a 4th line centre, 7th defenseman or anything close to that where people have asked for any of the "big 5" You won't, because that's bull. You guys keep asking for elite prospects and top line players, then only offer Ganger and Whitney or something like that. You need to realize that there is a huge drop off in value after the "big 5" and if you aren't going to trade any of them then you shouldn't ask for highly valued players and prospects.

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02-08-2013, 04:40 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by itsjustsurvival View Post
Because there is no one else of interest on the Oilers roster.
Please. At least Hemsky & Pääjärvi + several young defensemen + couple veteran bottom six forwards. Plus, if GMGM wants to load up for the trade deadline, Edmonton can offer at least two 2nd round picks and cap space.

Edmonton has good assets. The real question is can EDM and WSH find a common ground? Now, if I'm 100% sure Kuznetsov is coming to NHL, Ales Hemsky could be a reasonable starting point at the deadline. But only if Edmonton is about to miss the playoffs.

There could very well be a trade here, AO isn't going trough a rebuild while Pittsburgh is loaded. And GMGM could be fired this year if Caps doesn't turn this around.

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02-08-2013, 04:42 PM
  #156
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if the Caps need a "shake-up" wouldn't trading one of the players ALREADY on the caps do that...not someone who isn't even on the roster?

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02-08-2013, 05:16 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Nailor Hopberle View Post
I'm tired of continually adding youth. We need some grizzled, veterans on this team.
Want Shane 'O brien?

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02-08-2013, 05:52 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
I find a little ironic seeing some of the arguments about how Kuznetsov has no NHL games played, but it was vehemently argued during the off-season and lockout when the same was said about Yakupov or Schultz.
Yakupov does not enter into it because anyone cracking on a first overall pick not playing games between June and October is a loon... but Schultz is a fair comparison... and to reverse your point... why shouldn't Kuznetsov be criticized or at least doubted if Schultz was. That is a double standard all over HF... now it's unthinkable or ironic we try to hold an opposing player to the same standard every one else did for an Oiler.

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02-08-2013, 05:53 PM
  #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by live playoff hockey View Post
find me an example of a 4th line centre, 7th defenseman or anything close to that where people have asked for any of the "big 5" You won't, because that's bull. You guys keep asking for elite prospects and top line players, then only offer Ganger and Whitney or something like that. You need to realize that there is a huge drop off in value after the "big 5" and if you aren't going to trade any of them then you shouldn't ask for highly valued players and prospects.
It really isn't. The Oilers don't need top line players, nor do most fans keep asking for them. Most Oilers fans are trying to gauge the value of what gritty middle 6ers we could get. And I'm sorry, but the idea that there's some massive gap between the big 5 and everyone else is just ridiculous. Guys like Gagner, Hemsky, Smid, Petry, etc have lots of value. It's just people on HF who have a hate ***** that think they don't

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02-08-2013, 05:55 PM
  #160
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Originally Posted by kemisti View Post
He did in 98-99 season.
Acording to Hockeydb and Eliteprospects, he didn't.

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02-08-2013, 06:03 PM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SchultzSquared View Post
Yakupov does not enter into it because anyone cracking on a first overall pick not playing games between June and October is a loon... but Schultz is a fair comparison... and to reverse your point... why shouldn't Kuznetsov be criticized or at least doubted if Schultz was. That is a double standard all over HF... now it's unthinkable or ironic we try to hold an opposing player to the same standard every one else did for an Oiler.
The irony is that you weren't holding your players to the same standard.

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02-08-2013, 06:05 PM
  #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Needles View Post
Please. At least Hemsky & Pääjärvi + several young defensemen + couple veteran bottom six forwards. Plus, if GMGM wants to load up for the trade deadline, Edmonton can offer at least two 2nd round picks and cap space.

Edmonton has good assets. The real question is can EDM and WSH find a common ground? Now, if I'm 100% sure Kuznetsov is coming to NHL, Ales Hemsky could be a reasonable starting point at the deadline. But only if Edmonton is about to miss the playoffs.

There could very well be a trade here, AO isn't going trough a rebuild while Pittsburgh is loaded. And GMGM could be fired this year if Caps doesn't turn this around.
Maybe I should have phrased it as: In regards to a trade involving Kuznetsov, the Oilers have no one of interest out side of the Top 5.

In my opinion, the only players outside the top 5 that would be of any use to the Caps are Smid and Hemsky. I doubt the Caps would deal Kuz for either.

The Capitals already have about 10 bottom six forwards. Gagner and Paajarvi don't fix what's wrong with Caps either.

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Old
02-08-2013, 06:13 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
The irony is that you weren't holding your players to the same standard.
I would wonder when I did that... I mean I just joined HF Boards...

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02-08-2013, 06:25 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Petro Points View Post
But your comment was as ignorant as saying EDM would not trade Klefbom to WSH unless one of Backstrom and Alzner are coming back.



Yes because it would really make sense to trade one of EDM's top liners each of which is good enough to challenge for team Canada olympic team for a very good prospect who might never play for EDM ..
The point of OP was that EDM is still rebuilding while WSH might want to push for playoffs this year and make some trades. A rebuilding team would not move a key core player.
I think you are usually very practical in your responses, but sorry almost none of those guys has a chance to crack the Canadian Olympic team. MAYBE Eberle, because he has a track record of wizard-like skills in international competitions, but Hall, RNH and J. Schultz are no where near cracking that lineup.

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02-08-2013, 06:28 PM
  #165
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There's too much of a drop-off in value between the big 5 and everyone else. Hartikainen, Klefbom, and Gagner are the next most valuable pieces. Klefbom would probably get the conversation started but I doubt the Oilers trade their most promising D prospect not in the NHL.

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02-08-2013, 06:50 PM
  #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nuge View Post
It really isn't. The Oilers don't need top line players, nor do most fans keep asking for them. Most Oilers fans are trying to gauge the value of what gritty middle 6ers we could get. And I'm sorry, but the idea that there's some massive gap between the big 5 and everyone else is just ridiculous. Guys like Gagner, Hemsky, Smid, Petry, etc have lots of value. It's just people on HF who have a hate ***** that think they don't
While it may be ridiculous to you, there are many people that would disagree with you. Also, the martyrdom shtick is getting old.

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02-08-2013, 07:21 PM
  #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
The irony is that you weren't holding your players to the same standard.
There should be two standards based on eligibility. Yakupov had never been eligible to play in the NHL before, so that's different. The second he was actually able to play an NHL game, he was in it. But yes, Kuznetsov and JSchultz were the same in that respect.

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02-08-2013, 07:22 PM
  #168
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Give us Benn, but you cant have any of the big 5
Give us Pietrangelo, but you cant have any of the big 5
The list goes on and on....


Whats wrong with some Oilers fans??? Always wanting other teams stars/elite prospects and not wanting to give up any value in a return. You want an elite player/prospect? Offer up one of Hall/RNH/Eberle/Yakupov/Schultz because that's what Washington will want. If you don't want to trade any of them then stop proposing these stupid deals.

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02-08-2013, 07:25 PM
  #169
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Originally Posted by Needles View Post
Please. At least Hemsky & Pääjärvi + several young defensemen + couple veteran bottom six forwards. Plus, if GMGM wants to load up for the trade deadline, Edmonton can offer at least two 2nd round picks and cap space.

Edmonton has good assets. The real question is can EDM and WSH find a common ground? Now, if I'm 100% sure Kuznetsov is coming to NHL, Ales Hemsky could be a reasonable starting point at the deadline. But only if Edmonton is about to miss the playoffs.

There could very well be a trade here, AO isn't going trough a rebuild while Pittsburgh is loaded. And GMGM could be fired this year if Caps doesn't turn this around.
There is not a single player on the oilers roster that I'd trade Kuznetsov, 1 for 1 (outside of the 5). Prospects don't get traded for multiple roster players. Kuznetsov also has elite potential, we're as willing to trade him as much as Oiler fans were willing to trade Yakupov before the season started.

Caps need to go at minimum 24-12-1 to make the playoffs, do you see that happening? Because I don't. I see the caps as sellers and not buyers this season. Not only do they have 4 less points then anyone in the east, also, their goal differential is -6 compared to Florida.

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02-08-2013, 07:26 PM
  #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamin View Post
There is no point on doing any trade on HF because its literally if it involves the oilers.

"What would it take to get Mark Fistric to the oilers?"

Start with one of the big 4 or schultz or no deal.

Fistric gets traded for a 3rd rounder.

It doesnt matter who is involved in the trade, it could be a 7th dman, it could be a 4th line center, it could be an overseas prospect, could be a top 6 player and its always one of the big 4 or nothing.
Agreed. It's generally because there's a big dropoff in value from the "big 5" to the rest of the team.

However, people on here don't realize the value that Hemsky and Gagner have (and others like Smid). If they were on the open market, you'd better believe they'd get 4years x $4m to $5m+.

Hemsky and Gagner still fit our needs because we need their secondary scoring...so there's no urgent need to move them at this point in time.

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02-08-2013, 07:27 PM
  #171
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With regards to the original thought, something like this would make a lot more sense if the two teams were in each others spots standings wise. If Wsh was fighting for a playoff spot, and Edm was out I'm sure a deal would be there to make. Like him or not, a healthy Hemsky plus say Ryan Jones to the Caps at the deadline for a Cup Run is actually a pretty fair deal. It's a sellers market in the NHL, and a career .75 PPG top 6 winger at the deadline will go high.

But the way it is now, it just doesn't make sense. McPhee could move Kuznetsov at some point as a panic move if he believes his job is at risk, but a number of teams would offer up more than the Oilers at this point in time.

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02-08-2013, 07:32 PM
  #172
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Originally Posted by BarDownBobo View Post
There should be two standards based on eligibility. Yakupov had never been eligible to play in the NHL before, so that's different. The second he was actually able to play an NHL game, he was in it. But yes, Kuznetsov and JSchultz were the same in that respect.
Those are rather arbitrary eligibility definitions.The second he was actually able to play an NHL game, he was on a ****** enough team with a prospect development style that prefers to place them in the NHL instead of developmental leagues, and thus, he was in the NHL. You forgot to include the other factors that determine when players enter the NHL.

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02-08-2013, 07:34 PM
  #173
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Those are rather arbitrary eligibility definitions.The second he was actually able to play an NHL game, he was on a ****** enough team with a prospect development style that prefers to place them in the NHL instead of developmental leagues, and thus, he was in the NHL. You forgot to include the other factors that determine when players enter the NHL.
Please, give me a list of teams that Yakupov would not have made this season.

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02-08-2013, 07:35 PM
  #174
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Originally Posted by PWJunior View Post
While it may be ridiculous to you, there are many people that would disagree with you. Also, the martyrdom shtick is getting old.
+1. Insanity.

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02-08-2013, 07:38 PM
  #175
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How many of you have actually seen Kuznetsov play beside WJC? He has played wing for 2-3 years now, he is his teams best player and leader and one of the top player in KHL. Compared to Yakupov he looks like a veteran on the ice, much more mature and i would say more skilled than Yakupov. Caps would be stupid to trade him unless they got a really good return for him.

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