HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

*ALL* Luongo Talk (News/Speculation/Rumors/Proposals)

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-08-2013, 08:57 PM
  #101
kihei
Registered User
 
kihei's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,344
vCash: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Untradeable? No. Teams would take Luongo right now for a 7th rounder, in a heartbeat. It's the asking price. It's always been the asking price.
Realistically though isn't it both? There's the price which nobody wants to pay. But there is also the contract that nobody wants to take on, which Gillis seems to think is going to be totally the buyer's responsibility (If I have misread him, correct me if I am wrong). It's a double whammy that makes Luongo next to impossible to move.

kihei is online now  
Old
02-08-2013, 09:07 PM
  #102
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,852
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Realistically though isn't it both? There's the price which nobody wants to pay. But there is also the contract that nobody wants to take on, which Gillis seems to think is going to be totally the buyer's responsibility (If I have misread him, correct me if I am wrong). It's a double whammy that makes Luongo next to impossible to move.
This is the pessimistic way to look at things, remember it took 6 months to move Nash, 8 months for the nucks to move bure back in the day, 3 months to move heatley, and in all of those cases, the need to move the player was higher then it is for the Canucks to move Lui. Bure sat the season out, Nash was going to, heatley said he would. Want more how about turis last year, how long before he was moved?

People put to much stock in time.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
02-08-2013, 09:12 PM
  #103
TheBleedingEdge
Registered User
 
TheBleedingEdge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 253
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by racerjoe View Post
This is the pessimistic way to look at things, remember it took 6 months to move Nash, 8 months for the nucks to move bure back in the day, 3 months to move heatley, and in all of those cases, the need to move the player was higher then it is for the Canucks to move Lui. Bure sat the season out, Nash was going to, heatley said he would. Want more how about turis last year, how long before he was moved?

People put to much stock in time.
Well put, it takes time and a dance partner. Alot the the reported offers have large salary coming back or peices we dont need. We are not is a rush to trade the best goalie on the market.

TheBleedingEdge is offline  
Old
02-08-2013, 09:27 PM
  #104
rune74
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 4,422
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Realistically though isn't it both? There's the price which nobody wants to pay. But there is also the contract that nobody wants to take on, which Gillis seems to think is going to be totally the buyer's responsibility (If I have misread him, correct me if I am wrong). It's a double whammy that makes Luongo next to impossible to move.
Sometimes I wonder if some people post as much negativity as they can about other teams to make up for the pathetic state of the team they cheer for.

rune74 is offline  
Old
02-08-2013, 09:56 PM
  #105
Wizeman*
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,624
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Numbers View Post
Tell that to GM whose job is on the line or to ownership paying Ovechkin the most expensive contract in hockey.
I wont tell it to Polie but I will tell it to Steve Tambellini whose team he assembles RIGHTEOUSLY sucks for years in a row........is somehow NOT fired.

instead................ he is given a RAISE . Obviously for tanking to get all these free first overall picks .

Its not so much the obvious tanking by the team that the NHL should be embarrassed about. Its the Oilers ownership LOVING every minute of it and ENCOURAGING the clown to keep doing it. Its basically cheating.

Wizeman* is offline  
Old
02-08-2013, 10:05 PM
  #106
kihei
Registered User
 
kihei's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,344
vCash: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by rune74 View Post
Sometimes I wonder if some people post as much negativity as they can about other teams to make up for the pathetic state of the team they cheer for.
Seems like an over reaction to me concerning what was a legitimate response. So where exactly do you think that I am being negative? Gillis isn't demanding a lot? The contract is an attractive one? That doesn't constitute a double whammy? Why is this not a rational response to your situation concerning Luongo? Or is Vancouver not nicknamed Lotus Land for a reason?

kihei is online now  
Old
02-08-2013, 10:12 PM
  #107
nhlfan9191
Registered User
 
nhlfan9191's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,837
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by fosterchild420 View Post
I would like Carlson, Neuvirth and Laich for Luongo and Ballard

or Neuvirth,Laich, 1st/Forsberg/Kuznetzov for the same package

i know...."stoopid canuks fan, you aInt gettin thaT!!!" beat ya all to it. i said i want, not here's what i think we can get. gotta think big though, i know gillis does
I'm not sure Gillis knows what he's doing when it comes to this goaltending situation. Luongo's value hasn't changed at all. He's been around a decade and everyone knows just how good he is. He should have pulled the trigger last summer because Luongo's good play is only making him nervous about trading him. I'm not sold on Schneider being as good as the media has pumped him up to be. Is he as good as Tukka Rask? Or is he an older more developed Jonathon Bernier type playing on a very good team?

nhlfan9191 is offline  
Old
02-08-2013, 10:13 PM
  #108
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,852
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Seems like an over reaction to me concerning what was a legitimate response. So where exactly do you think that I am being negative? Gillis isn't demanding a lot? The contract is an attractive one? That doesn't constitute a double whammy? Why is this not a rational response to your situation concerning Luongo? Or is Vancouver not nicknamed Lotus Land for a reason?
I believe the answer is my reply above a few...

racerjoe is offline  
Old
02-08-2013, 10:20 PM
  #109
kihei
Registered User
 
kihei's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,344
vCash: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by racerjoe View Post
I believe the answer is my reply above a few...
...which I don't really have a problem with. With your response, it's more a case of you say tomato and I say tomatoh. You say I'm negative, I'd say I'm being fairly objective. I can live with that. However, Rune74 doesn't have your people skills.

kihei is online now  
Old
02-08-2013, 10:31 PM
  #110
StringerBell
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nhlfan9191 View Post
I'm not sure Gillis knows what he's doing when it comes to this goaltending situation. Luongo's value hasn't changed at all. He's been around a decade and everyone knows just how good he is. He should have pulled the trigger last summer because Luongo's good play is only making him nervous about trading him. I'm not sold on Schneider being as good as the media has pumped him up to be. Is he as good as Tukka Rask? Or is he an older more developed Jonathon Bernier type playing on a very good team?
Baseless speculation. There's been zero indication that Gillis feels any differently now about trading Luongo than he has at any time over the course of this process.

StringerBell is offline  
Old
02-08-2013, 10:40 PM
  #111
kihei
Registered User
 
kihei's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,344
vCash: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerBell View Post
Baseless speculation. There's been zero indication that Gillis feels any differently now about trading Luongo than he has at any time over the course of this process.
Sorry but just to clarify, you mean that Gillis never had any intention of moving Luongo except at the right price as opposed to Gillis never seriously considered moving him at all? I'm not trying to be a dick, but your response begs the question.

kihei is online now  
Old
02-08-2013, 11:48 PM
  #112
StringerBell
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Sorry but just to clarify, you mean that Gillis never had any intention of moving Luongo except at the right price as opposed to Gillis never seriously considered moving him at all? I'm not trying to be a dick, but your response begs the question.
I mean there's no evidence to support the premise that Luongo playing well implies Gillis is nervous about trading him. I haven't a clue how someone can come to that conclusion.

I think it's safe to assume that Gillis is serious about moving Luongo, but as you said it's still a matter of the right price at this point, which quite frankly I doubt any GM will ever pay.

Cheers

StringerBell is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 12:56 AM
  #113
Numbers
Registered User
 
Numbers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,353
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizeman View Post
I wont tell it to Polie but I will tell it to Steve Tambellini whose team he assembles RIGHTEOUSLY sucks for years in a row........is somehow NOT fired.

instead................ he is given a RAISE . Obviously for tanking to get all these free first overall picks .

Its not so much the obvious tanking by the team that the NHL should be embarrassed about. Its the Oilers ownership LOVING every minute of it and ENCOURAGING the clown to keep doing it. Its basically cheating.
I'm not so sure the idea is so great, because when all your players are approximately the same age they all get raises at same time. Tambellin has made a huge mistake in signing Hall to 6 million long term, because he has set precedent that once you hit 50+ points and you are Nugent-Hopkins, Schultz, Yakupov, they will all get paid 6 million. This could happen 2 years from now when they are ready to contend. This would 30 million tied up in 5 players, even with an escalating cap it would be very difficult to manage signing key free agents. Vancouver is a very well structured cap team, they use all the space, but only have 2 players at 6 million, everyone else is less. Oilers in the future will never have that kind of depth, it will be an extremely top heavy team. I am not convinced this is going to be as good as everyone thinks it will be.


Last edited by Numbers: 02-09-2013 at 01:15 AM.
Numbers is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 01:12 AM
  #114
Vankiller Whale
Win it for AV
 
Vankiller Whale's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 26,172
vCash: 1675
Quote:
Originally Posted by Numbers View Post
I'm not so sure the idea is so great, because when all your players are approximately the same age they all get raises at same time. Tambellin has made a huge mistake in signing Hall to 7 million long term, because he has set precedent that once you hit 50+ points and you are Nugent-Hopkins, Schultz, Yakupov, they will all get paid 7 million. This could happen 2 years from now when they are ready to contend. This would 35 million tied up in 5 players, even with an escalating cap it would be very difficult to manage signing key free agents. Vancouver is a very well structured cap team, they use all the space, but only have 2 players at 6 million, everyone else is less. Oilers in the future will never have that kind of depth, it will be an extremely top heavy team. I am not convinced this is going to be as good as everyone thinks it will be.
Hall/Eberle are signed for 6 mil. Just saying.

Vankiller Whale is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 01:17 AM
  #115
Numbers
Registered User
 
Numbers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,353
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Hall/Eberle are signed for 6 mil. Just saying.
This is true, all corrected now, though same point.

Numbers is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 01:40 AM
  #116
Wizeman*
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,624
vCash: 500
If Tambellini gets them all signed for 6 million, he deserves a TRIPLE salary raise . This time for legit reasons. That 6 mil long term is going to be dog meat in 5 years for superstars.

Hes done well to get commitments this early already.

Wanna talk about smart? Think about Dean Lombardi. He suckered Dustin Browns agent into thinking 3 million was HUGE dollars and he would be kind enough to give it to dusty long term.

Wizeman* is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 02:25 AM
  #117
marty111
Registered User
 
marty111's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,739
vCash: 500
So there's really no "pending deal" is there?

marty111 is online now  
Old
02-09-2013, 03:30 AM
  #118
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,852
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by marty111 View Post
So there's really no "pending deal" is there?
IMO the pending deal was one where gillis would have to wait til the summer, probably a buyout on a player. So still really who knows.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 05:49 AM
  #119
Bleach Clean
Moderator
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 16,773
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kihei View Post
Realistically though isn't it both? There's the price which nobody wants to pay. But there is also the contract that nobody wants to take on, which Gillis seems to think is going to be totally the buyer's responsibility (If I have misread him, correct me if I am wrong). It's a double whammy that makes Luongo next to impossible to move.



Gillis's asking price is within his control. I'm not sure how that makes Luongo himself more difficult to move? His price can be transient. Likewise, the price "nobody wants to pay" is again under the control of other GMs. Also open to change. The funny thing is, it's a price nobody wants to be pay until it's paid. There's just rationale behind it aside from the fact the deal isn't done. We don't actually know what price points are being discussed.


It means that any player not moved within the desired time frame for some fans is difficult to move, a logical fallacy. We don't know the time it takes to make such deals - as stated by racerjoe. (For reference, the Booth deal took 1 year to complete (not 6 months like some have stated)).



As to the contract, Gillis mentions that it isn't a deterrent to teams, yet McPhee says it's a dog: Who to believe? Bargaining position? I'm still surprised McPhee said anything at all about Luongo's contract or his prospects. He's thought about it some.



From _my_ understanding of the contract, it's great for richer teams, not as good for budget teams. For the latter, there is still actually a cap to salary ratio benefit in the generally considered "poor" years at the tail end of the deal (see NYI Thomas deal for reference). That's my understanding. Yours might be different, and yet the assertion of GMs may be different still... I find that being quick to judge the contract poor is a mistake that many have made, including media types, so I don't put much stock into someone's cursory understanding of it.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 06:17 AM
  #120
SufferingCatFan
Registered User
 
SufferingCatFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: fort lauderdale
Country: United States
Posts: 1,982
vCash: 500
Anyone else notice that Gillis' story keeps changing? In the meantime, we are well into the season. Lou has regained his starting job and the Nucks are winning. Is it not time for Gillis to shut down the trade talk, focus on the remainder of the season and worry about it later?

Would be pretty ironic if Lou now leads the Nucks to the Cup.

SufferingCatFan is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 07:18 AM
  #121
Halibut
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,486
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Anyone else notice that Gillis' story keeps changing? In the meantime, we are well into the season. Lou has regained his starting job and the Nucks are winning. Is it not time for Gillis to shut down the trade talk, focus on the remainder of the season and worry about it later?

Would be pretty ironic if Lou now leads the Nucks to the Cup.
Be even funnier if he then got waived and bought out.

Halibut is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 07:38 AM
  #122
DJOpus
Registered User
 
DJOpus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 5,049
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Anyone else notice that Gillis' story keeps changing? In the meantime, we are well into the season. Lou has regained his starting job and the Nucks are winning. Is it not time for Gillis to shut down the trade talk, focus on the remainder of the season and worry about it later?

Would be pretty ironic if Lou now leads the Nucks to the Cup.
Yep. Would be the second time in the years that a goalie had done exactly that (Tim Thomas).

DJOpus is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 07:58 AM
  #123
ginner classic
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Kitsilano
Posts: 7,095
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Gillis's asking price is within his control. I'm not sure how that makes Luongo himself more difficult to move? His price can be transient. Likewise, the price "nobody wants to pay" is again under the control of other GMs. Also open to change. The funny thing is, it's a price nobody wants to be pay until it's paid. There's just rationale behind it aside from the fact the deal isn't done. We don't actually know what price points are being discussed.


It means that any player not moved within the desired time frame for some fans is difficult to move, a logical fallacy. We don't know the time it takes to make such deals - as stated by racerjoe. (For reference, the Booth deal took 1 year to complete (not 6 months like some have stated)).



As to the contract, Gillis mentions that it isn't a deterrent to teams, yet McPhee says it's a dog: Who to believe? Bargaining position? I'm still surprised McPhee said anything at all about Luongo's contract or his prospects. He's thought about it some.



From _my_ understanding of the contract, it's great for richer teams, not as good for budget teams. For the latter, there is still actually a cap to salary ratio benefit in the generally considered "poor" years at the tail end of the deal (see NYI Thomas deal for reference). That's my understanding. Yours might be different, and yet the assertion of GMs may be different still... I find that being quick to judge the contract poor is a mistake that many have made, including media types, so I don't put much stock into someone's cursory understanding of it.
Gmgm never said the contract was a dog he said he could not afford it. That's not the same thing.

ginner classic is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 08:00 AM
  #124
Bleach Clean
Moderator
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 16,773
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SufferingCatFan View Post
Anyone else notice that Gillis' story keeps changing? In the meantime, we are well into the season. Lou has regained his starting job and the Nucks are winning. Is it not time for Gillis to shut down the trade talk, focus on the remainder of the season and worry about it later?

Would be pretty ironic if Lou now leads the Nucks to the Cup.


What story is "changing" in your opinion?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Halibut View Post
Be even funnier if he then got waived and bought out.

Gillis could waive the whole team at that point, I wouldn't care, just get the cup.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
02-09-2013, 08:02 AM
  #125
Bleach Clean
Moderator
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 16,773
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ginner classic View Post
Gmgm never said the contract was a dog he said he could not afford it. That's not the same thing.

Ah true. Maybe with some money sent back the other way and... nah.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:49 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.