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Old
02-09-2013, 05:44 PM
  #301
Chooch
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Originally Posted by HallOfGreatness4 View Post
Hall is going to finish this season with like 8 or 10 goals scored if he keeps this up. Embarassing.
Hall & Eberle are in danger of having a horrible season at this point. RNH is likely going to inevitably have one unfortunately.

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02-09-2013, 05:45 PM
  #302
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You guys prob won't care, but Ill give you guys a outside perspective on the oilers this year. And I come in peace. ( I watched about 75% of the oilers game this year)

Here are about 10 reasons why I believe the oilers are having troubles this year.

1 - This team can't score 5-5, The system you guys run requires a top end puck moving D-man, While you have Justin schultz who is a stud, he is not quite there to dominate the blueline.

2 - The oilers are SOFT, This is the same problem the canucks have had for years and finally are trying to address it. You guys need top skilled players who are BIG and can SCORE. Goons will not help.

3 - While you guys have some great top end talent, with hall and eberle, yakupov, schultz, etc. They are having trouble staying healthy, which also is a big part about being too small right now.

4 - Defense is simply bad, Other then schultz and smid, it's pretty bare, and it's not getting any better.

5 - Refuse to crash in bang in the corners, having trouble winning the small 1-1 battles around the ice.

6 - Simply put, the lack of scoring from top end guys has been an issue, could easily get fixed, they have the talent.

7 - Lack of depth, which is tambo's fault at drafting (and the scouts).

8 - Loser mentality. From "oil change" I noticed they talked a ton about the positives about losses, IMO there are no positives about losses, it's about winning, not losing. Sure it's nice if somebody gets a hatty, but if they lose who cares.

9 - Whitney

10 - no true identity. Is this a fast speed team?, is this team trying to be defensive reliable?, Is this team a scoring team with movement, or a dump and chase style. Coaching deserves a hit as well.

Just a few points, flame away!

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02-09-2013, 05:45 PM
  #303
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
To get a guy like Jeff Carter you got to give up something significant. Are you okay with potentially giving up Hall or Eberle for him?
No, because they're already as good as Carter if not better. Carter has been trending downwards for the last few years, he's on the Brad Boyes path.

IMO, it's more a work ethic and character thing though, not so much skill.

And Carter has been traded multiple times for lesser players and picks/prospects, nothing close to a Hall or an Eberle.

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02-09-2013, 05:47 PM
  #304
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Originally Posted by Asher View Post
I probably would have traded the #1 pick overall for Shea Weber. If the right deal is there, I'm certainly willing to make it. (Not that I know Weber would have come here or that Tambo didn't try, this was just an example on my part).
Only if he's guaranteed to sign. And given that despite the Preds doing well so far this year, he has a single lousy assist....

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02-09-2013, 05:47 PM
  #305
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Originally Posted by SDig14 View Post
No, because they're already as good as Carter if not better. Carter has been trending downwards for the last few years, he's on the Brad Boyes path.

IMO, it's more a work ethic and character thing though, not so much skill.

And Carter has been traded multiple times for lesser players and picks/prospects, nothing close to a Hall or an Eberle.
If we could've gotten Carter for Hemsky + Gagner or something I'm fairly certain we would've done it.

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02-09-2013, 05:49 PM
  #306
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Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
You guys prob won't care, but Ill give you guys a outside perspective on the oilers this year. And I come in peace. ( I watched about 75% of the oilers game this year)

Here are about 10 reasons why I believe the oilers are having troubles this year.

1 - This team can't score 5-5, The system you guys run requires a top end puck moving D-man, While you have Justin schultz who is a stud, he is not quite there to dominate the blueline.

2 - The oilers are SOFT, This is the same problem the canucks have had for years and finally are trying to address it. You guys need top skilled players who are BIG and can SCORE. Goons will not help.

3 - While you guys have some great top end talent, with hall and eberle, yakupov, schultz, etc. They are having trouble staying healthy, which also is a big part about being too small right now.

4 - Defense is simply bad, Other then schultz and smid, it's pretty bare, and it's not getting any better.

5 - Refuse to crash in bang in the corners, having trouble winning the small 1-1 battles around the ice.

6 - Simply put, the lack of scoring from top end guys has been an issue, could easily get fixed, they have the talent.

7 - Lack of depth, which is tambo's fault at drafting (and the scouts).

8 - Loser mentality. From "oil change" I noticed they talked a ton about the positives about losses, IMO there are no positives about losses, it's about winning, not losing. Sure it's nice if somebody gets a hatty, but if they lose who cares.

9 - Whitney

10 - no true identity. Is this a fast speed team?, is this team trying to be defensive reliable?, Is this team a scoring team with movement, or a dump and chase style. Coaching deserves a hit as well.

Just a few points, flame away!
Those are basically the same reasons put forth by the fans. BTW, the next time you hear a Canuck fan brag about winning the President's Trophy you might want to remind them about #8 on your list.

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02-09-2013, 05:50 PM
  #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
You guys prob won't care, but Ill give you guys a outside perspective on the oilers this year. And I come in peace. ( I watched about 75% of the oilers game this year)

Here are about 10 reasons why I believe the oilers are having troubles this year.

1 - This team can't score 5-5, The system you guys run requires a top end puck moving D-man, While you have Justin schultz who is a stud, he is not quite there to dominate the blueline.

2 - The oilers are SOFT, This is the same problem the canucks have had for years and finally are trying to address it. You guys need top skilled players who are BIG and can SCORE. Goons will not help.

3 - While you guys have some great top end talent, with hall and eberle, yakupov, schultz, etc. They are having trouble staying healthy, which also is a big part about being too small right now.

4 - Defense is simply bad, Other then schultz and smid, it's pretty bare, and it's not getting any better.

5 - Refuse to crash in bang in the corners, having trouble winning the small 1-1 battles around the ice.

6 - Simply put, the lack of scoring from top end guys has been an issue, could easily get fixed, they have the talent.

7 - Lack of depth, which is tambo's fault at drafting (and the scouts).

8 - Loser mentality. From "oil change" I noticed they talked a ton about the positives about losses, IMO there are no positives about losses, it's about winning, not losing. Sure it's nice if somebody gets a hatty, but if they lose who cares.

9 - Whitney

10 - no true identity. Is this a fast speed team?, is this team trying to be defensive reliable?, Is this team a scoring team with movement, or a dump and chase style. Coaching deserves a hit as well.

Just a few points, flame away!
You're not too far away from my thoughts as well...

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Old
02-09-2013, 05:50 PM
  #308
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The team wasn't good enough today, all around (save for Habby who was solid, imo).

They did some things I liked. After the Wings scored, instead of panicking or shrinking, they actually pushed back. It's a small thing, but something that I really like in comparison to years past.

There are holes and this team has a ways to go, but there are signs.

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Old
02-09-2013, 05:51 PM
  #309
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
If we could've gotten Carter for Hemsky + Gagner or something I'm fairly certain we would've done it.
Sure, but that's giving up non-core assets to get a player like Carter.

And personally, I want no part of that guy, EVER.

The guy was a complete ***** after getting dealt to Columbus, whined his way out of a bad scenario, meanwhile all being questioned as a guy who partied too much in Philly with a poor work ethic.

I'd find it pretty alarming when the Flyers sign Richards and Carter to long-term deals and then ship them out that quickly after.

You don't do that just to mix things up.

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Old
02-09-2013, 05:51 PM
  #310
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
Only if he's guaranteed to sign. And given that despite the Preds doing well so far this year, he has a single lousy assist....
I wont judge Weber based on 10 games this year. And unfortunately, you have a knack of looking past the point of my posts. I answered your question, that should be enough.

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02-09-2013, 05:53 PM
  #311
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Originally Posted by Asher View Post
Those are basically the same reasons put forth by the fans. BTW, the next time you hear a Canuck fan brag about winning the President's Trophy you might want to remind them about #8 on your list.
But it's so much harder to win the President's Trophy than the Stanley Cup!

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02-09-2013, 05:53 PM
  #312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
You guys prob won't care, but Ill give you guys a outside perspective on the oilers this year. And I come in peace. ( I watched about 75% of the oilers game this year)

Here are about 10 reasons why I believe the oilers are having troubles this year.

1 - This team can't score 5-5, The system you guys run requires a top end puck moving D-man, While you have Justin schultz who is a stud, he is not quite there to dominate the blueline.

2 - The oilers are SOFT, This is the same problem the canucks have had for years and finally are trying to address it. You guys need top skilled players who are BIG and can SCORE. Goons will not help.

3 - While you guys have some great top end talent, with hall and eberle, yakupov, schultz, etc. They are having trouble staying healthy, which also is a big part about being too small right now.

4 - Defense is simply bad, Other then schultz and smid, it's pretty bare, and it's not getting any better.

5 - Refuse to crash in bang in the corners, having trouble winning the small 1-1 battles around the ice.

6 - Simply put, the lack of scoring from top end guys has been an issue, could easily get fixed, they have the talent.

7 - Lack of depth, which is tambo's fault at drafting (and the scouts).

8 - Loser mentality. From "oil change" I noticed they talked a ton about the positives about losses, IMO there are no positives about losses, it's about winning, not losing. Sure it's nice if somebody gets a hatty, but if they lose who cares.

9 - Whitney

10 - no true identity. Is this a fast speed team?, is this team trying to be defensive reliable?, Is this team a scoring team with movement, or a dump and chase style. Coaching deserves a hit as well.

Just a few points, flame away!
Agreed. Alot of their issues are obvious. They have transcended changes in players, changes in leadership and changes in coaches, and are still the same. The stench of a losing culture is not washing off easily. This still looks like a lottery team to me.

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Old
02-09-2013, 05:54 PM
  #313
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Originally Posted by SeriousBusiness View Post
I agree with a lot of this.

I know it's cliche, but we need to just fight and get some greasy goals. They don't all need to be pretty. They count all the same.

Once Jones is ready to go, we need to take Smyth out.
The problem is we haven't got that presence in the top-6. No one to put goals in around the crease, or drive to the net. Or be that presence down low.

Harti does a lot of nice things but I'm not sure he has the hands to be the guy we need in the top-6.

We also need another puck mover, our transition game sucks because we can't keep possession while trying to get it out of our own zone.

We need veterans, and we need leaders. Simple.

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Old
02-09-2013, 05:56 PM
  #314
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Originally Posted by Asher View Post
I wont judge Weber based on 10 games this year. And unfortunately, you have a knack of looking past the point of my posts. I answered your question, that should be enough.
I get what you're saying.

But imagine if Tamby pulled the trigger on said trade and Weber sucked here. People would be screaming that he made a terrible deal.

Look at Parise and Suter in Minnesota. While Parise is faring well, Suter is not. If the Oilers took a chance on him and he ended up stinking out the joint we're stuck with his cap hit for another decade.

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02-09-2013, 05:57 PM
  #315
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Yeah Minnesota is going to be a weird one if they don't make the playoffs this year.

I always felt Suter was a bit overrated.

I think the Kings will turn it on, but Chicago is going to be the team to beat in the West. Their batteries look recharged.

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02-09-2013, 05:59 PM
  #316
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Originally Posted by SDig14 View Post
No, because they're already as good as Carter if not better. Carter has been trending downwards for the last few years, he's on the Brad Boyes path.

IMO, it's more a work ethic and character thing though, not so much skill.

And Carter has been traded multiple times for lesser players and picks/prospects, nothing close to a Hall or an Eberle.
I would give up Eberle for a player who would help us in every department of the game...like Patrice Bergeron

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02-09-2013, 06:02 PM
  #317
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
I get what you're saying.

But imagine if Tamby pulled the trigger on said trade and Weber sucked here. People would be screaming that he made a terrible deal.

Look at Parise and Suter in Minnesota. While Parise is faring well, Suter is not. If the Oilers took a chance on him and he ended up stinking out the joint we're stuck with his cap hit for another decade.
Sometimes a GM needs to be aggressive. Whether or not that time for the Oilers is now is debatable, but what I would say right now is that expecting the same roster + Schultz and Yak to be significantly better than last year's team is probably asking too much.

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02-09-2013, 06:02 PM
  #318
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I would give up Eberle for a player who would help us in every department of the game...like Patrice Bergeron
Thankfully Tambo wouldn't.

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Old
02-09-2013, 06:03 PM
  #319
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Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
You guys prob won't care, but Ill give you guys a outside perspective on the oilers this year. And I come in peace. ( I watched about 75% of the oilers game this year)

Here are about 10 reasons why I believe the oilers are having troubles this year.

1 - This team can't score 5-5, The system you guys run requires a top end puck moving D-man, While you have Justin schultz who is a stud, he is not quite there to dominate the blueline.

2 - The oilers are SOFT, This is the same problem the canucks have had for years and finally are trying to address it. You guys need top skilled players who are BIG and can SCORE. Goons will not help.

3 - While you guys have some great top end talent, with hall and eberle, yakupov, schultz, etc. They are having trouble staying healthy, which also is a big part about being too small right now.

4 - Defense is simply bad, Other then schultz and smid, it's pretty bare, and it's not getting any better.

5 - Refuse to crash in bang in the corners, having trouble winning the small 1-1 battles around the ice.

6 - Simply put, the lack of scoring from top end guys has been an issue, could easily get fixed, they have the talent.

7 - Lack of depth, which is tambo's fault at drafting (and the scouts).

8 - Loser mentality. From "oil change" I noticed they talked a ton about the positives about losses, IMO there are no positives about losses, it's about winning, not losing. Sure it's nice if somebody gets a hatty, but if they lose who cares.

9 - Whitney

10 - no true identity. Is this a fast speed team?, is this team trying to be defensive reliable?, Is this team a scoring team with movement, or a dump and chase style. Coaching deserves a hit as well.

Just a few points, flame away!
Excellent points, agree.

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Old
02-09-2013, 06:03 PM
  #320
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Originally Posted by Asher View Post
Sometimes a GM needs to be aggressive. Whether or not that time for the Oilers is now is debatable, but what I would say right now is that expecting the same roster + Schultz and Yak to be significantly better than last year's team is probably asking too much.
I think they were also banking on the maturity of the players and a new coach.

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Old
02-09-2013, 06:04 PM
  #321
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Originally Posted by SDig14 View Post
Sure, but that's giving up non-core assets to get a player like Carter.

And personally, I want no part of that guy, EVER.

The guy was a complete ***** after getting dealt to Columbus, whined his way out of a bad scenario, meanwhile all being questioned as a guy who partied too much in Philly with a poor work ethic.

I'd find it pretty alarming when the Flyers sign Richards and Carter to long-term deals and then ship them out that quickly after.

You don't do that just to mix things up.
Yeah, what's this talk about acquiring Carter? He is NOT the type of player that we should be looking at. Not at all.

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02-09-2013, 06:05 PM
  #322
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
I get what you're saying.

But imagine if Tamby pulled the trigger on said trade and Weber sucked here. People would be screaming that he made a terrible deal.

Look at Parise and Suter in Minnesota. While Parise is faring well, Suter is not. If the Oilers took a chance on him and he ended up stinking out the joint we're stuck with his cap hit for another decade.
Weber has been the best defenseman in the NHL this season in my opinion. Him and his "1 point" are the biggest reason that team is sitting 5th in the West.

You don't win hockey games by scoring goals. If Weber is "sucking" then this team needs some players to start sucking really badly

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02-09-2013, 06:05 PM
  #323
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
To be fair, the organization is a bloody easy target.
LOL, yeah I was going to say that as well.

For a team that does so poor we do start a lot of threads propping up ______ Player or _______ Stat or ______ streak.

I've never seen CBJ/FLA/NYI fans do the same thing.

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02-09-2013, 06:06 PM
  #324
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Originally Posted by PavelDatsyuk View Post
Weber has been the best defenseman in the NHL this season in my opinion. Him and his "1 point" are the biggest reason that team is sitting 5th in the West.

You don't win hockey games by scoring goals. If Weber is "sucking" then this team needs some players to start sucking really badly
Don't tell that to Senator fans...

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02-09-2013, 06:07 PM
  #325
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Excellent points, agree.
Most of those points are common knowledge.

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