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Views on the Toronto Maple Leafs (Mod: the hockey team)

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Old
02-09-2013, 11:52 AM
  #301
Lafleurs Guy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
No they didn't. The year previous, they got a huge break moving up from #2 to #1 overall. Because of that, they lost a ball in the lottery in 05' as per the rules.
Dude, they got the shaft. It was a one time random lottery where you could wind up anywhere. Instead of drafting top five they drafted 15th.

As for that "lucky break" you're talking about the 2nd overall was Malkin. So yeah, I'd much rather have either Malkin or OV + the top five the following year. But they got the shaft and drafted 15th.

Malkin + Price > Ov + Sasha Pokolouk.


Last edited by Lafleurs Guy: 02-09-2013 at 11:58 AM.
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02-09-2013, 11:57 AM
  #302
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Dude, they got the shaft. It was a one time random lottery where you could wind up anywhere. Instead of drafting top five they drafted 15th.

As for that "lucky break" you're talking about the 2nd overall was Malkin. So yeah, I'd much rather have either Malkin or OV + the top five the following year. But they got the shaft and drafted 15th.
They had 2 balls so statistically, it's not surprising they didn't get top 5. Many teams had 3.

The fact is, they moved up from #2 to first overall. According to the rules, this meant they lost 1 ball in the lottery. That seems fair to me.

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02-09-2013, 12:00 PM
  #303
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
They had 2 balls so statistically, it's not surprising they didn't get top 5. Many teams had 3.

The fact is, they moved up from #2 to first overall. According to the rules, this meant they lost 1 ball in the lottery. That seems fair to me.
Bottom line is that it was a one time lottery. The club wasn't good and they got stuck in a situation where they wound up drafting 14th...

So yeah, that's called getting the shaft.

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02-09-2013, 12:05 PM
  #304
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Looking at teams that have tanked recently, I'd put the Leafs and Oilers on about equal footing in terms of playoff chances and well ahead of the Avalanche/Blue Jackets.

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02-09-2013, 10:42 PM
  #305
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Yup, dealing away picks is a killer.

It's been shown to work. Just because most teams don't intentionally rebuild doesn't mean it's not a good idea.

And for Pete's sake TO has been out of the playoffs for 10 years and they've STILL dealt away picks.

Washington assembled a great team. You can't blame the GM for them not winning, he gave them the best shot that he could. And actually Washington got seriously shafted in 2005 when there was a lottery. They would've had a top five otherwise... they could've very easily drafted Carey Price and been much further ahead. Just got the shaft.

And yet the Leafs have managed it anyway. And they've done it by consistently trading away their first round picks.

Yup.

Dealing for players who are 27 or 28 is not rebuilding regardless of where they were drafted. And dealing away two first rounders is not rebuilding.

JVR - Two young players traded for each other. Great trade in my opinion but not really rebuild.
Kessel - Not a rebuild trade when you deal away 1st round picks to get him.
Reilly - Top 5 pick definitely qualifies.
Kadri - Top 10 pick qualifies.
Lupul - Trading for a 29 year old isn't rebuilding. Gardiner qualifies though.
Phaneuf - See above.
Gardiner - See Lupul.

As I've said... rebuilding or not, Burke made some great trades. But rather than signng Lupul longterm I would've cashed in on him and dealt him. He's injured now so the point is moot but he's a guy you deal if you want to start over.

Every year TO says a full on rebuild isn't necessary. We'll it's been 8 or 9 years now and if they'd just done it way back then they'd be further ahead. But okay...

If they're smart they'll stay far away from that move.

Nobody ignored it. In fact most have said it was a great trade. I think JVR is an awesome piece to build around.

Why not blow it up? I mean really dude, hang onto Reily, Gardiner, Kadri, JVR and maybe Kessel. Everybody else is for sale and you build with picks and prospects. The Leafs are further ahead of where the Oilers were when they started over. The rebuild would be accelerated and they'd be better off in the long run. The club needs to be rebuilt if they ever want to become a contender again.
looks like our rebuild is going fine

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Old
02-09-2013, 10:46 PM
  #306
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Originally Posted by LEAFANFORLIFE23 View Post
looks like our rebuild is going fine
Dude... beating the Habs doesn't mean much. That club should continue to rebuild too.

Toronto will probably still miss the playoffs this year.

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02-09-2013, 10:50 PM
  #307
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Pleased with the development of our younger players. One of the few bright spots from the Burke era.

Nonis will need to be a busy man this summer in order to take that next step: Playoffs

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02-09-2013, 10:54 PM
  #308
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Pleased with the development of our younger players. One of the few bright spots from the Burke era.

Nonis will need to be a busy man this summer in order to take that next step: Playoffs
JVR is going to be great. I always figured that guy would be good and I think that will turn into a rip-off trade.

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02-09-2013, 11:22 PM
  #309
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They will make the playoffs........ in approximately 7 to 10 years.

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02-09-2013, 11:24 PM
  #310
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They will make the playoffs........ in approximately 7 to 10 years.
I laughed so hard

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02-09-2013, 11:29 PM
  #311
Quarter
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Dude... beating the Habs doesn't mean much. That club should continue to rebuild too.

Toronto will probably still miss the playoffs this year.
Key word here. There's no use blowing up the club because they might slip out of a playoff spot. Jesus Christ, why not just blow up all fringe playoff teams in that case?

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Old
02-09-2013, 11:35 PM
  #312
JackJ
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
JVR is going to be great. I always figured that guy would be good and I think that will turn into a rip-off trade.
Leafs mishandled Schenn on all levels:

Starting at 18 instead of 21 or 22
Playing for a terrible coach
"Run and gun" type system

I'm confident this trade will end up being even.

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Old
02-09-2013, 11:39 PM
  #313
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by Quarter View Post
Key word here. There's no use blowing up the club because they might slip out of a playoff spot. Jesus Christ, why not just blow up all fringe playoff teams in that case?
Dude, you're looking at this the wrong way.

It doesn't matter if they're an 8th place team. Management should take a long hard look at the club and decide what they need to seriously compete for a cup. Making the playoffs should be secondary. I know that seems like a hard concept to grasp but that's what ownership SHOULD be doing. What matters are cups. Not 8th place finishes, not 1st or 2nd round exits. CUPS are what it's about.

The decade long playoff slump wouldn't bother me nearly as much as the almost 50 year cup drought. THAT's what I'd be working to address if I owned the Leafs. And if they'd thought that way instead of constantly just trying to make the playoffs they'd be way further ahead.

It just boggles my mind that they haven't figured this out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
Leafs mishandled Schenn on all levels:

Starting at 18 instead of 21 or 22
Playing for a terrible coach
"Run and gun" type system

I'm confident this trade will end up being even.
We'll see. I've just always been a big fan of JVR. Don't know why he didn't click in Philly but I think they gave up on him too early.

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02-09-2013, 11:43 PM
  #314
JackJ
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
We'll see. I've just always been a big fan of JVR. Don't know why he didn't click in Philly but I think they gave up on him too early.
I feel the exact same way about Schenn. Carlye would have turned him into an all star.

Good "hockey trade" IMO.

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02-09-2013, 11:47 PM
  #315
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Dude... beating the Habs doesn't mean much. That club should continue to rebuild too.

Toronto will probably still miss the playoffs this year.
Leafs have shown they can beat the weaker teams consistently (MTL X 2, WSH X2, WIN X1) We just have to get some big wins against the upper echelon teams. If we loose 4 out of 4 against Boston that could really **** us over

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02-09-2013, 11:52 PM
  #316
Reed Solomon
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They're improving and I don't like it one bit.

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02-09-2013, 11:56 PM
  #317
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im starting to believe

at least i now know we have a better team than last year

i would also like to believe loops and gards make us better.

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Old
02-09-2013, 11:57 PM
  #318
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Honestly, we shouldn't let this one game cloud our opinions. This team isn't ready for the primetime. We're still lacking vital pieces. We're improving yes, but we've still got a long way to go. That being said, **** the Habs.

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Old
02-10-2013, 12:14 AM
  #319
HappyGilmourr
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die hard fan here... we have 4 wins against Montreal and Washington. 1 against Winnipeg. Toronto needs to prove them self vs the upper echelon teams. We seem to do well against the Pens but get run over by Boston and philly. If we go 0-4 against the bruins and 0-3 against the Flyers it could get ugly. All comes down defensive first hockey and goaltending. This team could be a threat for the playoffs but so is every team in the east in this shortened season. Future does look quite promising though.

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Old
02-10-2013, 12:17 AM
  #320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
Leafs mishandled Schenn on all levels:

Starting at 18 instead of 21 or 22
Playing for a terrible coach
"Run and gun" type system

I'm confident this trade will end up being even.
Hindsight is 20/20.

In his first season in the NHL, Luke was looking like a good #2 defenseman. However, he stumbled in his 2nd, 3rd and 4th seasons and didn't look nearly as good as he was initially. He's apparently playing very well now in Philly, though.

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02-10-2013, 12:17 AM
  #321
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A coach can really change how the team looks on the ice.

Under Randy Carlyle I've seen noticeable improvements. I'm not getting ahead of myself and planning playoff parties but I just need to give props on the job Randy Carlyle, Dave Farrish and Greg Cronin are doing.

Also, Dion Phaneuf, James Van Reimsdyke and Leo Komarov have been our unsung heroes.

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02-10-2013, 12:18 AM
  #322
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The Leafs are clearly a good young team with nice upside going forward. The comments of them having no good young players makes me laugh.

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Old
02-10-2013, 12:20 AM
  #323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackJ View Post
Leafs mishandled Schenn on all levels:

Starting at 18 instead of 21 or 22
Playing for a terrible coach
"Run and gun" type system

I'm confident this trade will end up being even.
I agree he was mishandled in some ways. Still not as much as Kadri though.

In the end, I hope Schenn does well in Philly. All I care about is the Leafs got a very good young forward drafted second overall for a guy in Schenn who really doesn't have a lot of talent.

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02-10-2013, 12:23 AM
  #324
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leafs won the Jvr trade as soon as it happened. Schenn was insanely overrated. Jvr has a much higher ceiling and a bigger impact even with both players being inconsistent

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02-10-2013, 12:25 AM
  #325
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Originally Posted by Raym11 View Post
leafs won the Jvr trade as soon as it happened. Schenn was insanely overrated. Jvr has a much higher ceiling and a bigger impact even with both players being inconsistent
I don't think he was overrated, I just think I'd rather have a top young forward the talent of JVR over a guy who in the end, is a defensive defenseman.

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