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Team Toughness or lack thereof

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02-10-2013, 06:33 AM
  #1
esdoorn
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Team Toughness or lack thereof

After watching the majority of the Sens games so far this season (a couple of them in person at SBP), I feel our team lacks the toughness needed to succeed.

Too many games ( yesterday against Winnipeg a prime example ) had the team playing timid, boring hockey on the boards and outside of the slot. Hardly any hits, no one in front of the net, just blah.

Not sure what Murray is thinking, but he really needs to address our situation at centre and team toughness or he might just toss in the towel on this season now imho.

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02-10-2013, 08:21 AM
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Legend Killer
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Our team is pretty soft from top to bottom. In yesterdays game, Da Costa was our most physical forward. Thats an issue. On most nights, Neil brings a solid physical presence... But aside from him, nobody does it consistantly.

On the back end, Methot brings it as well. Outside of him, Boro does it abit when hes in the lineup.

The player im most dissapointed with in this aspect is Greening. He is supposed to be big, strong, fast, physical, etc. but he has been slow and soft. Others who need to step it up are Smith, Michalek, obrien, Phillips.

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02-10-2013, 08:40 AM
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delchief
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It's so difficult to measure, toughness. It relies on anecdotal evidence and perception.

There's no question the team last year benefitted from the toughness thing. And it wasn't just about fighting. That series with the Rangers turned for the better when Carkner went after Boyle and the entire team just had each other's back from that point forward. Although this is an over-used term I'm comfortable saying that they "played bigger" because of that. They attacked and used their skill more effectively on the forecheck. It was tangible.

That's all I want. The right mix. The team wins when skilled players score. Skilled players score when they're in a good position to score. They are in a good position to score when they make room for themselves and others make room for them as well. Hockey is a mental game just like any other. If the other team sees you coming at them wave after wave and not backing down they are more likely to make a mistake later in the game.

Just like Ottawa did yesterday.

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02-10-2013, 08:43 AM
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.... and by the way, if what happened to the Habs yesterday late in the 3rd period ever happens to our team I will *****ing lose it. I do not want to ice a bunch of goons because that's how you get skated around and lose. But I do not EVER want to see my team pushed around like they used to be in the early 2000s. You end up losing anyway and the morale of the team is sapped away in the process. Total and utter lose-lose. That shouldn't be something we "look to address at the trade deadline". It should be part of the team's DNA.

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02-10-2013, 08:55 AM
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esdoorn
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ok, the team is playing 'soft' and they aren't going to win unless they start playing bigger or tougher than they have been doing so. To see the guys ( most of them ) just playing around the boards and not driving to the net or standing in front of the net just drives me nuts! Maybe MacLean needs to do a 'Bull Durham' with hockey sticks instead of baseball bats to ignite this team in some fashion! I can take a loss if they try, but yesterday's game and a number of others in the past 5 or 6 games have been complete mail-ins!

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02-10-2013, 08:57 AM
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MainDotC
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Greening is turning into a Bonk - big towering guy but he's not plowing people over with his size.

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02-10-2013, 08:59 AM
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Yeah thats why we are losing 1 goal games, because we arent hitting people enough.

If anything we need more goal scorers and less idiots getting us penalties that can barely play over 5 minutes.

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02-10-2013, 09:16 AM
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Legend Killer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by General Granny View Post
Yeah thats why we are losing 1 goal games, because we arent hitting people enough.

If anything we need more goal scorers and less idiots getting us penalties that can barely play over 5 minutes.
You are right.. Cause everyone was calling for having 12 Carkner's on the team.

Who out of our forwards are hard to play against?

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02-10-2013, 09:45 AM
  #9
Qward
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We have DaCosta now. No need to worry.


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02-10-2013, 09:50 AM
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FolignoQuantumLeap
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delchief View Post
It's so difficult to measure, toughness. It relies on anecdotal evidence and perception.
This.

Am I the only one to be a little surprised by this complaint? No team this season has come along and dominated the Sens physically aside from MAYBE Tampa bay in front of Bishop. We certainly didn't lose the Winnipeg because we lacked the mythical toughness. Don't get me wrong, a couple big hits early could have woken up the sleepy crowd and maybe brought some energy into the building but we lost that game because we couldn't break down Winnipeg in the neutral zone and are too insistent on using the stretch pass.

Greening and others need to bring it more often but otherwise this isn't a big concern. Discipline has been a much bigger problem and now that the team has played a few well disciplined games in a row people are complaining about lacking toughness. What do you want, a parade to the sin bin or a game like against Carolina where we have the puck so often that there's rarely a chance to throw a hit on the other team? There's middle ground there but playing a brand of hockey where we go out of our way to be tough is going to lead to more penalties. We're one of the best teams 5 on 5 and it's in our best interests to keep it so.

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02-10-2013, 10:06 AM
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esdoorn
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tough = getting in front of the net to screen the goalie

tough = getting into the middle to create changes and not just play along the board

tough = making some hits

not to hard to figure out that in the last number of games, this team has not played 'tough'.

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02-10-2013, 10:11 AM
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Qward
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Problem is, throwing your body around wears you down. Not a great idea with a short season.

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02-10-2013, 10:30 AM
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Dont get the purpose of this thread at all, we havent been phsically dominated against by no team so far, unless the Bruins come in and **** us up then sure bring this up, but right now this is people coming out of the woodwork just to push the same argument we have been discussing the past 6 months.

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02-10-2013, 10:38 AM
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You can talk about Energy all you want but the best energy you could give a team is scoring goals and creating chances, and making amazing saves.

We lost Carkner and Konopka and people make it sound like we lost Lucic and Dustin Brown, Carkner could barely skate to make an open ice hit, I seen more hits this season from Methot than I seen Carkner do in his career, Konopka barely brought any physical play, he just skates around and wrestles a guy for 7 minutes and never be seen again.

The problem isnt that we dont have these people, its that they arent playing that style for some reason.

We have enough physical players, the problem is they arent playing to that style, even though Neil has been great, I havent a single great hit by Neil so far, and Smith thinks hes Gretzky for some reason, Greening basically took Kubas spot for the softest guy in the team.

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02-10-2013, 10:53 AM
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Ron Jeremy
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6 Euro forwards. That is all.

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02-10-2013, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
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6 Euro forwards. That is all.
look at this bad opinion

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02-10-2013, 11:05 AM
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Ron Jeremy
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look at this bad opinion
You don't get team toughness out of a bunch of Euros. Period.

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02-10-2013, 11:05 AM
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CarknerCountry
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Of course we lack grit and toughness..Niel is the only one that brings it..Watch when we play the Flyers,Rangers or bruins it will show.

Remember last years playoffs when Boyle took liberties with Karlsson see what Carks did...

Not saying lets have a hockey team full of goons...But what does Daug ,Lats,Regin even greening bring to the team?

I would prefer a 4th liner like a Parros on this team more then Daugs he brings an element the team might need at times..

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02-10-2013, 11:07 AM
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BonkTastic
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Nothing brings out antiquated opinions quite like a thread about "hockey toughness".

"Toughness" is one of those things that to some fans, you can never have enough of. I remember hearing complaints about it last year, when we had Carkner, and Konopka. I remember complaints that we weren't "tough enough" when McGrattan was caving heads in and getting skated around like he was still wearing double-blades.

If some fans had their way, they'd have 10 Krzystof Oliwa's out there with two Gretzky's.

We have lots of muscle out there. No single team has taken liberties with our guys yet this year. Not once. Our team doesn't get intimidated. We're not losing games because our forwards wear high heels, ferchristssakes. We're losing games because we don't have enough skilled forwards right now to put the puck in the net. We have 7 goals in the last 5 games. You can't punch the puck into the net.

Terrible thread is terrible.

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02-10-2013, 11:07 AM
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aragorn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esdoorn View Post
tough = getting in front of the net to screen the goalie

tough = getting into the middle to create changes and not just play along the board

tough = making some hits

not to hard to figure out that in the last number of games, this team has not played 'tough'.
Greening does all of that & rarely takes a penalty. Even I think the team is tough enough although one big enforcer might help. They only lost 1- 0, it was more a lack of effort than anything else & the ice seemed bad as no one could control the puck. Ppl keep blaming Greening everytime this team loses but it's the lack of scoring goals & he isn't paid for that, blame the guys who are paid to score. Goals against are way down this yr & that is what Greening is paid to do, reduce goals against.

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02-10-2013, 11:09 AM
  #21
CarknerCountry
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You don't get team toughness out of a bunch of Euros. Period.
Don't agree with this, but people will sing a different tune if or when the likes of the bruins or flyers take runs at Karlsson..

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02-10-2013, 11:13 AM
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Ron Jeremy
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Yup. I'm OK with Euros with skill who score but ours don't seem to right now. You need to be skilled or tough, preferably both.

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02-10-2013, 11:16 AM
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Ouroboros
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Dziurzynski will solve this problem. And world hunger as well.

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02-10-2013, 11:17 AM
  #24
Ron Jeremy
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Dziurzynski will solve this problem. And world hunger as well.
I'd play him over Daug or Regin.

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Old
02-10-2013, 11:18 AM
  #25
General Granny*
 
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6 Euro forwards. That is all.
Yep we need Euro dman.

Kronwall
Douglas Murray
Emelin
Volchenkov

****ing a bunch of Don Cherrys in here.

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