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I'm gonna say it, Burmi is our best player this year, There!!

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Old
02-10-2013, 01:25 AM
  #51
jiho
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Originally Posted by Stopthebooing View Post
People who think Burmistrov is the Jets best player are uneducated fans. The guy accomplishes nothing offensively. Sure he dangles the puck in the corner, but it creates no scoring chances. The guy has no shot either. Look at his stats at every level, he's never done a thing offensively. Sure, I like his effort and defensive skills, but that's not the type of player you envision with a top 10 pick...or a guy you call your best player. He'll be a 20 goal, 45 point man at the peak of his career.
Finally, someone who agrees with me. Everyone on this board loves Burmistrov. I agree with everything stated above regarding his offensive game. He has great individual skills but it does not translate into any offensive chances for himself nor does he make his wingers better. He is a 20 goal scorer but it has taken him until his 3rd season to get those 20 goals. I do love his work ethic, tenacity, compete level and defensive reliability. He should be the first forward sent out for penalty killing. He is a fine 3rd line center. However, I think him being here took away the opportunity for Scheifele, who should of been the Jets 3rd line center this year. Burmistrov should be right wing on a line with Kane. They can each see who can keep the puck the longest without passing to anyone. Saying Burmistrov is our best forward this year might be true, but it only shows how bad our other forwards are under-achieving.

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02-10-2013, 01:38 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by jiho View Post
Finally, someone who agrees with me. Everyone on this board loves Burmistrov. I agree with everything stated above regarding his offensive game. He has great individual skills but it does not translate into any offensive chances for himself nor does he make his wingers better. He is a 20 goal scorer but it has taken him until his 3rd season to get those 20 goals. I do love his work ethic, tenacity, compete level and defensive reliability. He should be the first forward sent out for penalty killing. He is a fine 3rd line center. However, I think him being here took away the opportunity for Scheifele, who should of been the Jets 3rd line center this year. Burmistrov should be right wing on a line with Kane. They can each see who can keep the puck the longest without passing to anyone. Saying Burmistrov is our best forward this year might be true, but it only shows how bad our other forwards are under-achieving.
Players since 2005 to get >20 goals within 3rd season under age of 21...
Ovechkin
Stamkos
Crosby
Toews
Malkin
Kopitar
Bergeron
Skinner
E.Kane
Seguin
JStaal
Horton
Duchene
Hall
P.Kane
Benn
Landeskogg
Mueller
Wolski

Oh it's so horrible that he's behind these players in goals... obviously if he can't beat these guys he's a total bust for top6
His point trajectory is exactly the same Junior and NHL years as O`Reilly... why don't people go to the Colorado board and tell them O`Reilly will never be a 2C...

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Old
02-10-2013, 01:41 AM
  #53
jiho
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Originally Posted by garret9 View Post
Players since 2005 to get >20 goals within 3rd season under age of 21...
Ovechkin
Stamkos
Crosby
Toews
Malkin
Kopitar
Bergeron
Skinner
E.Kane
Seguin
JStaal
Horton
Duchene
Hall
P.Kane
Benn
Landeskogg
Mueller
Wolski

Oh it's so horrible that he's behind these players in goals... obviously if he can't beat these guys he's a total bust for top6
His point trajectory is exactly the same Junior and NHL years as O`Reilly... why don't people go to the Colorado board and tell them O`Reilly will never be a 2C...
It is not only what he has or has not done until now. I do not see him ever scoring 20 goals in a season or a big point producer. He is not a natural goal scorer and he is not a playmaker that makes his wingers better.

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02-10-2013, 01:52 AM
  #54
garret9
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Originally Posted by jiho View Post
It is not only what he has or has not done until now. I do not see him ever scoring 20 goals in a season or a big point producer. He is not a natural goal scorer and he is not a playmaker that makes his wingers better.
Well that's an opinion and I cannot refute an opinion

But I can refute your prior comments about his point production or ability to create scoring chances (5 last night) has been low enough to cause concern that he's already reached his offensive peak at 21.

Although, as I noted early in this thread, I do not believe Burmistrov to be the Jets' best player or forward.


Last edited by garret9: 02-10-2013 at 01:57 AM.
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02-10-2013, 10:30 AM
  #55
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Burmistrov looked better yesterday because he was playing on a third-line position where he belongs and as such was not as exposed. He still handled the puck like a grenade for much of the first period at that but improved greatly from that point. He is great on the pk and is an asset as such. Can't see him moving past third line duty as this team moves forward however in a year or two though, given the considerable size advantage offered by young players in the pipeline like Cormier, Scheifele, Lowry, Olsen, Sutter, etc.

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02-10-2013, 11:30 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Gump Hasek View Post
Burmistrov looked better yesterday because he was playing on a third-line position where he belongs and as such was not as exposed. He still handled the puck like a grenade for much of the first period at that but improved greatly from that point. He is great on the pk and is an asset as such. Can't see him moving past third line duty as this team moves forward however in a year or two though, given the considerable size advantage offered by young players in the pipeline like Cormier, Scheifele, Lowry, Olsen, Sutter, etc.
I see something very different than you watching him play. He was tied for the team lead in shots yesterday and he made a couple really really nice passing plays. His feed to Welly that was tipped wide was a beauty. I don't see the grenade analogy.

His line has been arguably the Jets best line for three straight games, despite the fact that he has moved up and down the lineup. His line has scored and been to the plus in each of those games. They have also done well from a possession perspective.

Burmi is by no means the Jets best forward, but there is a strong case to be made that he is among the 6 best forwards and he should continue to develop.

I also fail to see how 4th line talents like Cormier and Sutter would impact a potential future move into the top 6.

Size =/= Skill or Upside

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02-10-2013, 11:36 AM
  #57
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I wonder if part of his strong play is due to conditioning. It'll be interesting to see if he can keep it up as the players who weren't playing during the lockout get to mid season form

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02-10-2013, 11:43 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by truck View Post
I see something very different than you watching him play. He was tied for the team lead in shots yesterday and he made a couple really really nice passing plays. His feed to Welly that was tipped wide was a beauty. I don't see the grenade analogy.
That is fine, we have differing opinions. If you read my post again more closely you'd note that I said he handled the puck like a grenade in the first period and then improved. I don't think that pass to Wellwood came in the first period IIRC but if it did then my memory fails; regardless, if it did, then it would represent one of the few times he didn't just blindly throw it away after gaining possession in that period. He got much better as the game advanced as I initially stated.

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02-10-2013, 11:49 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Row 3 Upper View Post
I wonder if part of his strong play is due to conditioning. It'll be interesting to see if he can keep it up as the players who weren't playing during the lockout get to mid season form
I've noticed his strength in the past couple games. He fought off d like it was nobodya business. One other improvement is he doesn't turn his back to the middle of the ice with the puck.

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02-10-2013, 11:53 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Gump Hasek View Post
That is fine, we have differing opinions. If you read my post again more closely you'd note that I said he handled the puck like a grenade in the first period and then improved. I don't think that pass to Wellwood came in the first period IIRC but if it did then my memory fails; regardless, if it did, then it would represent one of the few times he didn't just blindly throw it away after gaining possession in that period. He got much better as the game advanced as I initially stated.
I thought that line looked great in the first with a ton of sustained O zone time. To me it was the third where they (and the rest of the team) sat back and did zip, but that seemed to be a coaching directive. Burmistrov also got juggled onto a bunch of different lines during that stretch. *shrug*

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02-10-2013, 12:19 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Stopthebooing View Post
People who think Burmistrov is the Jets best player are uneducated fans. The guy accomplishes nothing offensively. Sure he dangles the puck in the corner, but it creates no scoring chances. The guy has no shot either. Look at his stats at every level, he's never done a thing offensively. Sure, I like his effort and defensive skills, but that's not the type of player you envision with a top 10 pick...or a guy you call your best player. He'll be a 20 goal, 45 point man at the peak of his career.
To the Burmi-Lovers: Arguably, the worst thing you can do to support your hero is to entitle a thread, 'Burmi is our Best Player'. This is akin to saying Scheifele would tear up the league this year. Not only is it untrue, but it sets up unrealistic expectations, breeds disappointment and feeds the Burmi/Scheifele critics.
Both players are on a trajectory toward being solid NHLers, with Burmi already showing flashes of two-way excellence at a comparatively young age. He has more than justified his #8 selection . Neither will probably be a superstar (although 20 goals and 50+ points + defensive excellence =Selke candidate), but, then again, only an 'uneducated fan' would have expected that.

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02-10-2013, 12:32 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by scelaton View Post
To the Burmi-Lovers: Arguably, the worst thing you can do to support your hero is to entitle a thread, 'Burmi is our Best Player'. This is akin to saying Scheifele would tear up the league this year. Not only is it untrue, but it sets up unrealistic expectations, breeds disappointment and feeds the Burmi/Scheifele critics.
Both players are on a trajectory toward being solid NHLers, with Burmi already showing flashes of two-way excellence at a comparatively young age. He has more than justified his #8 selection . Neither will probably be a superstar (although 20 goals and 50+ points + defensive excellence =Selke candidate), but, then again, only an 'uneducated fan' would have expected that.
Two-way excellence? Burmi has to discover where the net is located before he is even considered good offensively, 1 goal and 1 assist in 11 games just isn't good. Some of you Burmi enthusiasts have to realize he is on pace for a 4-5 goals, 5-6 assists 48 games season.


Last edited by sipowicz: 02-10-2013 at 12:50 PM.
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02-10-2013, 12:36 PM
  #63
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He has been pretty good defensively
Offensively he has not been very good at all.

How he got #1C line with little and ladd I will never know

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02-10-2013, 12:40 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by sipowicz View Post
Two-way excellence? Burmi has to discover where the net is located before he is even considered good offensively, 1 goal and 1 assist in 11 games just isn't good. Some of you Burmi enthusiasts have to realize he is on pace for a 4-5 goal, 5-6 assist 48 games season.
Nobody is happy with that kind of offensive production, but pace really means nothing 10 games in, especially when the play has been solid.

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02-10-2013, 12:42 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by truck View Post
Nobody is happy with that kind of offensive production, but pace really means nothing 10 games in, especially when the play has been solid.
Go back to his point production since the middle of last season and through the AHL, it isn't very good, actually it's POOR.

I'm going to date myself here, but Burmi kind of reminds me of former Winnipeg Jet Ron Wilson, great skater, good stick handler, nifty with the puck but it never translated into points either in goals or assists. Ron was also great on the PK.


Last edited by sipowicz: 02-10-2013 at 12:51 PM.
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02-10-2013, 12:52 PM
  #66
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Go back to his point production since the middle of last season and through the AHL, it isn't very good, actually it's POOR.
I agree, but suggesting everything before that was a mirage is a bit much. Nobody his age is a finished product. I can't deny what has happened before or the growth that I see watching him.

I haven't set any unreasonable projections for him either. I see him as 2-3 tweener same as coach apparently does. I think he should be able to improve upon last year. I am not sure why that is unrealistic given his age. How much he improves of course is really up in the air.

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02-10-2013, 12:59 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by sipowicz View Post
Two-way excellence? Burmi has to discover where the net is located before he is even considered good offensively, 1 goal and 1 assist in 11 games just isn't good. Some of you Burmi enthusiasts have to realize he is on pace for a 4-5 goals, 5-6 assists 48 games season.
This is exactly what I was referring to in my earlier post--unrealistic expectations and unduly harsh criticism.
I assume you realize that you cannot extrapolate from 11 games to a whole season. It is simply statistically invalid.
At his current rate of progression, Burmi could optimistically have been expected to have ~ 20 points in a 48 game season. The fact that he is a few points shy of that pace after 11 games means absolutely nothing.
If Burmi does, in fact, exceed expectations and develop into what is generally regarded as an excellent two-way player, expect seasons of 35 (pro-rated), 45, then 50+ points over the next 3 years. To expect anything more or earlier is not realistic.
I am a Burmi enthusiast but also a realist. What's your excuse?

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02-10-2013, 02:25 PM
  #68
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Keep in mind he is also playing third line center with little PP time. How are other teama third line centers doing?

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02-10-2013, 02:35 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Flying High View Post
Keep in mind he is also playing third line center with little PP time. How are other teama third line centers doing?
Well if you want to remove PP he is scoring around the same rate per minute as these C:
RNH
H.Sedin
Koivu
Zajac
Weiss
Bozak
Desharnais
Couturier
Giroux

OR these forwards:
D.Sedin
Ovechkin
S.Kostitsyn
Hagelin
Fleschmann
Heatley
D.Briere
Kovalchuk
Eberle
Carter

But that's ok... his current production obviously makes him impossible to be top6


Last edited by garret9: 02-10-2013 at 03:15 PM.
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02-10-2013, 02:48 PM
  #70
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Eberle and Carter are both wings but good find.

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02-10-2013, 03:15 PM
  #71
garret9
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Eberle and Carter are both wings but good find.
fixed thanks

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02-10-2013, 04:14 PM
  #72
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And about the same as Peverley I believe.

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02-10-2013, 08:05 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by garret9 View Post
Well if you want to remove PP he is scoring around the same rate per minute as these C:
RNH
H.Sedin
Koivu
Zajac
Weiss
Bozak
Desharnais
Couturier
Giroux

OR these forwards:
D.Sedin
Ovechkin
S.Kostitsyn
Hagelin
Fleschmann
Heatley
D.Briere
Kovalchuk
Eberle
Carter

But that's ok... his current production obviously makes him impossible to be top6
Nice post garret9. Burmi puts up comparable points per minute (minus PP time) as some very good players.

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02-10-2013, 08:07 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by garret9 View Post
Well if you want to remove PP he is scoring around the same rate per minute as these C:
RNH
H.Sedin
Koivu
Zajac
Weiss
Bozak
Desharnais
Couturier
Giroux

OR these forwards:
D.Sedin
Ovechkin
S.Kostitsyn
Hagelin
Fleschmann
Heatley
D.Briere
Kovalchuk
Eberle
Carter

But that's ok... his current production obviously makes him impossible to be top6
Cha Ching

And this is why we pay you the big bucks my friend........grass is always greener on the other side of the fense I guess.

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02-10-2013, 08:54 PM
  #75
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Oh, so it's fine to extrapolate from 2 pts as long as we use the most favorable skewing possible. He's comparable to the Sedins and Kovalchuk! From 2 pts? This is like a fat lady in a milkshake shop. Grasping at straws.

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