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Letang for a legit 1st line winger

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Old
02-10-2013, 07:21 PM
  #251
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Originally Posted by Exit Dose View Post
That isn't what I meant, but whatever, it works both ways I guess.
I know what you meant, but regardless, its utterly ridiculous idea for Pittsburgh.

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02-10-2013, 07:22 PM
  #252
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IMO the only team this makes sense with is Edmonton...tons of young offensive talent and they need D.

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02-10-2013, 07:30 PM
  #253
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Originally Posted by Cujomi View Post
IMO the only team this makes sense with is Edmonton...tons of young offensive talent and they need D.
The problem, they don't want to give up any of that young offensive talent and I'm talking one of the big four, not the typical names associated on this board. That said, he ain't going anywhere.

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02-10-2013, 07:30 PM
  #254
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Pens lost Letang and they will fall apart. You Pens fans don't know how good you have it. Keep your team.

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02-10-2013, 07:33 PM
  #255
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Letang makes the Pens go.

No trade. Period.

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02-10-2013, 07:34 PM
  #256
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Originally Posted by Vamonos Pest View Post
Pens lost Letang and they will fall apart. You Pens fans don't know how good you have it. Keep your team.
Most know. It's the fruit flies who forget.

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02-10-2013, 07:36 PM
  #257
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I don't give half a **** about the pens or habs I'm a Devils fan. I was just saying the guy could quite easily pot 35 plus a year with those guys. Don't really care at all tho but thanks for the rude overreaction doe.

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02-10-2013, 08:28 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by SteveCangialosi123 View Post
I don't give half a **** about the pens or habs I'm a Devils fan. I was just saying the guy could quite easily pot 35 plus a year with those guys. Don't really care at all tho but thanks for the rude overreaction doe.
Rude overreaction ... what ever dude. Could easily? Well, we have had 15 people serve as a winger for Crosby or Malkin and absent Neal, we haven't had one hit 30. If the chemistry ain't there, 20 is unlikely to happen.

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02-10-2013, 09:20 PM
  #259
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Originally Posted by OCPenguin View Post
Rude overreaction ... what ever dude. Could easily? Well, we have had 15 people serve as a winger for Crosby or Malkin and absent Neal, we haven't had one hit 30. If the chemistry ain't there, 20 is unlikely to happen.
How about Clarkson? All Devils players seem to play well when Malkin is on the ice.

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02-10-2013, 10:53 PM
  #260
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Letang and Kunitz for Streit and Moulson

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02-10-2013, 10:54 PM
  #261
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Originally Posted by SteveCangialosi123 View Post
How about Clarkson? All Devils players seem to play well when Malkin is on the ice.
He was asking for a first line winger. Not a Clarkson

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02-10-2013, 10:57 PM
  #262
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Originally Posted by LotteryForLife View Post
Letang and Kunitz for Streit and Moulson
welp

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02-10-2013, 11:05 PM
  #263
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
The Rangers don't need Letang or Neal. They have Chris "Dave Keon" Kreider.
Both our teams need more/better resources, based on the sorry showings of last year's cup playoffs.

I fully stand by the Keon comment.
Kreider has been all that to date fully worthy of not only that projection, but also showing flashes that he is more than mere speed, but a serious shot. That shot could mean he develops into another Pavel Bure.

Time will tell, but so far, so good.

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02-10-2013, 11:31 PM
  #264
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Surprised this thread is still kicking around.

The Pens are a different team without Letang, no way they trade him. He's a top 10 d man, arguably top 5 on a sweetheart contract.. You don't trade guys like that.

The Penguins don't even need another star winger, they need a solid top 6 winger whose better then Boychuk.

Lee Stempniak for 2nd '13


More of a future/potential, but I think it's worth a gamble; Brett Connolly for Derek Pouliot +. Many scouts had Connolly as the most talented player in the 2010 draft but he had an injury that saw his stock fall a bit. Played in the NHL last season but didn't make the deeper Bolts out of camp. He'll cost, but he could be an ideal winger for Sid for the next decade.

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02-10-2013, 11:46 PM
  #265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Both our teams need more/better resources, based on the sorry showings of last year's cup playoffs.

I fully stand by the Keon comment.
Kreider has been all that to date fully worthy of not only that projection, but also showing flashes that he is more than mere speed, but a serious shot. That shot could mean he develops into another Pavel Bure.

Time will tell, but so far, so good.
You never fail to entertain.

Looking forward to Kreider's Calder win, to keep pace.

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02-10-2013, 11:53 PM
  #266
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Originally Posted by SuburbanRhythm View Post
I guess we could go round and round forever, you'll never understand why this makes zero....no less than zero sense for Pittsburgh.

Taking all names out of the equation, please explain why Pittsburgh trades a 40 goal scoring winger, in a package, in hopes of then, down the line, finding a 40 goal scoring winger?

Additionally, if you are trying to help the Penguins "avoid a hole on their D", you don't move Letang in the first place!

Fair enough.

The OP worked on the assumption that moving Letang for a top W was possibly worthwhile for Pens. That is the assumption we are all speaking to; whether or not Letang (a D of his calibre) should actually be moved (for the return of only a single F of comparably high quality) is another question, one compounded by supply and demand.

The Fs on NY you would want --- Nash, Gaborik, Callahan and on potential, Kreider, are unavailable, not because Letang isn;t worth any of those guys, he is, but because NY needs more, not less snipers, even more than a superior puck moving D like Letang.

So you see offers like Perry for letang, but Perry is UFA at season's end. There are a handful of possibly do-able matches, but that does appear to result in coke for pepsi, or robbing peter to pay paul because of the supply and demand issues.

So while it was an entirely appropriate ? to ask, the OP hopes to achieve a conclusion that is either not robbing peter to pay paul, or is do-able in spite of that being the case.

To avoid this construct, I thought outside the box. I said, taking into account the totality of the circumstances, moving salary, etc., what new variables in the equation might work.

Then I thought, ok, if Rangers did 2 top all star complementary pair D, and 2 additional players and pick for only Letang, one other player and 2 futures, NY would upgrade at cost of depth, Pens would add D based alternate to Letang (Staal) + additional resources.

These additional resources, coupled with all other Pen assets, create an ability to get 2 offensive talented Fs. You might not want to move Girardi as such a hand in glove complement to Staal. But just to illustrate, you could add Girardi + x for Yakupov, or another sniper. That is the approximate offset for Neal.

Of course, this wasn't necessary except that, again, as a righty lefty tandem who are a complementary pair, there is a synergy to getting both Staal + Girardi. That;s why i say instead of moving Girardi + for Yakupov, you may want to tray a different combo.

The 2 Fs Rangers supply, Stepan + Boyle, as Cs in a tight market for Cs, should be enough to piece together (or with other assets, depending upon what your best bets are) that get you a second sniper.


So in conclusion:
Question: Taking all names out of the equation, please explain why Pittsburgh trades a 40 goal scoring winger, in a package, in hopes of then, down the line, finding a 40 goal scoring winger?

Answer: you need to take 3 steps back to eventually go 5 forward.
Supply and demand limit desired returns.
However, getting additional present assets now for 2 players and futures allows you to have more cards to play NOW. The extra cards is what makes it possible to get 2 offensive talents at F.

More direct answer. If you did not add Neal, you would not have gotten the additional present assets.


Question:
Additionally, if you are trying to help the Penguins "avoid a hole on their D", you don't move Letang in the first place!
Answer;
That defeats the premise of the OP, which forces you to consider trying a letang deal, though like i said, desired results seem to be the flip side of a coin with undesired price paid.

Rangers could offer like Girardi + Stepan for either Letang + or Neal +, But such a simple offer does not solve the problem as explained, and NY would not trade such assets to a division rival unless it could see a return worthy of such a surrender.



As I said, all bets are off, Letang is UFA after next year. He may well stay in Pitt with the dynamc duo +, or he may consider other options. We'll see

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02-10-2013, 11:57 PM
  #267
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They are not trading Letang. He is too valuable. This thread is horrible, this thread is ridiculous, this thread is comeupwithanynegativeadjective. Those old "Crosby for Ovechkin" trade proposals had a better chance of happening.

EDIT: Oh my god there's an Ovechkin to Pittsburgh thread right now.

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02-10-2013, 11:59 PM
  #268
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Letang is one of my favorite players and easily my favorite Pen. I'd love to see him on the Wings next to Kronwall or the Bolts next to Hedman. And Shero would be mindbogglingly retarded to trade him.

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02-10-2013, 11:59 PM
  #269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Fair enough.

The OP worked on the assumption that moving Letang for a top W was possibly worthwhile for Pens. That is the assumption we are all speaking to; whether or not Letang (a D of his calibre) should actually be moved (for the return of only a single F of comparably high quality) is another question, one compounded by supply and demand.

The Fs on NY you would want --- Nash, Gaborik, Callahan and on potential, Kreider, are unavailable, not because Letang isn;t worth any of those guys, he is, but because NY needs more, not less snipers, even more than a superior puck moving D like Letang.

So you see offers like Perry for letang, but Perry is UFA at season's end. There are a handful of possibly do-able matches, but that does appear to result in coke for pepsi, or robbing peter to pay paul because of the supply and demand issues.

So while it was an entirely appropriate ? to ask, the OP hopes to achieve a conclusion that is either not robbing peter to pay paul, or is do-able in spite of that being the case.

To avoid this construct, I thought outside the box. I said, taking into account the totality of the circumstances, moving salary, etc., what new variables in the equation might work.

Then I thought, ok, if Rangers did 2 top all star complementary pair D, and 2 additional players and pick for only Letang, one other player and 2 futures, NY would upgrade at cost of depth, Pens would add D based alternate to Letang (Staal) + additional resources.

These additional resources, coupled with all other Pen assets, create an ability to get 2 offensive talented Fs. You might not want to move Girardi as such a hand in glove complement to Staal. But just to illustrate, you could add Girardi + x for Yakupov, or another sniper. That is the approximate offset for Neal.

Of course, this wasn't necessary except that, again, as a righty lefty tandem who are a complementary pair, there is a synergy to getting both Staal + Girardi. That;s why i say instead of moving Girardi + for Yakupov, you may want to tray a different combo.

The 2 Fs Rangers supply, Stepan + Boyle, as Cs in a tight market for Cs, should be enough to piece together (or with other assets, depending upon what your best bets are) that get you a second sniper.


So in conclusion:
Question: Taking all names out of the equation, please explain why Pittsburgh trades a 40 goal scoring winger, in a package, in hopes of then, down the line, finding a 40 goal scoring winger?

Answer: you need to take 3 steps back to eventually go 5 forward.
Supply and demand limit desired returns.
However, getting additional present assets now for 2 players and futures allows you to have more cards to play NOW. The extra cards is what makes it possible to get 2 offensive talents at F.

More direct answer. If you did not add Neal, you would not have gotten the additional present assets.


Question:
Additionally, if you are trying to help the Penguins "avoid a hole on their D", you don't move Letang in the first place!
Answer;
That defeats the premise of the OP, which forces you to consider trying a letang deal, though like i said, desired results seem to be the flip side of a coin with undesired price paid.

Rangers could offer like Girardi + Stepan for either Letang + or Neal +, But such a simple offer does not solve the problem as explained, and NY would not trade such assets to a division rival unless it could see a return worthy of such a surrender.



As I said, all bets are off, Letang is UFA after next year. He may well stay in Pitt with the dynamc duo +, or he may consider other options. We'll see
Simple honest question - if Pittsburgh were to decide to deal Letang and I don't see that happening unless two of our D prospects are really ready, do you honestly think Shero would deal him to the Rags? Not a chance,s o why discuss the Rags as an option. You don't trade soemone like him, one of the best at his position, to a division rival.

Does Girardi work in Pittsburgh? He is good in New York's system of blockng everything. Not sure he works in Pittsburgh. I have no interest in Girardi and Stepan for Letang + or Neal +. Again, we are trading away the best player in the deal and we have to add?

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02-11-2013, 12:14 AM
  #270
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Originally Posted by OCPenguin View Post
Simple honest question - if Pittsburgh were to decide to deal Letang and I don't see that happening unless two of our D prospects are really ready, do you honestly think Shero would deal him to the Rags? Not a chance,s o why discuss the Rags as an option. You don't trade soemone like him, one of the best at his position, to a division rival.

Does Girardi work in Pittsburgh? He is good in New York's system of blockng everything. Not sure he works in Pittsburgh. I have no interest in Girardi and Stepan for Letang + or Neal +. Again, we are trading away the best player in the deal and we have to add?
1. It's assumed for discussion purposes division rivalry not a factor in this hypothetical.
In reality, I agree, that is an added factor against.
I never said it was irrelevant.

2. Girardi is all star D. Not complete as to offense, but excels at not only shot blocking but shadowing, checking, etc. He's not webber, but he gets the job done and is legit 1D.

3. I have no interest in Girardi and Stepan for Letang + or Neal +. Again, we are trading away the best player in the deal and we have to add?

I didn't anticipate you would go for a simpler deal which does not defeat the robbing paul to pay peter/vice versa, issue. I threw that out for explanation purposes.

The deal I suggested is the only one that defeats the peter paul issue. Add players add futures, seems to be only way to have your cake and eat it too.

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02-11-2013, 12:32 AM
  #271
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Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Fair enough.

The OP worked on the assumption that moving Letang for a top W was possibly worthwhile for Pens. That is the assumption we are all speaking to; whether or not Letang (a D of his calibre) should actually be moved (for the return of only a single F of comparably high quality) is another question, one compounded by supply and demand.

The Fs on NY you would want --- Nash, Gaborik, Callahan and on potential, Kreider, are unavailable, not because Letang isn;t worth any of those guys, he is, but because NY needs more, not less snipers, even more than a superior puck moving D like Letang.

So you see offers like Perry for letang, but Perry is UFA at season's end. There are a handful of possibly do-able matches, but that does appear to result in coke for pepsi, or robbing peter to pay paul because of the supply and demand issues.

So while it was an entirely appropriate ? to ask, the OP hopes to achieve a conclusion that is either not robbing peter to pay paul, or is do-able in spite of that being the case.

To avoid this construct, I thought outside the box. I said, taking into account the totality of the circumstances, moving salary, etc., what new variables in the equation might work.

Then I thought, ok, if Rangers did 2 top all star complementary pair D, and 2 additional players and pick for only Letang, one other player and 2 futures, NY would upgrade at cost of depth, Pens would add D based alternate to Letang (Staal) + additional resources.

These additional resources, coupled with all other Pen assets, create an ability to get 2 offensive talented Fs. You might not want to move Girardi as such a hand in glove complement to Staal. But just to illustrate, you could add Girardi + x for Yakupov, or another sniper. That is the approximate offset for Neal.

Of course, this wasn't necessary except that, again, as a righty lefty tandem who are a complementary pair, there is a synergy to getting both Staal + Girardi. That;s why i say instead of moving Girardi + for Yakupov, you may want to tray a different combo.

The 2 Fs Rangers supply, Stepan + Boyle, as Cs in a tight market for Cs, should be enough to piece together (or with other assets, depending upon what your best bets are) that get you a second sniper.


So in conclusion:
Question: Taking all names out of the equation, please explain why Pittsburgh trades a 40 goal scoring winger, in a package, in hopes of then, down the line, finding a 40 goal scoring winger?

Answer: you need to take 3 steps back to eventually go 5 forward.
Supply and demand limit desired returns.
However, getting additional present assets now for 2 players and futures allows you to have more cards to play NOW. The extra cards is what makes it possible to get 2 offensive talents at F.

More direct answer. If you did not add Neal, you would not have gotten the additional present assets.


Question:
Additionally, if you are trying to help the Penguins "avoid a hole on their D", you don't move Letang in the first place!
Answer;
That defeats the premise of the OP, which forces you to consider trying a letang deal, though like i said, desired results seem to be the flip side of a coin with undesired price paid.

Rangers could offer like Girardi + Stepan for either Letang + or Neal +, But such a simple offer does not solve the problem as explained, and NY would not trade such assets to a division rival unless it could see a return worthy of such a surrender.



As I said, all bets are off, Letang is UFA after next year. He may well stay in Pitt with the dynamc duo +, or he may consider other options. We'll see
i can tell you right now that, just for the fact that the Rangers would be calling Shero proposing this bad deal, Shero would hang up the phone the very second the Rangers' GM utters the syllable "Let--". it doesn't matter what the Rangers are sending to Pittsburgh. they don't touch any trade with them involving Neal or Letang, much less a deal with those players to any other team.

the ONLY time Letang will be on the block is if he wants out of Pittsburgh.

EDIT: even disregarding division rivalries, the Pens will not even think about trading Neal or Letang unless they want out AND it's a gigantic overpayment.

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02-11-2013, 12:36 AM
  #272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
1. It's assumed for discussion purposes division rivalry not a factor in this hypothetical.
In reality, I agree, that is an added factor against.
I never said it was irrelevant.

2. Girardi is all star D. Not complete as to offense, but excels at not only shot blocking but shadowing, checking, etc. He's not webber, but he gets the job done and is legit 1D.

3. I have no interest in Girardi and Stepan for Letang + or Neal +. Again, we are trading away the best player in the deal and we have to add?

I didn't anticipate you would go for a simpler deal which does not defeat the robbing paul to pay peter/vice versa, issue. I threw that out for explanation purposes.

The deal I suggested is the only one that defeats the peter paul issue. Add players add futures, seems to be only way to have your cake and eat it too.
your original offer was still something the Pens should never do unless, of course, both Letang and Neal publicly wanted out. even then, they shouldn't do that deal because Pittsburgh clearly gives up the best players in the deal.

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02-11-2013, 12:37 AM
  #273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
1. It's assumed for discussion purposes division rivalry not a factor in this hypothetical.
In reality, I agree, that is an added factor against.
I never said it was irrelevant.

2. Girardi is all star D. Not complete as to offense, but excels at not only shot blocking but shadowing, checking, etc. He's not webber, but he gets the job done and is legit 1D.

3. I have no interest in Girardi and Stepan for Letang + or Neal +. Again, we are trading away the best player in the deal and we have to add?

I didn't anticipate you would go for a simpler deal which does not defeat the robbing paul to pay peter/vice versa, issue. I threw that out for explanation purposes.

The deal I suggested is the only one that defeats the peter paul issue. Add players add futures, seems to be only way to have your cake and eat it too.
No question the deal doesn't make sense from either side, but how are the Rangers trading the best player in the deal?

They're very different players, but Girardi's slight defensive advantage doesn't close the sizeable gap in offensive and skating ability. Letang is the better player, no question. Stepan is an excellent young player, but surely you aren't referring to him as the best player in the deal?

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02-11-2013, 12:37 AM
  #274
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Originally Posted by The Wheeled Winger View Post
Letang is one of my favorite players and easily my favorite Pen. I'd love to see him on the Wings next to Kronwall or the Bolts next to Hedman. And Shero would be mindbogglingly retarded to trade him.
this. the only way Letang is getting out of Pittsburgh in a trade is if he demands a trade.

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02-11-2013, 12:38 AM
  #275
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Originally Posted by sparxx87 View Post
No question the deal doesn't make sense from either side, but how are the Rangers trading the best player in the deal?

They're very different players, but Girardi's slight defensive advantage doesn't close the sizeable gap in offensive and skating ability. Letang is the better player, no question. Stepan is an excellent young player, but surely you aren't referring to him as the best player in the deal?
he was actually quoting OCPenguin's post. OCPenguin pointed out that the Pens would be the ones having to add and he wanted to know why.

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