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Islanders Forwards or Islanders Defensemen

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Old
02-10-2013, 10:39 AM
  #1
Islanders1932
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Islanders Forwards or Islanders Defensemen

The Islanders have been scoring at a very good rate so far to open the season. In fact they are 8th in the league in Goals/Game. Then I decided to look at the other side of the equation and I see that the Islanders are 26th in the league in Goals Against/Game.

Then I got to thinking why is our defense not that great? Is the goals against per game completely the defenses fault or a result of our offensive players not getting back to play defense. When I look at the Islanders team I see people like MacDonald, Hamonic, and Streit putting up a +/- which always seems to be -. Have we over valued them as defensemen or maybe it is just them going up against the other teams top lines so much.

I am just really curious as to what people think is the real problem. Is it the Islanders forwards not getting back to play defense or is it that the Islanders Defensemen are not as good? The reason I am asking is because everyone keeps talking about how we need to make a trade for someone for offense, yet its our offense that isn't the problem. Are people suggesting we sign someone with a good two way game though?

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02-10-2013, 10:44 AM
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startainfection
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have you watched the last 4 games?

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02-10-2013, 10:45 AM
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InformTheMasses
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Coach/Owner

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02-10-2013, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Islanders1932 View Post
The Islanders have been scoring at a very good rate so far to open the season. In fact they are 8th in the league in Goals/Game. Then I decided to look at the other side of the equation and I see that the Islanders are 26th in the league in Goals Against/Game.

Then I got to thinking why is our defense not that great? Is the goals against per game completely the defenses fault or a result of our offensive players not getting back to play defense. When I look at the Islanders team I see people like MacDonald, Hamonic, and Streit putting up a +/- which always seems to be -. Have we over valued them as defensemen or maybe it is just them going up against the other teams top lines so much.

I am just really curious as to what people think is the real problem. Is it the Islanders forwards not getting back to play defense or is it that the Islanders Defensemen are not as good? The reason I am asking is because everyone keeps talking about how we need to make a trade for someone for offense, yet its our offense that isn't the problem. Are people suggesting we sign someone with a good two way game though?
Individually, I don't have a problem with Streit, Hamonic, AMac, Hickey, Strait, Vis. As a group though, I'm not crazy about them. Need to mix in some more size and toughness, and not necessarily Carkner. There aren't enough defensemen in this group that could smash forwards coming across the blue line, or make life miserable for forwards along the boards and in front of the net. Positionally, I like the D we have, and I like their intelligence too, but they don't make it very hard for the opposition to enter the zone or establish position once there.

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02-10-2013, 11:16 AM
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Individually, I don't have a problem with Streit, Hamonic, AMac, Hickey, Strait, Vis. As a group though, I'm not crazy about them. Need to mix in some more size and toughness, and not necessarily Carkner. There aren't enough defensemen in this group that could smash forwards coming across the blue line, or make life miserable for forwards along the boards and in front of the net. Positionally, I like the D we have, and I like their intelligence too, but they don't make it very hard for the opposition to enter the zone or establish position once there.
I agree with this, particularly the size and defensive smarts issues.

Another part of the problem is the lack of physical forwards, wearing out one goaltender with the gimp as the backup, and the fact our head coach is not NHL caliber and gets outcoached regularly. How many goals have we given up due to bad line changes or the team not being ready for the first two periods?

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02-10-2013, 11:18 AM
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Much like our forwards, we lack a true top pairing.

I say Streit & Hamonic are both #3s on good teams. Hamonic has potential to be a top pairing Dman. Visnovsky a 4, Macdonald a 5, Strait a 5 and Carkner a 6/7. The good news with Streit & Visnovsky is that they absolutely are a top pair PP unit.

Combine that with a forward corps that is probably the least physical in the entire league & it's no wonder they're a poor defensive team.

It also hurts that we don't really have a viable backup goalie who can give Nabokov a much needed rest.

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02-10-2013, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Veteran journeyman View Post
Individually, I don't have a problem with Streit, Hamonic, AMac, Hickey, Strait, Vis. As a group though, I'm not crazy about them. Need to mix in some more size and toughness, and not necessarily Carkner. There aren't enough defensemen in this group that could smash forwards coming across the blue line, or make life miserable for forwards along the boards and in front of the net. Positionally, I like the D we have, and I like their intelligence too, but they don't make it very hard for the opposition to enter the zone or establish position once there.
I totally agree with this. I also think we have two more problems though. One has to be goaltending. Nabby is tired and we can't trust DP. It also seems like Cappy can't get these guys ready for every game. corget about getting them ready for every game he can't get them ready for HALF the games. That is not a recipe for success.

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02-10-2013, 12:00 PM
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Its not all the defenses fault. Nabby's let in a few I'm sure he'd like to have back.

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02-10-2013, 02:24 PM
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It's a mixture of the following:

A)D isn't tough enough in front of the net
B)Isles Centers have been pretty bad on the defensive side of the puck
C)Nabby has been "meh" this season. Sure he makes some good stops but he's been also letting in a lot of stuff he should've stopped.

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02-10-2013, 02:54 PM
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To me it comes down to size and toughness, which also ties in to battle level and commitment to a play. They've been way too inconsistent with this, and even when the effort is there they lack the experience and ability to win. There are too many players who are soft and avoid physicality... That's not a knock on them as individuals per se. For example, Michael Grabner is valuable to this team but he's never going to be the type that engages physically. The problem is the roster lacks impact players who are willing to play physical to balance out the softer, smaller players outside of Matt Martin and Travis Hamonic. JT doesn't play physical but he's tough and never shies away from a hit. They sign guys like Boulton and Carkner because they can fight, but they're not really capable of bringing a sustained physical presence since they don't play enough minutes and don't have abilities that warrant playing more. Look how well they played in 2011 when they had noticeable team toughness. Comeau threw the body around, Martin, Haley, and Konopka fought, hit, and did all the little things to spark the team. They had an identity. This team has very little of that type of toughness, and doesn't know who they are. I wouldn't blame the forwards as a group or the defense as a group for this team's struggles; it's the entire roster top to bottom. It's the team's culture.

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02-10-2013, 03:47 PM
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That's why the Isles drafted seven defensemen this past draft.

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02-10-2013, 04:03 PM
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There's nothing wrong with the team-they're just not that good.

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02-10-2013, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isle Junkie View Post
Much like our forwards, we lack a true top pairing.

I say Streit & Hamonic are both #3s on good teams. Hamonic has potential to be a top pairing Dman. Visnovsky a 4, Macdonald a 5, Strait a 5 and Carkner a 6/7. The good news with Streit & Visnovsky is that they absolutely are a top pair PP unit.

Combine that with a forward corps that is probably the least physical in the entire league & it's no wonder they're a poor defensive team.

It also hurts that we don't really have a viable backup goalie who can give Nabokov a much needed rest.
I disagree with the bold, how the hell do you have Streit as a #3 on a good team and have Amac as a #5? Amac has been much better than Streit, who has been a liability defensively for 5 on 5. Amac would be a top 4 defenseman on good teams.

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02-10-2013, 06:40 PM
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Amac is a top 4 D-man on most teams in the NHL. Enjoy him while he's here on the cheap because he will probably jump ship when he becomes a free agent. He will get 4 times what he's making now and the Islanders probably won't go that high now that they have Strait to take his place.

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02-10-2013, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brunomics View Post
It's a mixture of the following:

A)D isn't tough enough in front of the net
B)Isles Centers have been pretty bad on the defensive side of the puck
C)Nabby has been "meh" this season. Sure he makes some good stops but he's been also letting in a lot of stuff he should've stopped.
This is to me is it in a nutshell. I would throw in a D

D) Worst breakout in the league. Every team seems to have a solid way of getting the puck out of their zone while setting up a way to enter the offensive zone. Meanwhile the Islanders look like someone playing NHL 13 trying to make silly passes and no real point of attack.

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02-10-2013, 06:51 PM
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InformTheMasses
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Originally Posted by 19NYSports91 View Post
I disagree with the bold, how the hell do you have Streit as a #3 on a good team and have Amac as a #5? Amac has been much better than Streit, who has been a liability defensively for 5 on 5. Amac would be a top 4 defenseman on good teams.

I love the way you see the game and evaluate players. (Mainly because it is very similar to mine)

A-Mac is a top 4 defenceman. And you know what? So is Brian Strait.

Mark Streit? Not so much. 6th defenceman/PP specialist AT BEST

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02-10-2013, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brunomics View Post
It's a mixture of the following:

A)D isn't tough enough in front of the net
B)Isles Centers have been pretty bad on the defensive side of the puck
C)Nabby has been "meh" this season. Sure he makes some good stops but he's been also letting in a lot of stuff he should've stopped.
This exactly!

We don't clear the crease, we swat at loose pucks. When we miss, the next stop is in the goal.

When Frans misses with his stick, Vanek scores because nobody is strong enough back there to clear him out.

Nabby has looked very shaky lately.

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02-11-2013, 12:02 AM
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19NYSports91
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I still think Coaching is the biggest problem on this team. I think if the Isles had Laviolette or a good coach really, Okposo would become a better player, he needs a head coach to really push him.

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02-11-2013, 02:49 AM
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I still think Coaching is the biggest problem on this team. I think if the Isles had Laviolette or a good coach really, Okposo would become a better player, he needs a head coach to really push him.
As I was a big Cappy supporter, you nailed it. The team does not hit, battle or drive hard.

The forwards do not go in the middle to crash.
The defense does not take the body IN THE SLOT.
The forwards do not take the body in the D zone.
The team boxes in tight and does not move players out of scoring areas.
The team does not pass well.
The team does not position itself well in defensive situations or on offense.


There's a ton more, but it's NOT the players. You want proof, you see the kids who played in Bridgeport during the lockout looked the best and slid to NYIAHL levels in no time.

So....It's the coaching. Need a tough coach who demands more.

And PLEASE don't push the status quo. We need a real NHL coach and if Weight or Thompson gets hired, so be it. Don't go promoting the assistant coach her, hire THE BEST coach.

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02-11-2013, 06:11 AM
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Islanders1932
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The fact that the Islanders haven't won a game where they have scored 2 or less goalies is pretty bad. I know its early, but the defense has to be better on both sides of the puck.

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02-11-2013, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Islanders1932 View Post
The fact that the Islanders haven't won a game where they have scored 2 or less goalies is pretty bad. I know its early, but the defense has to be better on both sides of the puck.
They need to cut Streits 5 on 5 minutes down. Strait had only 12 minutes against the Sabres and had 2 assists. I know he's not an offensive player but he needs to be out there and take some of Streits 5 on 5 minutes.

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02-11-2013, 08:34 AM
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Islanders1932
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They need to cut Streits 5 on 5 minutes down. Strait had only 12 minutes against the Sabres and had 2 assists. I know he's not an offensive player but he needs to be out there and take some of Streits 5 on 5 minutes.
This is why I am welcoming Visnovsky with open arms. I think our top 3 defenders have been playing too much. Hopefully Vis provides much needed relief for them. He should hopefully cut down on their minutes and we should fare better.

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