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The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

Portland [Gallacher] poised for NHL bid? (QMI's Perry Nelson) See Post #18

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Old
02-10-2013, 10:29 PM
  #51
MoreOrr
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Originally Posted by HugoSimon View Post
What`s wrong with the Portland Coyotes.

I think any relocation should make an honest attempt to keep the original teams name.
Calgary did it, and I suppose it wouldn't be an inappropriate name for a team in Oregon.


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02-10-2013, 10:37 PM
  #52
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Calgary did it, and I suppose it wouldn't be an unappropriate name for a team in Oregon.
But, hey - it's at least as appropriate as the LA Lakers or Utah Jazz.

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02-10-2013, 10:45 PM
  #53
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Calgary did it, and I suppose it wouldn't be an unappropriate name for a team in Oregon.
Meh it`s not like there`s a long hockey history in oregon, why force a new name without any backstory whatsoever when you can simply build on something.

Also I think Oregon Coyotes sounds pretty good or better yet the Oregon Coyote`s.

Ideally the winterhawks, with an snowy owl as a mascot would be best but whateveh

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02-10-2013, 10:55 PM
  #54
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But, hey - it's at least as appropriate as the LA Lakers or Utah Jazz.
The NHL seems to be a bit of an anomaly in that relocated teams go for an identity change when they relocate with the only exceptions being the Atlanta to Calgary Flames and the North Stars to Stars when they moved to Dallas. The other three professional leagues have chosen to keep their names, however recent relocations have had name changes (Montreal Expos -> Washington Nationals, Houston Oilers -> Tennessee Titans, and Seattle Super Sonics -> OKC Thunder).

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02-10-2013, 11:51 PM
  #55
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Having just moved to Portland I'll say I don't really see much of a sports culture at all here. I haven't seen a single person wearing in jersey (or shirt or hoodie) for any team in any sport since I got here. Then there is the whole Portland vs. Vancouver cross-river thing going on. And St. John's is pretty much a black hole for trying to draw fans (too damn eclectic or counter culture to ever be "mainstream" in cheering for a sports team; also too damn stoned to read a schedule). Portland in terms of square mileage is not a big city at all. I can ride a bike across it in an hour. Just don't see it being ready for an NHL team.

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02-11-2013, 01:12 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by MuzikMachine View Post
The NHL seems to be a bit of an anomaly in that relocated teams go for an identity change when they relocate with the only exceptions being the Atlanta to Calgary Flames and the North Stars to Stars when they moved to Dallas. The other three professional leagues have chosen to keep their names, however recent relocations have had name changes (Montreal Expos -> Washington Nationals, Houston Oilers -> Tennessee Titans, and Seattle Super Sonics -> OKC Thunder).
Well, I think what happened was that teams started feeling like it was bad PR to keep a name that didn't make sense.

There isn't a lot of whaling history in North Carolina. The thrasher is not the provincial bird of Manitoba. A Nordique is someone from the North, which has no bearing on a team in Denver. There isn't a history of aviation or building airplanes in Oklahoma City or in Phoenix. There wasn't an oil boom in Tennessee. There was not a gigantic convention called an Expo in Washington, DC. I believe the city of Cleveland wanted to keep the Browns name for their expansion team.

There just happens to be a lot more relocation in other leagues of teams with non-regional names or names that can apply to both places. Rams. Raiders. Athletics. Flames. Hornets. Nets. The one that really makes little sense is the Grizzlies...

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02-11-2013, 01:16 PM
  #57
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I recall San Jose proposed "Ice Hawks" before going with Sharks.
Nope. That was not one of the finalists (that fans voted on). Fog, Blades and Sharks were the three top ones.


(AIUI, Blades was the top vote getter, but the gang/violence connotation was too much. Sharks later named their AHL affiliate/franchise the Thoroughblades -- located in Lexington, Kentucky.)

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02-11-2013, 01:21 PM
  #58
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Personally, I just don't like it when a team's name, colors, and even history moves with the franchise. As far as I'm concerned, even if it's the same ownership, it's the market where those traditions and heritage were established that they should remain, as that's where it really matters. If the Yotes do move, be it to Quebec City or Seattle or wherever, the fans there aren't going to give two ****s about the team's history and heritage from the days in the desert, after all.

Obviously, I know that's not how it works in reality, except for the Browns, but I think it's the way it should work. Team wants to move? Okay, you get to keep your players, but you're essentially an expansion team for all intents and purposes and the franchise gets left behind in the event that the league ever goes back to there.

MOD


Last edited by LadyStanley: 02-11-2013 at 01:45 PM. Reason: natd
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Old
02-12-2013, 12:47 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by No Fun Shogun View Post
Personally, I just don't like it when a team's name, colors, and even history moves with the franchise. As far as I'm concerned, even if it's the same ownership, it's the market where those traditions and heritage were established that they should remain, as that's where it really matters. If the Yotes do move, be it to Quebec City or Seattle or wherever, the fans there aren't going to give two ****s about the team's history and heritage from the days in the desert, after all.

Obviously, I know that's not how it works in reality, except for the Browns, but I think it's the way it should work. Team wants to move? Okay, you get to keep your players, but you're essentially an expansion team for all intents and purposes and the franchise gets left behind in the event that the league ever goes back to there.

MOD
Meh I think the legacy carriers over, especially if the teams stays in the same division.

For me the jets is gonna still be the thrashers, until they start playing games in a different division.

I think the yotes could keep a portion of their moutain time zone fans especially in places like utah,

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03-07-2013, 04:00 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
Nope. That was not one of the finalists (that fans voted on). Fog, Blades and Sharks were the three top ones.


(AIUI, Blades was the top vote getter, but the gang/violence connotation was too much. Sharks later named their AHL affiliate/franchise the Thoroughblades -- located in Lexington, Kentucky.)
What if we audited these votes?

It's been observed from other angles that these can be good at getting attention, but the owner often has his or her own designs... which doesn't preclude the notion of having the vote without ever having to truly count it and give weight to it.

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03-07-2013, 04:01 PM
  #61
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BTW, there would usually be followup by now if this were a serious consideration. I think the tires were kicked and that's about it.

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03-08-2013, 01:59 AM
  #62
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I think today going through was very good news for a city like Portland. A place that pursued the Penguins pretty heavily a long time ago and was said to be close back the first time the Pens almost moved.

Toronto 2 could be a Western team, really would think the Leafs and some other teams would push for that and that would be kind of a balance for the city getting a second team that they would have to pay. Plus it allows the largest hockey market and early game and late game when possible which is good business.

Quebec City is in trouble now in my opinion in anything but an existing Eastern team relocation somewhere a longtime down the road.

That leaves a lot of potential cities that also can grow the game in America and help offset some of the lost viewer numbers in Atlanta and potentially Phoenix.

This leaves Kansas City, Houston, Milwaukee (If the Bucks leave which I think will happen), Omaha (a sneaky one that I personally love), Portland, Seattle, Las Vegas, Salt Lake City. Lots of options in my opinion and bad news for the Quebec City hopefuls.

If Phoenix moved to Portland, you could put Seattle in as an expansion team and complete the Pacific in a pretty nice way, have two ready made rivals.

Then you have a choice between Houston (A giant media market with a Dallas rival angle), Milwaukee (once again I think the Bucks will move to Kansas City), Kansas City (if they don't, not a big fan of a hockey move here but St. Louis would be an obvious rival) and Omaha.

Omaha has an arena, a decent amount of money and maybe some potential owners isn't quite as small as everyone thinks. They support hockey in both USHL and college and would be uncontested as the only bigtime pro show in town. Think about the success the Thunder have enjoyed from pulling this idea. Sure it would be tough to get free agents but we will have to see.

In any event Portland and Seattle coming in the pacific is a good idea. Moving the Coyotes to Portland is one of the better options in my opinion.

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03-08-2013, 02:00 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by PCSPounder View Post
BTW, there would usually be followup by now if this were a serious consideration. I think the tires were kicked and that's about it.
Winnipeg campaigned and campaigned, they got real quiet when it was actually a real possability. If someone is moving in on this or has jumped to the top of the rumored two expansion places I would expect them to be very quiet.

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03-08-2013, 02:12 AM
  #64
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I think today going through was very good news for a city like Portland. A place that pursued the Penguins pretty heavily a long time ago and was said to be close back the first time the Pens almost moved.

Toronto 2 could be a Western team, really would think the Leafs and some other teams would push for that and that would be kind of a balance for the city getting a second team that they would have to pay. Plus it allows the largest hockey market and early game and late game when possible which is good business.

Quebec City is in trouble now in my opinion in anything but an existing Eastern team relocation somewhere a longtime down the road.

That leaves a lot of potential cities that also can grow the game in America and help offset some of the lost viewer numbers in Atlanta and potentially Phoenix.

This leaves Kansas City, Houston, Milwaukee (If the Bucks leave which I think will happen), Omaha (a sneaky one that I personally love), Portland, Seattle, Las Vegas, Salt Lake City. Lots of options in my opinion and bad news for the Quebec City hopefuls.

If Phoenix moved to Portland, you could put Seattle in as an expansion team and complete the Pacific in a pretty nice way, have two ready made rivals.

Then you have a choice between Houston (A giant media market with a Dallas rival angle), Milwaukee (once again I think the Bucks will move to Kansas City), Kansas City (if they don't, not a big fan of a hockey move here but St. Louis would be an obvious rival) and Omaha.

Omaha has an arena, a decent amount of money and maybe some potential owners isn't quite as small as everyone thinks. They support hockey in both USHL and college and would be uncontested as the only bigtime pro show in town. Think about the success the Thunder have enjoyed from pulling this idea. Sure it would be tough to get free agents but we will have to see.

In any event Portland and Seattle coming in the pacific is a good idea. Moving the Coyotes to Portland is one of the better options in my opinion.
Not a single one of your US options would provide a hockey market a tenth as good as Quebec City. The Omaha idea is beyond absurd. Who in hell would be insane enough to buy a team and move it there?

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03-08-2013, 04:56 AM
  #65
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Yea, almost as insane as moving a team to OKC. I am a bitter Sonic fan, but once Durant leaves / retires they very well could be in trouble and have to move.

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03-09-2013, 12:32 AM
  #66
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Yea, almost as insane as moving a team to OKC. I am a bitter Sonic fan, but once Durant leaves / retires they very well could be in trouble and have to move.
Oklahoma City metro is 50% larger than Omaha and still has a spot of oil money flowing about it. Let's also remember that the NBA has a habit of finding viable markets of about that size. Stateside, the NHL eventually left Hartford and Nashville lives due to the generosity of their city government.

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03-10-2013, 08:19 AM
  #67
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Portland is too wierd for hockey. Sorry, but it's true. Until Wesco makes skates I don't see anything changing there, either.

Seattle has made a downtown arena an impossibility, so they'd be playing in Tacoma or someplace. They could support a team without being distracted by basketball.

Really, there has never been a cry for hockey from either city. I find it very hard to believe they would displace cities crying out for a franchise! Quebec City, despite thier trevailles, should be in contention. They are at least as viable as Toronto II. Kansas City is trying to restart thier entire downtown around a new arena. Las Vegas has an empty arena and some sports background. Salt Lake City is right on the bus route, that has to count for something!

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03-10-2013, 02:11 PM
  #68
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Seattle has made a downtown arena an impossibility, so they'd be playing in Tacoma or someplace.
Seattle is about to build one, in SODO, which isn't quite downtown, but within walking distance or one station away on the lightrail. Key Arena will also be made ready to temporary host a franchise. The NHL is coming to Seattle soon.

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03-10-2013, 03:22 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by DeathToAllButMetal View Post
Not a single one of your US options would provide a hockey market a tenth as good as Quebec City. The Omaha idea is beyond absurd. Who in hell would be insane enough to buy a team and move it there?
Seattle is slightly larger in both urban and metro statistics, it could support an NHL team without much trouble. I don't think you have any idea on what you're talking about dude

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03-10-2013, 03:37 PM
  #70
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Seattle is slightly larger in both urban and metro statistics, it could support an NHL team without much trouble. I don't think you have any idea on what you're talking about dude
That doesn't mean it's a better hockey market.

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03-10-2013, 03:42 PM
  #71
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That doesn't mean it's a better hockey market.
You could say the same about Quebec City

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03-10-2013, 03:48 PM
  #72
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You could say the same about Quebec City
I wouldn't doubt that Quebec is a better hockey market.

I would also say that, from 1960 on, Portland shows better as a hockey market than "the fishing village to the north." I know more than one Seattlelite who feels the same way.

However, this game isn't always about having the better hockey market. NHL still needs TV revenue, hence we must suffer the scourge that is Seattle discussion.

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03-10-2013, 03:58 PM
  #73
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I would also say that, from 1960 on, Portland shows better as a hockey market than "the fishing village to the north."
Yes, Portland is a better hockey market than Astoria. Duh.

But since Portland is near Seattle, a better hockey town* and larger market, Portland is not in the NHL's radar unless Seattlite Paul Allen wants to do something about it, and stabbing his home town in the back is probably not one of them.


* - the numbers back this up. Higher participation levels, higher total hockey attendance (remember, for most of the last 20 years, the Puget Sound area has had multiple hockey teams).

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03-10-2013, 04:28 PM
  #74
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Isn't this the same sort of insanity that got the NHL three teams in the US SE, three in CA, etc.? And unbalanced the entire league in the process?

It would be absurd to put two teams the US NW. Makes no sense at all. Can't imagine anything stupider on the NHL's behalf other than going into, IDK, Tucson?
it makes perfect sense. You think Oilers/Flames rivalry doesn't make sense? do you think Flyers/Penguins rivalry doesn't make sense?

regional teams make some of the best rivalries around. And i can assure you if you put 2 teams in Seattle and Portland, They WILL become fierce rivals. You just have to look at Sounders and Timbers rivalry just to see how intense it is there. Even Trailblazers and Sonics had a good thing going until Bennett screwed it all up.

But really Seattle should get first crack. If Seattle team becomes successful. I'm sure Portland will surely want a team of their own.

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03-10-2013, 04:35 PM
  #75
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it makes perfect sense. You think Oilers/Flames rivalry doesn't make sense? do you think Flyers/Penguins rivalry doesn't make sense?

regional teams make some of the best rivalries around. And i can assure you if you put 2 teams in Seattle and Portland, They WILL become fierce rivals. You just have to look at Sounders and Timbers rivalry just to see how intense it is there. Even Trailblazers and Sonics had a good thing going until Bennett screwed it all up.

But really Seattle should get first crack. If Seattle team becomes successful. I'm sure Portland will surely want a team of their own.
Vancouver would love nothing more than to have Seattle and Portland in the mix

The Cascadia Cup all over again

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