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Goaltending discussion thread (edit: Markstrom called up)

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Old
02-11-2013, 01:28 PM
  #201
Pantherfan12
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Originally Posted by Coolburn View Post
I think its not even just about a "good business" move or not. Also, its about how our treatment of players as an organization becomes known around the league and Tallon strongly believes in doing that the right way. Guys like Havlat stated before how Tallon treats players very positively and they believe in a guy like that (same reason Campbell came to play for him twice now). Tallon preaches that he wants players with character and I believe thats why he re-signed Clemmensen.

So just discarding Clemmer via waivers would not be looked upon favorably nor would just trading him with only 2 starts in this season. I'm sure no one would look down on us trading him at the deadline if we're out of contention or even the offseason. If we're going to call up Markstrom at any point, it would be after the trade deadline and we've already moved a goalie.
While I agree with your post, I also do agree that Tallon has to look out for the best interest of the team and I highly doubt that interest is being a lottery team.
Tallon also preaches accountability and every player earning their ice time. If Clemmer doesn't play up to his/Dale Tallons' standards, then he needs to be demoted like any other player. I don't know if Dineen can scratch Clemmer while bringing up Marky,like any player can be scratched, or if he has to go through waivers because he's a goalie.
In all, I think our team has come out more ready in the past week, hence the good road trip,but we can't have our goaltending playing subpar,and not being able to light fires under their butts ( scratching clemmer and bringing up Marky, for instance)

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02-11-2013, 03:47 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by flapanthersfan View Post
no problem

im growing frustrated with the responses - people are nitpicking points but sidestepping the main premise. debating semantics is pointless.

theodore has not been not playing well lately. he was great the first 3 games he started, but since then he hasn't been good. there is something wrong with his technique, and i'm not a goaltending coach so i can't pinpoint it exactly, but i know enough about the position (having played it for 20+ years, competitively) to see it. just about every weak goal has been on his blocker side when shooters are coming off his left side. he's leaving too much room short side in those situations. it almost looks like he's guessing, but he's not (no goalie at this level does that...obviously) the sulzer goal in particular in buffalo was laughably bad.

he needs to correct it quickly or we're in trouble, unless of course, our management is listening and give a certain someone a chance to step in while theo finds his game. but we don't have much time for him to figure it out or we're going to get buried.
For a guy who has played the position for 20+ years, you would think you could figure out Theodore's problem isn't technique, it's confidence. When he isn't confident, he is flat out horrible. It's been that way throughout his career.

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02-11-2013, 04:12 PM
  #203
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For a guy who has played the position for 20+ years, you would think you could figure out Theodore's problem isn't technique, it's confidence. When he isn't confident, he is flat out horrible. It's been that way throughout his career.
for a guy that struggles with his confidence routinely in goal - guess what is the first thing to go?

perhaps you're right - his confidence is low and in turn, it's affecting his technique. but there's definitely something wrong with it.

regardless - he's 37, he should be stronger mentally by now.

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02-11-2013, 04:45 PM
  #204
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It's my understanding that Jose was brought in to be a stopgap goaltender til Markstrom was ready to play. That's one of the reasons why I've not grown attached to him. He's been inconsistent for years now. He was solid in goal last season but I think it's asking too much of him to do that again. He's probably of best use as a backup at this point in his career.

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02-11-2013, 04:56 PM
  #205
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Fialkov Tweeted to Adam Graves that Markstrom could be up if the struggles continue in goal. It's Harvey, though. I'm sure Markstrom will see playing time at some point, though.

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02-11-2013, 07:54 PM
  #206
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Reimer went down. Tallon can try to unload Clem now. Haha

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02-11-2013, 09:11 PM
  #207
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Reimer went down. Tallon can try to unload Clem now. Haha

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Oh gosh, TOronto's gonna trip balls and it's going to be awful in town.

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02-11-2013, 09:45 PM
  #208
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I think we have to ask ourselves if calling up markstrom will get our team over the edge. I think the answer is no this season. Our inconsistencies perhaps start at net but they also present themselves in every position on the ice.

Is one 40 save performance where markstrom stands on his head instead of clem getting shelled, going to be the difference between playoffs and non-playoffs? I don't pretend to have a crystal ball but using an 11 game sample size I don't see anything to prove otherwise that our inconsistencies in defense and scoring will suddenly disappear for the better.

I think its time to take one out of the one the most successful franchise's playbooks in the Detroit Red Wings: Over ripen the prospects. I can think of no better player or position to gain as much experience before coming to the NHL than the position of goaltender.

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02-11-2013, 11:56 PM
  #209
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at what point does leaving Jacob Markstrom in the AHL start to hinder his ability to adjust to NHL hockey? Just a curious point... I know goalies are obviously much different in development than players but I can't imagine another reason for Markstrom not being up other than the fact that there's no room.

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02-12-2013, 01:31 AM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Beinfest View Post
at what point does leaving Jacob Markstrom in the AHL start to hinder his ability to adjust to NHL hockey? Just a curious point... I know goalies are obviously much different in development than players but I can't imagine another reason for Markstrom not being up other than the fact that there's no room.
I don't think that is an issue to be concerned about.

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02-12-2013, 01:37 AM
  #211
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Originally Posted by PanthersHockey1 View Post
I think we have to ask ourselves if calling up markstrom will get our team over the edge. I think the answer is no this season. Our inconsistencies perhaps start at net but they also present themselves in every position on the ice.

Is one 40 save performance where markstrom stands on his head instead of clem getting shelled, going to be the difference between playoffs and non-playoffs? I don't pretend to have a crystal ball but using an 11 game sample size I don't see anything to prove otherwise that our inconsistencies in defense and scoring will suddenly disappear for the better.

I think its time to take one out of the one the most successful franchise's playbooks in the Detroit Red Wings: Over ripen the prospects. I can think of no better player or position to gain as much experience before coming to the NHL than the position of goaltender.
If Dale Tallon is throwing the season or riding it out for the sake of seasoning his prospects then it makes no sense to rush them along.

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02-12-2013, 06:23 AM
  #212
adam graves
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Originally Posted by Cats Kneading Goals View Post
If Dale Tallon is throwing the season or riding it out for the sake of seasoning his prospects then it makes no sense to rush them along.
Anyone that thinks that Tallon is throwing the season is crazy. The franchise is desperate to build off last year not go backwards. Season renewals, club red, etc would be devastated.

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02-12-2013, 08:11 AM
  #213
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Originally Posted by adam graves View Post
Anyone that thinks that Tallon is throwing the season is crazy. The franchise is desperate to build off last year not go backwards. Season renewals, club red, etc would be devastated.
Doubt he's throwing it, but I think he's riding it along.

If things go further into the crapper he's not going to move assets to fix it.

Got that impression from Santos interview a few weeks ago as well.

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02-12-2013, 10:47 AM
  #214
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Originally Posted by JP Mick View Post
I don't think that is an issue to be concerned about.
But why not? I mean it's not like any of us here are professional hockey players, but I imagine the longer you spend at a lower level, the harder it is to move on up.

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02-12-2013, 10:50 AM
  #215
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But why not? I mean it's not like any of us here are professional hockey players, but I imagine the longer you spend at a lower level, the harder it is to move on up.
It makes no difference. Another 30 games in the AHL would only be beneficial. There's no way it would harm him.

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02-12-2013, 01:53 PM
  #216
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It makes no difference. Another 30 games in the AHL would only be beneficial. There's no way it would harm him.
Would you say that next year as well? And the year after? At what point does it go from being beneficial to being a waste of time?

The way I see it is... he's already dominated that league. Time to move on.

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02-12-2013, 02:00 PM
  #217
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Markstrom will be up soon.. He should have stared this season as the starter.cmaybe even start last years season as well...

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02-12-2013, 02:41 PM
  #218
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Markstrom will be up soon.. He should have stared this season as the starter.cmaybe even start last years season as well...
So now we're down to questioning last season, even though we made the playoffs with two winning records in goal? Jesus, come on guys. I'd like to see Markstrom up as much as most of you but seriously?

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02-12-2013, 03:34 PM
  #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Beinfest View Post
Would you say that next year as well? And the year after? At what point does it go from being beneficial to being a waste of time?

The way I see it is... he's already dominated that league. Time to move on.
You and I have very different definitions of the word dominated.

He's been very good and has had dominant stretches. He's also had stretches where he looked just ok.

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02-12-2013, 03:34 PM
  #220
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Reimer went down. Tallon can try to unload Clem now. Haha

-ghoste
Calgary is relying on LEEEEEEEEEEELAND IRRRRRRRRVING with Kipper out right now, wow I like saying that name in my head alot

Clem for a 5th rounder is probably asking too much though. Just a thought though. With Clemmensen gone, Theodore knows he would get at least another year or two here and could still play anywhere from 25-40 games a season until Markstrom fully adjusts.

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02-12-2013, 03:41 PM
  #221
adam graves
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You and I have very different definitions of the word dominated.

He's been very good and has had dominant stretches. He's also had stretches where he looked just ok.
Neither of our goalies can say that so far this yr.

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02-12-2013, 03:49 PM
  #222
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Neither of our goalies can say that so far this yr.
Neither of our goalies are playing in the AHL.

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02-12-2013, 03:55 PM
  #223
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Quote:
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Neither of our goalies can say that so far this yr.
Edit: what Erick said...

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02-12-2013, 04:28 PM
  #224
adam graves
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Neither of our goalies are playing in the AHL.
yet they are getting NHL pay to play in the NHL very well with dominant streaks....

neither of them have.

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02-12-2013, 06:22 PM
  #225
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Man, this thread is going to go off if Clem gets lit up tonight.

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