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Would you consider moving Cole if the price is right?

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Old
02-12-2013, 06:08 AM
  #201
IceDaddy
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Originally Posted by schumway2 View Post
Not the type to say "I told you so" but....
He got a slow start last year too. He'll be fine.....

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02-12-2013, 06:21 AM
  #202
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Originally Posted by Aceekay View Post
I agree that you don't trade players when they're slumping, but this isnt a slump cole is simply getting older and his heart probably isn't in it anymore, he can prove me wrong but I doubt it. But the right time to have traded him was last year at the deadline, hopefully bergervin understands asset management better than his predecessors.
Part of asset management is treating the free agents that you sign with class and respect. Cole delivered more than they could have hoped for last season. If he doesn't ask to be moved then Gauthier doesn't shop him.....end of story

This isn't NHL 13........there are real people involved. If you want to make this a remotely attractive destination for future FA's then you don't **** over the ones that you have actually managed to sign. It is a more pallatable option at this point due to Cole's lackluster play but it is still something that would need to be approached the right way with Cole's co-operation.

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02-12-2013, 06:48 AM
  #203
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Part of asset management is treating the free agents that you sign with class and respect. Cole delivered more than they could have hoped for last season. If he doesn't ask to be moved then Gauthier doesn't shop him.....end of story

This isn't NHL 13........there are real people involved. If you want to make this a remotely attractive destination for future FA's then you don't **** over the ones that you have actually managed to sign. It is a more pallatable option at this point due to Cole's lackluster play but it is still something that would need to be approached the right way with Cole's co-operation.
The most important piece of the attracting free agents puzzle is being able to offer the most money. That is why Cammalleri, Gionta, Spacek, Moen, Prust, and Cole came here.

Get rid of Cole and our cap space goes up, we can then offer money to someone else and they'll come here.

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Old
02-12-2013, 07:01 AM
  #204
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
The most important piece of the attracting free agents puzzle is being able to offer the most money. That is why Cammalleri, Gionta, Spacek, Moen, Prust, and Cole came here.

Get rid of Cole and our cap space goes up, we can then offer money to someone else and they'll come here.
Cole explicitly said he went for the Montreal offer because Goat was offering more term, not money. I think it was the same for Spacho (not sure though). Brière chose Philly over us, eventhough the Habs were offering more $$$.
Top free agents get a lot of offers, often with comparable amounts of money, and then, other elements come into play like team rep, its capacity to compete for the cup, good players already there...

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02-12-2013, 07:46 AM
  #205
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I don't see the point of trading Cole right now unless it's a "too good to refuse" type offer. His contract is perfect in that some of our RW will have another 18 months to develop before we have to replace him. I would consider dealing him the summer of 2014 once Kristo and LeBlanc are ready for top 9 NHL duty.

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02-12-2013, 08:27 AM
  #206
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Originally Posted by Carboneer View Post
I think what you meant to say was:

"I'm not one to say I todoso.... but, I todoso"
Ahh, Ricky.

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Old
02-12-2013, 10:06 AM
  #207
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I don't see the point of trading Cole right now unless it's a "too good to refuse" type offer.
Wouldn't that mean the price is right?

What a silly question. There isn't a single player on the Habs I wouldn't trade if the price was right. Because the price would be right. Why wouldn't you take an offer that's smart?

"Hey Montreal, this is Garth Snow. We see you got Erik Cole. We'll give you John Tavares."

"Hmmm, the price seems right but nope we're keeping Erik Cole."


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02-12-2013, 10:19 AM
  #208
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Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
Wouldn't that mean the price is right?

What a silly question. There isn't a single player on the Habs I wouldn't trade if the price was right. Because the price would be right. Why wouldn't you take an offer that's smart?

"Hey Montreal, this is Garth Snow. We see you got Erik Cole. We'll give you John Tavares."

"Hmmm, the price seems right but nope we're keeping Erik Cole."

Too funny, I was going to post the exact same thing earlier. You always make the trade if the price is right........if you wouldn't make the trade then the price wasn't right.

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Old
02-12-2013, 10:30 AM
  #209
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He has a NTC

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Old
02-12-2013, 10:31 AM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Too funny, I was going to post the exact same thing earlier. You always make the trade if the price is right........if you wouldn't make the trade then the price wasn't right.
In general, it totally makes sense.
But under some special circumstances, a trade may be made even the price is not right, eg. Roy, Grabovski, Sergei, Ribeiro, Chelios, etc.

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Old
02-12-2013, 10:33 AM
  #211
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Originally Posted by zzoo View Post
In general, it totally makes sense.
But under some special circumstances, a trade may be made even the price is not right, eg. Roy, Grabovski, Sergei, Ribeiro, Chelios, etc.
And you avoid that situation at all cost.

Truth is, there are players better than Subban on the ice I wouldn't trade for him because I love his personality but if Chicago is telling me they'll take Kaberle off our hands along with Subban and give Keith and Toews in return, I'll just learn to miss him.

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Old
02-12-2013, 10:33 AM
  #212
Estimated_Prophet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
The most important piece of the attracting free agents puzzle is being able to offer the most money. That is why Cammalleri, Gionta, Spacek, Moen, Prust, and Cole came here.

Get rid of Cole and our cap space goes up, we can then offer money to someone else and they'll come here.
I don't think you understood what I was saying. We grossly overpaid in terms of both money and term in most of those deals. The more desireable a team can make themselves to free agents, the less they have to pay for their services.

Name the last time this team actually signed an elite free agent.............it has never happened despite us offering more money.

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02-12-2013, 10:33 AM
  #213
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Part of asset management is treating the free agents that you sign with class and respect. Cole delivered more than they could have hoped for last season. If he doesn't ask to be moved then Gauthier doesn't shop him.....end of story

This isn't NHL 13........there are real people involved. If you want to make this a remotely attractive destination for future FA's then you don't **** over the ones that you have actually managed to sign. It is a more pallatable option at this point due to Cole's lackluster play but it is still something that would need to be approached the right way with Cole's co-operation.
Maybe just maybe ask cole if he wanted to stay or not, it's pretty obvious when he signed here he though he was joining a team that was going to push for a Stanley cup run not rebuilding, I don't think cole would have been too upset getting traded to a cup contender.

To add to the fact that he has a ntc so he can decide whether or not he wants to leave is up to him, in my opinion given the opportunity to win another cup he would take it.

So don't come at me with respect our FA spiel, I've heard this before but obviously cole wouldn't have cared that much since he considered retirement after 1 year with the club.

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Old
02-12-2013, 10:34 AM
  #214
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Id move him anyday of the week lol.

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Old
02-12-2013, 10:35 AM
  #215
Estimated_Prophet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zzoo View Post
In general, it totally makes sense.
But under some special circumstances, a trade may be made even the price is not right, eg. Roy, Grabovski, Sergei, Ribeiro, Chelios, etc.
It doesn't matter what the general consensus is. It only matters that the GM believes the price is right, which was the case in each of the trades that you mentioned.

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02-12-2013, 10:37 AM
  #216
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
I don't think you understood what I was saying. We grossly overpaid in terms of both money and term in most of those deals. The more desireable a team can make themselves to free agents, the less they have to pay for their services.

Name the last time this team actually signed an elite free agent.............it has never happened despite us offering more money.
Hey now....we signed a UFA #1 C capable of scoring 60+ pts for less than 1million $

other than DD, not many.

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02-12-2013, 10:39 AM
  #217
Estimated_Prophet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aceekay View Post
Maybe just maybe ask cole if he wanted to stay or not, it's pretty obvious when he signed here he though he was joining a team that was going to push for a Stanley cup run not rebuilding, I don't think cole would have been too upset getting traded to a cup contender.

To add to the fact that he has a ntc so he can decide whether or not he wants to leave is up to him, in my opinion given the opportunity to win another cup he would take it.

So don't come at me with respect our FA spiel, I've heard this before but obviously cole wouldn't have cared that much since he considered retirement after 1 year with the club.
Please......

Cole was perfectly happy here to begin the season in September. His retirement whining was directly related to the CBA negotiations. Feel free to apply revisionist opinions

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02-12-2013, 11:53 AM
  #218
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Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
Wouldn't that mean the price is right?

What a silly question. There isn't a single player on the Habs I wouldn't trade if the price was right. Because the price would be right. Why wouldn't you take an offer that's smart?

"Hey Montreal, this is Garth Snow. We see you got Erik Cole. We'll give you John Tavares."

"Hmmm, the price seems right but nope we're keeping Erik Cole."

No it would mean the return is well above his value, overpayment. Like CBJ offering a 1st or Minny offering Granlund.

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Old
02-12-2013, 11:57 AM
  #219
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
I don't think you understood what I was saying. We grossly overpaid in terms of both money and term in most of those deals. The more desireable a team can make themselves to free agents, the less they have to pay for their services.

Name the last time this team actually signed an elite free agent.............it has never happened despite us offering more money.
Hamrlik Cammalleri Gionta Cole

Those guys are elite(top 15-20) in terms of what is usually on the UFA market. If your definition of elite is a perennial all star well those guys rarely if ever reach UFA status. Since the cap was in pace you can name very few...Richards Gaborik Parise Suter and a handful more.

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02-12-2013, 12:23 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Please......

Cole was perfectly happy here to begin the season in September. His retirement whining was directly related to the CBA negotiations. Feel free to apply revisionist opinions
I never said cole wasn't happy playing here but I'm sure given the opportunity to play for a competitive team he would take that, so no I don't see how it would be disrespectful to cole since he would have the final say if he were to be traded.

If he didn't have a NTC and we trade him out of the blue that's a different story.

If trading cole is the best thing for the team moving forward, both management and cole need to understand that.

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Old
02-12-2013, 12:31 PM
  #221
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aceekay View Post
I never said cole wasn't happy playing here but I'm sure given the opportunity to play for a competitive team he would take that, so no I don't see how it would be disrespectful to cole since he would have the final say if he were to be traded.

If he didn't have a NTC and we trade him out of the blue that's a different story.

If trading cole is the best thing for the team moving forward, both management and cole need to understand that.
not as simple as that, Moen asked for a modified NTC depite us finishing 15th, Cole asked for a NTC the previous year despite us not being very good, same for Gionta, Plekanec, Markov...

and you can find examples like that troughout the whole league...


so, thinking that if you offer him to go to a better team pretty much guarantees he'll accept to waive is foolish at best.

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Old
02-12-2013, 01:12 PM
  #222
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I would trade everyone except Price, Plekanec, A Gally, Subban, Eller, and Max Pac if the price was "right". So yes, even though I like Cole, I would trade him for a younger player + draft picks if possible. However, I would wait till near the trade deadline to do so.

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02-12-2013, 01:15 PM
  #223
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Originally Posted by BlackStar View Post
I would trade everyone except Price, Plekanec, A Gally, Subban, Eller, and Max Pac if the price was "right". So yes, even though I like Cole, I would trade him for a younger player + draft picks if possible. However, I would wait till near the trade deadline to do so.
Making a trade just for the sake of a trade is a bad idea.

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Old
02-12-2013, 01:21 PM
  #224
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Making a trade just for the sake of a trade is a bad idea.
I do not disagree, I was speaking hypothetically, if I were to receive a great offer. I would be fine with trading Cole if I'm receiving great offers for him and I were sure that this team would be better short-term and long-term with a young(er) winger plus draft picks in exchange for Cole.

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Old
02-12-2013, 03:58 PM
  #225
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Trading Cole last year is like trading Markov this year or Gionta next year. You got a player nearing 35, having a good year but you know soon his play will start falling off.

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