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Brian Boyle (The "He just plain sucks" Edition)

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Old
02-12-2013, 12:37 PM
  #326
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
Completely different players? With his one point he is on pace for 7 points over an 82 game season. Seems pretty similar to me. Halpern is 36; not exactly pushing 40.
he turns 37 in may, i'd consider that nearer to 40. And my point was, he is the player that he's going to be because he's on the downside of his career. he's not going to develop anymore.

it had nothing to with me arguing age it had to do with where they are in there careers.

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02-12-2013, 12:38 PM
  #327
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Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Halpern is on pace for 0. Maybe we should hold off on extrapolating?
We shouldn't because the comment was Boyle centric. It was "he's a different player now". Maybe he's not.

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02-12-2013, 12:38 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Wait, so now you're complaining because the way the rangers were winning games wasn't EXCITING enough? I don't give a crap if they were playing 99.9% of the games in there defensive zone. If that gets us a cup i'll take it.

Also, that garbage you saw, got us the furthest we've been since winning the cup.

I don't know about others, but i like winning games. I don't care how we win games, as long as we do.
Why do you watch hockey? Not to be entertained? Not only was it not exciting, it was frustrating, it was nerve wrecking. If we somehow won the cup last year that team would possibly beat the weakest cup team in the modern era. Of course they didn't because they got crushed by the Devils and would have been crushed even worse by the Kings. Both teams that didn't get pinned in their zone every shift.

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02-12-2013, 12:39 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
I didn't provide any numbers. But during Nov and Dec of that year he scored half his goals. That's pretty hot considering his production before and since. And what made it so wild is that goalies were having brain farts on a regular basis to allow those goals. I watched the games and remember. I'm going to look up the dates of those 18 goals from Oct - Jan. If I remember correctly he went cold in the first half of January.
So now its not a hot 2 months its a hot 3 months with possibly hot four months.

Real solid argument you're posing.

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02-12-2013, 12:39 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
he turns 37 in may, i'd consider that nearer to 40. And my point was, he is the player that he's going to be because he's on the downside of his career. he's not going to develop anymore.

it had nothing to with me arguing age it had to do with where they are in there careers.
So watching the two men play you have concluded that Brian Boyle is the better hockey player for this year and next? Good for you. I disagree.

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02-12-2013, 12:41 PM
  #331
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
Because it was him and players like him that was the reason we were pinned in our zone all game every game. He was our high and might shutdown center. Meanwhile the only thing he could do was block shots.
Seems to me that an inconsistent top 6 forwards performance (and apparently one that wasnt exciting enough for your tastes) is your real beef here. I can assure you that eliminating bottom 6 defensive forwards like Brian Boyle isnt going to allow you to find whatever it is you're looking for.

I also think that complaining about how a team won games on its way to the conference finals is incredibly selfish and ignorant. But thats a different discussion.

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02-12-2013, 12:41 PM
  #332
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
So now its not a hot 2 months its a hot 3 months with possibly hot four months.

Real solid argument you're posing.
As I said I will look at the dates. Don't get too full of your self since you didn't even know what year this took place.

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02-12-2013, 12:43 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
Why do you watch hockey? Not to be entertained? Not only was it not exciting, it was frustrating, it was nerve wrecking. If we somehow won the cup last year that team would possibly beat the weakest cup team in the modern era. Of course they didn't because they got crushed by the Devils and would have been crushed even worse by the Kings. Both teams that didn't get pinned in their zone every shift.
I've watched hockey since i was basically born. I went to the Rangers parade in 94 when i was a baby.

I played hockey for a lot of years as well. The difference between you and i is i like nerve-wracking hockey. In fact, blowouts bore me. The few games that the Rangers win 5-1 and lead 5-0 after the second period, those are the games i'm very meh about and get bored in fact. I understand and appreciate defensive hockey and i thoroughly enjoy watching guys give 110% and grind out wins. I loved last years team. And i hope this years team i love even more.

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02-12-2013, 12:43 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
We shouldn't because the comment was Boyle centric. It was "he's a different player now". Maybe he's not.
And my point is, I don't consider 9 games to be an appropriate sample to draw that conclusion.

To suggest that he's the same player he was in 2009-10 flies in the face of evidence and reason, fitting perfectly with the theme of this thread.

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02-12-2013, 12:44 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
As I said I will look at the dates. Don't get too full of your self since you didn't even know what year this took place.
You didn't specify. In fact, i'd argue that he had a shorter hot streak last year than the year before.

He was pretty good for the first 4 months of that 2010-11 season. Until basically right after the all star break, in february was when he dropped off.

Go look at the dates, i already did, and i acutely remember him dropping off significantly after the all star game that year which is why i was mixed up as to what season you were referencing.

I'm also still waiting on my halpern answers. You only brought up the fact that i called him pushing 40. A point that i wasn't looking to argue, but was rather just stating he is at a place in his career where he is the player he is going to be, unlike Boyle in his rookie season. I think that we can both agree on.

So please go check my boyle stats and get me some halpern stats. -31- and i are flooding you with factual arguments and you're just spewing nonsensical and untrue opinions.

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02-12-2013, 12:47 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Seems to me that an inconsistent top 6 forwards performance (and apparently one that wasnt exciting enough for your tastes) is your real beef here. I can assure you that eliminating bottom 6 defensive forwards like Brian Boyle isnt going to allow you to find whatever it is you're looking for.

I also think that complaining about how a team won games on its way to the conference finals is incredibly selfish and ignorant. But thats a different discussion.
The other lines didn't help, but players like Boyle, Fedotenko and (as much as I love him) Prust, getting major minutes was a bi reason this team looked so devoid of talent.

Also, can you explain the "selfish" comment? Who am I being selfish to? I'm sorry that I watch hockey to be entertained and want something better than a team that spends their entire time in their own zone blocking shots. If that's selfish, I apologize. But first I want to know who I'm being selfish to.

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02-12-2013, 12:52 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
The other lines didn't help, but players like Boyle, Fedotenko and (as much as I love him) Prust, getting major minutes was a bi reason this team looked so devoid of talent.

Also, can you explain the "selfish" comment? Who am I being selfish to? I'm sorry that I watch hockey to be entertained and want something better than a team that spends their entire time in their own zone blocking shots. If that's selfish, I apologize. But first I want to know who I'm being selfish to.
Ive been watching this team since the mid-80's, and only have about 3 or 4 truly memorable seasons to hang my hat on. Im not going to discredit a trip to the conference finals because a team didnt play the way I prefer. Winning is what I prefer. And last year's team did that a lot more than they didnt throughout 100+ games.

Its just my personal opinion thats it selfish to not only want a winning team, but want a winning team to play the way that you see fit. Bashing last year's team, which exemplified the heart and soul this organization has been missing for a long, long time, is pretty despicable.

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02-12-2013, 12:53 PM
  #338
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
The other lines didn't help, but players like Boyle, Fedotenko and (as much as I love him) Prust, getting major minutes was a bi reason this team looked so devoid of talent.

Also, can you explain the "selfish" comment? Who am I being selfish to? I'm sorry that I watch hockey to be entertained and want something better than a team that spends their entire time in their own zone blocking shots. If that's selfish, I apologize. But first I want to know who I'm being selfish to.
Of course, because that line should not be a 3rd line. It should be a 4th line. But Dubinsky was out. Stepan was hobbling around on one leg. Kreider was a rookie. Gaborik was playing with one arm. Boyle was playing with a concussion. And that is just what we know about!

The team was banged up. There were extenuating circumstances to Boyle, Prust and Fedotenko getting more minutes, quite a few players were not healthy.

He is a good bottom-6 forward. IMO, he should be a wing. His role should be exactly what Pyatt is doing. Retrieve pucks, control the boards, help with face-offs, hit, and block shots.

He is a good defensive player. He uses his reach well and is always "in the way" as Torts puts it.

I get the frustration from last year. The team lacked offense and the offense that was around was either hurt, or too young so they had to lean on their soldiers too much.

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02-12-2013, 12:54 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Ive been watching this team since the mid-80's, and only have about 3 or 4 truly memorable seasons to hang my hat on. Im not going to discredit a trip to the conference finals because a team didnt play the way I prefer. Winning is what I prefer. And last year's team did that a lot more than they didnt throughout 100+ games.

Its just my personal opinion thats it selfish to not only want a winning team, but want a winning team to play the way that you see fit. Bashing last year's team, which exemplified the heart and soul this organization has been missing for a long, long time, is pretty despicable.
Anyone who had to sit through the rangers black years knows that a team like last year that gave 110% every single shift, is something that we have been missing for far to long and was an extremely welcome site.

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02-12-2013, 12:59 PM
  #340
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First of all, I'm loving this thread - thank you all for lots of entertaining debate on an interesting subject.

What I find interesting about all this is that in an ideal world, you're arguing over a non-event. If Miller can maintain his play, you're looking at a fourth line of Powe/Halpern/Boyle/Asham with one of the four as an odd man out/injury replacement/match up call in every game.

Great situation to be in.

If Miller can't keep it up (none of us is hoping for that obviously), then there's no longer an extra forward and - barring any trades - all four play and it's up to Torts to place them where he deems them to be most effective.

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02-12-2013, 01:00 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
I've watched hockey since i was basically born. I went to the Rangers parade in 94 when i was a baby.

I played hockey for a lot of years as well. The difference between you and i is i like nerve-wracking hockey. In fact, blowouts bore me. The few games that the Rangers win 5-1 and lead 5-0 after the second period, those are the games i'm very meh about and get bored in fact. I understand and appreciate defensive hockey and i thoroughly enjoy watching guys give 110% and grind out wins. I loved last years team. And i hope this years team i love even more.
Playing a close game where it's back and forth, good offense, good defense, good goaltending is the good kind of nervewrecking. Playing a close game where you live in your own zone and the only thing you can do is block a ****ing shot and have Henrik make saves and you're nervous because the other team is constantly shooting at your goalie is a bad kind of nervewrecking. Also, sue me if I want to win in blowout fashion once in a while. What cup teams don't? The closest I can think of surprisingly is the Ducks in 07 until the finals (even the finals games were mostly close). For the most part cup teams are good enough to blow out other good teams. Finally, do you really think teams being pinned in their own zone and blocking shots is GOOD defense? Really what cup champions have done that? That's not good defense, that's good shot blocking. The point is to GTFO of your own zone.

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02-12-2013, 01:07 PM
  #342
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
Playing a close game where it's back and forth, good offense, good defense, good goaltending is the good kind of nervewrecking. Playing a close game where you live in your own zone and the only thing you can do is block a ****ing shot and have Henrik make saves and you're nervous because the other team is constantly shooting at your goalie is a bad kind of nervewrecking. Also, sue me if I want to win in blowout fashion once in a while. What cup teams don't? The closest I can think of surprisingly is the Ducks in 07 until the finals (even the finals games were mostly close). For the most part cup teams are good enough to blow out other good teams. Finally, do you really think teams being pinned in their own zone and blocking shots is GOOD defense? Really what cup champions have done that? That's not good defense, that's good shot blocking. The point is to GTFO of your own zone.
Shot Blocking is a newer trend in the NHL. If the Rangers shot block there way to the cup, you won't see me complaining.

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02-12-2013, 01:13 PM
  #343
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Ive been watching this team since the mid-80's, and only have about 3 or 4 truly memorable seasons to hang my hat on. Im not going to discredit a trip to the conference finals because a team didnt play the way I prefer. Winning is what I prefer. And last year's team did that a lot more than they didnt throughout 100+ games.

Its just my personal opinion thats it selfish to not only want a winning team, but want a winning team to play the way that you see fit. Bashing last year's team, which exemplified the heart and soul this organization has been missing for a long, long time, is pretty despicable.
You're taking yourself too seriously if you're using words such as "selfish" and "despicable" to describe a person's preference in his hockey team.

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02-12-2013, 01:18 PM
  #344
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Anyone who had to sit through the rangers black years knows that a team like last year that gave 110% every single shift, is something that we have been missing for far to long and was an extremely welcome site.
Hey, I caught half of the dark ages. Started watching in 00-01. That season we allowed either the most or the second most goals in the NHL, I think. We had ZERO shutouts. I appreciated the fact that we were one of the best defensive teams in the NHL last year. Hanks had a vezina season. Hank had 8 shutouts and Biron had 2. I remember when the concept of defense was foreign to the team. Yes, I appreciate it. However, I have not seen one great team win it all in all of my sports watching years. Even the Giants had a combined 19-13 record in the two championships they won. I want a team that wins because they have the most talent in the league. I also want to be entertained. What I watched last year was not entertaining. Why should fans in Detroit and Chicago be the only ones that get to watch exciting hockey? I think Rangers fans deserve skilled teams too.

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02-12-2013, 01:19 PM
  #345
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Shot Blocking is a newer trend in the NHL. If the Rangers shot block there way to the cup, you won't see me complaining.
The top shot blocking teams in the NHL minus the Rangers sucked. Teams block shots because they're not talented enough to control the puck. You can't block shots if you have the puck.

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02-12-2013, 01:20 PM
  #346
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
You're taking yourself too seriously if you're using words such as "selfish" and "despicable" to describe a person's preference in his hockey team.
Reading comprehension brother. He was using despicable to describe the way the team was run basically prior to the lockout and how we haven't had hard-working teams like the one we did last year for too long.

And selfish was being used in a subjective manner and I kind of agree with him. I'm such a diehard fan and was too young to really remember the 94' cup win. I want to the Rangers to win more than anything. If they do it by blowing out the other team or they do it by playing 99.9% of the game in there own zone, I couldn't care less. Winning is winning.

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02-12-2013, 01:25 PM
  #347
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Originally Posted by 16 To Stanley View Post
Reading comprehension brother. He was using despicable to describe the way the team was run basically prior to the lockout and how we haven't had hard-working teams like the one we did last year for too long.

And selfish was being used in a subjective manner and I kind of agree with him. I'm such a diehard fan and was too young to really remember the 94' cup win. I want to the Rangers to win more than anything. If they do it by blowing out the other team or they do it by playing 99.9% of the game in there own zone, I couldn't care less. Winning is winning.
Read it again, he clearly said "bashing the team when...is despicable".

It's not selfish, because that implies I'm being selfish towards somebody as if I'm preventing you two from enjoying the way the team played last year. BTW, I appreciate the fact that you fall in the vast minority of people that use the saying "couldn't care less" correctly. I nearly have a stroke whenever I see "could care less".

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02-12-2013, 01:26 PM
  #348
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Shot Blocking is a newer trend in the NHL. If the Rangers shot block there way to the cup, you won't see me complaining.
shot blocking has been around forever.

It hasn't been a team wide commitment like the Rangers have made it, but it's been around forever.

Also, the Rangers seem to be making it part of their defensive scheme where it used to be a mistake covering maneuver.

either way, I have no problems with it.

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02-12-2013, 01:28 PM
  #349
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
Read it again, he clearly said "bashing the team when...is despicable".

It's not selfish, because that implies I'm being selfish towards somebody as if I'm preventing you two from enjoying the way the team played last year. BTW, I appreciate the fact that you fall in the vast minority of people that use the saying "couldn't care less" correctly. I nearly have a stroke whenever I see "could care less".
reading comprehension....for me...lol it's been too long a week already

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02-12-2013, 01:28 PM
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shot blocking has been around forever.

It hasn't been a team wide commitment like the Rangers have made it, but it's been around forever.

Also, the Rangers seem to be making it part of their defensive scheme where it used to be a mistake covering maneuver.

either way, I have no problems with it.
Shot blocking obviously has been around forever. I was clearly referring to it as a gameplan. Didn't think i had to spell that out.

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