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All Encompassing Tanking/Rebuilding/Selling at Deadline Thread 2.0

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Old
02-12-2013, 05:54 PM
  #751
Whitesnake
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Boston is going to be scary.
Their first test will come with Chara's retirement. So Boston will need to build a stronger D to compensate. But the core for years will be great. And Chiarelli keeps proving he can fill the rest out. And Julien still proove what I keep saying all those years, to even Bruins fans who wanted him out the year of the cup...this guy is a great coach.
And you can add that while their head scout and scouts aren't better than ours...they did do a very good job building this team as well.

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02-12-2013, 05:56 PM
  #752
ECWHSWI
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
That works too.

Boston is going to be scary.
and yet they always tried to make the P.O... guess they're a failure by the "tanking" standards...

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Old
02-12-2013, 05:57 PM
  #753
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
considering you're the guy thinking Perry would jump on the chance to sign with us, that another tank year should help us win a cup within the next two or three years, etc.

You sure know a lot about fantasies.
edit

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02-12-2013, 05:58 PM
  #754
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Oh so Franzen isn't going to the HOF for his 50 points but Subban is going to win the Norris and get into the HOF no problem right?

Ya we outdrafted the wings if we cut out their best years, amazing deduction. It also goes to show how hard it is to draft good prospects from later on which basically shoots your whole "anti-tank" plan to ****.

Once again you make a better case FOR tanking than against it.
How did I "cut out" anything. Going back 14 years to the last big star a team picked is making a pretty clear point.

I can point to all the superstars the Habs developped in the 50's 60's and 70's but it has no impact on current drafting/developping.

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Old
02-12-2013, 05:59 PM
  #755
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
and yet they always tried to make the P.O... guess they're a failure by the "tanking" standards...
but "tanking" has worked for the isles,panthers, oilers,bluejackets,avalanche and philly .

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Old
02-12-2013, 06:01 PM
  #756
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Their first test will come with Chara's retirement. So Boston will need to build a stronger D to compensate. But the core for years will be great. And Chiarelli keeps proving he can fill the rest out. And Julien still proove what I keep saying all those years, to even Bruins fans who wanted him out the year of the cup...this guy is a great coach.

And you can add that while their head scout and scouts aren't better than ours...they did do a very good job building this team as well.
That stronger D is on its way with Dougie Hamilton. He, Seguin and Rask are going to be awesome for that team. Can't believe the Leafs basically gave them a contending core.

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Old
02-12-2013, 06:03 PM
  #757
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
considering you're the guy thinking Perry would jump on the chance to sign with us, that another tank year should help us within the next two or three years, etc.

You sure know a lot about fantasies.
If we want near-future UFAs like Perry, Ryan, Getzlaf, Malkin, Vanek, Semin, etc. we will need to do what Boston did when they signed Chara:

They cleared cap space by offloading veterans like Joe Thornton, and then offered the most money to Chara.


Last edited by DAChampion: 02-12-2013 at 06:43 PM.
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Old
02-12-2013, 06:05 PM
  #758
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Well, with things being the way they are, making the playoffs should always be first objective.

No point trying to run if you can't walk.
what happened to the days when it was stanley cup or bust? that is the end dream i have...that someday this team will again be the best team in the league year in and year out. if tanking can make this happen im willing to see that.

i think though that it will take more than high draft picks. there has to be the right personell involved with scouting and player development. if the right people are in those spots, i think that the draft spot is less important.

i dont know why montreal dont try persuading (with money) the best of the scouts and development personell. there isnt a salary cap for these people as far as i know.

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02-12-2013, 06:08 PM
  #759
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but "tanking" has worked for the isles,panthers, oilers,bluejackets,avalanche and philly .
The Islanders are a great example of how rebuilding works actually. The Islanders gave away picks and prospects that turned into Luongo, McCabe, Spezza, Chara, Bertuzzi and more... basically a cup contending team. The Leafs did the same trading away picks and prospects that turned into Luongo (again), Niedermayer, Rask, Seguin, Hamilton and Couture. Florida was absolutely stupidly run. They gave away Horton and... Luongo (AGAIN) for a bag of pucks.

The Oilers are a bunch of 18 year old kids who've tanked while we've finished 8th. Not sure what you think we've gained here that they didn't. Their future is bright. Philly have been contenders most of the time so I'm not sure why you're including them.

The club that really failed was Columbus. But even they managed to pick up a Richard trophy winner. We haven't had one since Lafleur.

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02-12-2013, 06:08 PM
  #760
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
and yet they always tried to make the P.O... guess they're a failure by the "tanking" standards...
Boston had two tank picks. They drafted phil kessel who turned into seguin+hanilton the year thry traded veteran joe thornton away.

They also traded raycroft for rask.

Seguin was a nice piece in their cup run. He hamilton amd rask will be a nice piece of any future cup run.

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02-12-2013, 06:09 PM
  #761
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
If we want near-future UFAs like Perry, Ryan, Getzlaf, Malkin, Vanek, Semin, etc. we will need to do what Boston did when they signed Chara:

They cleared cap space by offloading veterans like Joe Thornton, and then offered the most money to Chara.
Having a contending team would help too.

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Old
02-12-2013, 06:12 PM
  #762
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Originally Posted by Raider917 View Post
what happened to the days when it was stanley cup or bust? that is the end dream i have...that someday this team will again be the best team in the league year in and year out. if tanking can make this happen im willing to see that.

i think though that it will take more than high draft picks. there has to be the right personell involved with scouting and player development. if the right people are in those spots, i think that the draft spot is less important.

i dont know why montreal dont try persuading (with money) the best of the scouts and development personell. there isnt a salary cap for these people as far as i know.
That's what I'd like to see too. We have to stop looking at things season by season and just take a long term view on what kind of team we want to have over the next 5 to 10 yeras. I really think that we've got the core of a great team for the future already started but I think we need more top end talent to make sure of it.

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Old
02-12-2013, 06:23 PM
  #763
ECWHSWI
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
If we want near-future UFAs like Perry, Ryan, Getzlaf, Malkin, Vanek, Semin, etc. we will need to do what Boston did when they signed Chara:

They cleared cap space by offloading veterans like Joe Thornton, and then offered the most money to Chara.
that would mean NO tanking by the way...

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Old
02-12-2013, 06:24 PM
  #764
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Boston had two tank picks. They drafted phil kessel who turned into seguin+hanilton the year thry traded veteran joe thornton away.

They also traded raycroft for rask.

Seguin was a nice piece in their cup run. He hamilton amd rask will be a nice piece of any future cup run.
wrong, they never tried to tank.

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02-12-2013, 06:43 PM
  #765
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
and yet they always tried to make the P.O... guess they're a failure by the "tanking" standards...
Boston had two tank picks. They drafted phil kessel who turned into seguin+hanilton the year thry traded veteran joe thornton away.

They also traded raycroft for rask.

Seguin was a nice piece in their cup run. He hamilton amd rask will be a nice piece of any future cup run.

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Old
02-12-2013, 06:47 PM
  #766
ECWHSWI
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Boston had two tank picks. They drafted phil kessel who turned into seguin+hanilton the year thry traded veteran joe thornton away.

They also traded raycroft for rask.

Seguin was a nice piece in their cup run. He hamilton amd rask will be a nice piece of any future cup run.
wrong.

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Old
02-12-2013, 08:13 PM
  #767
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
wrong.
Boston drafted 5th overall after they traded veteran Joe Thornton, and then used the savings to sign Zdeno Chara.

Great tanking+rebuilding.

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02-12-2013, 08:24 PM
  #768
ECWHSWI
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Boston drafted 5th overall after they traded veteran Joe Thornton, and then used the savings to sign Zdeno Chara.

Great tanking+rebuilding.
wrong.

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Old
02-12-2013, 08:35 PM
  #769
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Columbus has 3 1st and could have 2 top ten picks this year with the way the Kings are struggling. I wonder if we were to move up in the draft this year if thats a team that could be targeted.

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Old
02-12-2013, 09:35 PM
  #770
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
wrong.
How is that wrong?

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Old
02-12-2013, 09:38 PM
  #771
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Boston drafted 5th overall after they traded veteran Joe Thornton, and then used the savings to sign Zdeno Chara.

Great tanking+rebuilding.
Winning the cup and gettting two top picks was a neat pick too. A Sam Pollochian move...

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Old
02-12-2013, 09:41 PM
  #772
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Winning the cup and gettting two top picks was a neat pick too. A Sam Pollochian move...
Almost puked at the thought of the Bruins having anything in common with the great Sam.

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Old
02-12-2013, 09:45 PM
  #773
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How did I "cut out" anything. Going back 14 years to the last big star a team picked is making a pretty clear point.

I can point to all the superstars the Habs developped in the 50's 60's and 70's but it has no impact on current drafting/developping.
You are saying "look at Detroit, amazing team that didn't tank AND we outdrafted them!" when in reality their greatness came from a select few years you are excluding.

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Old
02-12-2013, 09:54 PM
  #774
ECWHSWI
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Originally Posted by Pine View Post
How is that wrong?
traded a 1st overall, got a 5th the following year

younger player in the trade was Joe Thornton, other pieces were scraps, no picks, no prospects...

so, it's definitely not a tank, therefore not a tank pick.



only a blind couldnt see this one.

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Old
02-12-2013, 09:56 PM
  #775
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by Coldplay View Post
Almost puked at the thought of the Bruins having anything in common with the great Sam.
Polloch traded for picks even when we were winning. He understood the value of picks before others did. If Doug Wickenheiser had panned out we would've been a powerhouse in the 80s and 90s and won more than just the two cups.

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