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Monday Night Raw Discussion Thread #39

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02-13-2013, 10:51 AM
  #301
Dont Hinder Jinder
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Personally I enjoyed Jack Swagger's / Zebs promo, although it's not the most original storyline the WWE has produced, it's something that's different.

The WWE has been stuck in a perpetual cycle of political correct-ness and PG rating nonsense, this is the first (of hopefully many) steps towards pushing the envelope to a more edgy product.

The racism storyline is a touchy subject for many, and it can either be very successful or very detrimental to a career (see: Muhammed Hassan, Nikolai Volkoff, Iron Shiek) although the times have changed and rascim is less tolerated nowadays I think this is a step in the right direction as the WWE looks to revamp it's programming. Very curious to see where this goes.

P.S: I am one of those faces Zeb doesn't recognize LOL

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02-13-2013, 10:57 AM
  #302
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I also enjoyed Swagger's new gimmick. Interested to see where they take it. Maybe start going after tag teams like the Usos and Primo & Epico, just to give him that chance of going after two guys at once and looking strong - all in the meanwhile, maintaining that new mentality of his.

As for the final segement with Rock and Punk... this is the last Raw before EC and Rock is out there telling a story about buying a car from a crackhead. The only thing more painful than that is hearing Cole and Lawler snort and giggle like a bunch of idiots. Amazing though how with just one friggin' line, Punk obliterated everything Rock did.

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02-13-2013, 10:59 AM
  #303
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I was a fan of Jack Swagger before it was cool to like Jack Swagger (back in his WWECW) days.

I've always thought the potential was there in terms of his in ring work, to be one of main event guys. It's a shame they never really did anything with him and he never got over with the crowd. Hopefully this changes now.

I'll put it this way, I'll take Jack Swagger over the Miz any day of the week, but that's just my opinion.

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02-13-2013, 11:14 AM
  #304
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at what point did the Rock become Grandpa Simpson? Because that's what that promo felt like.

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02-13-2013, 11:26 AM
  #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfan18 View Post
I was a fan of Jack Swagger before it was cool to like Jack Swagger (back in his WWECW) days.

I've always thought the potential was there in terms of his in ring work, to be one of main event guys. It's a shame they never really did anything with him and he never got over with the crowd. Hopefully this changes now.

I'll put it this way, I'll take Jack Swagger over the Miz any day of the week, but that's just my opinion.
CPrice had the perfect way to change his character and bring him back as a face basically to take on Cesaro as the one American who can. It would have been PERFECT. It writes itself. You could have even brought the eagle back for the kids.

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02-13-2013, 11:59 AM
  #306
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Bring back the Eagle belt in general. Anything but that current WWE Championship. Ugh.

Bringing back the old IC title was great.

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02-13-2013, 02:41 PM
  #307
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I still don't like Swagger and don't see anything special in him, but it's an interesting angle that I'm into.

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02-13-2013, 05:22 PM
  #308
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The Rock's story was boring as hell

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02-13-2013, 06:22 PM
  #309
Dean Ambrose
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Quote:
- A WWE source notes that while many fans have complained at the idea of having John Cena vs. The Rock II at WrestleMania 29 this year and have suggested other opponents for Cena and Rock, no match is going to make the company more money and sell more pay-per-views than Rock-Cena II. Because of this, many people within WWE would be very surprised if Cena-Rock II didn't happen this year.
Source: lordsofpain

Rematches back-to-back years don't usually draw well. Most recently, Taker-HBK II at WM26 didn't draw so well compared to previously. Taker-HHH last year was a rematch under a fresh Rock/Cena program, so I don't know how much WM29 will draw in terms of buys, but with the second top match most likely featuring ANOTHER rematch, I don't see Wrestlemania 29 doing as well in PPV buys compared to WM28.

And off the top of my head, Brock-Rock would do MORE buys than Cena-Rock IMO, Rock-Taker would, Cena-Taker and probably Brock-Taker too. I have a feeling at least ONE of those matches are being saved for WM30 though.

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02-13-2013, 06:30 PM
  #310
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Rock-Taker has to be the biggest sell this year. That is just beyond huge. But hey.. what do I know? I'm just a consumer.

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02-13-2013, 07:11 PM
  #311
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Originally Posted by ColePens View Post
Rock-Taker has to be the biggest sell this year. That is just beyond huge. But hey.. what do I know? I'm just a consumer.
And to that, WWE Creative says...


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02-13-2013, 07:55 PM
  #312
chuckdobbins
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Rock-Taker has to be the biggest sell this year. That is just beyond huge. But hey.. what do I know? I'm just a consumer.
This is by far the match that I was hoping for the most, but I highly doubt it's happening.

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02-13-2013, 09:45 PM
  #313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince McMahon View Post
Source: lordsofpain

Rematches back-to-back years don't usually draw well. Most recently, Taker-HBK II at WM26 didn't draw so well compared to previously. Taker-HHH last year was a rematch under a fresh Rock/Cena program, so I don't know how much WM29 will draw in terms of buys, but with the second top match most likely featuring ANOTHER rematch, I don't see Wrestlemania 29 doing as well in PPV buys compared to WM28.

And off the top of my head, Brock-Rock would do MORE buys than Cena-Rock IMO, Rock-Taker would, Cena-Taker and probably Brock-Taker too. I have a feeling at least ONE of those matches are being saved for WM30 though.
Not to mention that a large number of fans would be ones that KNOW that Cena would win, i.e. they're smart enough to realize that The Rock "owes" this to Cena.

I for one, will not purchase WrestleMania if I'm going to have Rock/Cena II forced down my throat. It wasn't that great the first time, and a second, with the mystery of who would win being removed, I have absolutely no interest in it.

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02-13-2013, 09:50 PM
  #314
Dean Ambrose
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I usually always order WM, but if CM Punk isn't in the WWE title match, I'll either stream it or go somewhere else to watch it, like my cousins. I'm not paying my own money to watch rematchmania.

WWE is stupid. The crowd isn't gonna put up with ******** and Rock/Cena II and Lesnar/HHH II as the top two matches is BS. The fans will probably **** all over it.

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02-13-2013, 11:29 PM
  #315
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Originally Posted by ColePens View Post
Rock-Taker has to be the biggest sell this year. That is just beyond huge. But hey.. what do I know? I'm just a consumer.
You mean Lesnar-Undertaker.

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02-13-2013, 11:34 PM
  #316
Dean Ambrose
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More like Lesnar-Rock

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02-13-2013, 11:49 PM
  #317
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I would argue that there is no way Lesnar/Rock or Lesnar/Taker is bigger than Rock/Taker. I just don't. Rock vs. Taker is Wrestlemania written all over. You are talking the Streak vs. a guy who beat Cena last year AND ended the 400+ day title reign of CM Punk.

I mean... it just doesn't get bigger than that. Rock/Brock doesn't capture it for me because it's two part-timers coming back for a payoff. Meeeeeeh. I'd rather have Brock/Taker because that had real life drama in it.

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02-13-2013, 11:57 PM
  #318
Dean Ambrose
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Yes, but from the casual fan point of view, Rock/Lesnar are two mega stars who saw success in other places outside of wrestling. Rock brings in a whole different viewership and Lesnar brings back the hardcore fans who have, over time, gone from WWE to UFC.

Rock/Brock would do better PPV business, but Rock/Taker would be right up there too. I can see Rock/Taker happening only if Rock/Brock doesn't happen at SummerSlam.

Cena-Taker is the biggest match WWE can do that features two WWE talents who rose and saw their success in WWE and didn't go anywhere else.

All four matches scream MONEY so it baffles me why we're seeing two rematches at WM this year. Last year WM saw 1.3M buys. This year, I'd predict 1 - 1.2M buys depending on other celebrity appearances and the undercard

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02-14-2013, 02:05 AM
  #319
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Originally Posted by ColePens View Post
I would argue that there is no way Lesnar/Rock or Lesnar/Taker is bigger than Rock/Taker. I just don't. Rock vs. Taker is Wrestlemania written all over. You are talking the Streak vs. a guy who beat Cena last year AND ended the 400+ day title reign of CM Punk.

I mean... it just doesn't get bigger than that. Rock/Brock doesn't capture it for me because it's two part-timers coming back for a payoff. Meeeeeeh. I'd rather have Brock/Taker because that had real life drama in it.
I don't which match/feud would be better between Rock/Brock and Rock/Taker, but The Rock and Brock Lesnar are WWE's two biggest PPV draws right now, so that would definitely be the bigger seller.

Whoever Lesnar faces at Wrestlemania, I hope he wins. Especially since they have him for another 2 years. For me, he has been the most entertaining person in WWE since he returned.

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02-14-2013, 03:51 AM
  #320
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Look who was at NXT.


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02-14-2013, 07:58 AM
  #321
chuckdobbins
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Look who was at NXT.

Even better, it looks like he is actually going with the same character. I wonder if his name will still be El Generico, or perhaps "The Generic."

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColePens View Post
I would argue that there is no way Lesnar/Rock or Lesnar/Taker is bigger than Rock/Taker. I just don't. Rock vs. Taker is Wrestlemania written all over. You are talking the Streak vs. a guy who beat Cena last year AND ended the 400+ day title reign of CM Punk.

I mean... it just doesn't get bigger than that. Rock/Brock doesn't capture it for me because it's two part-timers coming back for a payoff. Meeeeeeh. I'd rather have Brock/Taker because that had real life drama in it.
Rock v Taker would be a smarks wet dream. I'd love to see it happen.

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02-14-2013, 02:15 PM
  #322
Dean Ambrose
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Breakdown

Quote:
- Paul Heyman and CM Punk in the opening segment did a good 3.33 quarter.

- Mark Henry vs. The Great Khali gained 831,000 viewers.

- Chris Jericho vs. Daniel Bryan gained 84,000 viewers.

- 3MB vs. Cena, Sheamus and Ryback gained 267,000 viewers at 9 PM to a 3.34 quarter.

- Jack Swagger vs. Zack Ryder lost 253,000 viewers.

- Cody Rhodes vs. The Miz lost 19,000 viewers.

- Clay & Tensai vs. Epico & Primo lost 242,000 viewers.

- The Shield promo and brawl with Cena, Sheamus and Ryback at 10 PM gained 392,000 viewers to a 3.25 quarter.

- Alberto Del Rio vs. Damien Sandow lost 419,000 viewers.

- Kofi Kingston vs. Wade Barrett lost 37,000 viewers.

- Kane vs. Dolph Ziggler gained 186,000 viewers.

- The Rock's promo and brawl with CM Punk to close the show gained 578,000 viewers to a 3.48 quarter.
IMO, Rock has become overexposed and his appearances don't feel special anymore. The same thing happened last year. Rock is still the biggest draw in the company, but he's being overused and if he appears every week, it doesn't feel special anymore.

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02-14-2013, 02:33 PM
  #323
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i think people are just disappointed in his promos.
trust me i laugh and gives the live crowd what they wanna hear.... but watching that same thing every week on TV is repetitive and... then punk arrives and verbally destroys him which makes him look even worse.

If theres one thing im looking forward to his match with Cena is that at least their promos last year looked that they had legit heat with one and other and was less childish than the begining. (sorta like Punk is doing... just that The Rock should stop answering with funny crap).

anyways, he still the best draw and he should keep the belt, but he needs to be a little more serious. i dont mind a rock concert or his many catch-phrases, but twitter and crack stories arent attracting to many people.

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02-14-2013, 03:30 PM
  #324
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Its a pretty sweet time to be a wrestling fan. Rock, Jericho, Punk, and lesnar are all here for the time being as top end guys and I'm going to savor it while it lasts. It creates trickle down effect and the roster all of sudden looks pretty damn deep.

I'm also pumped that Henry came back as the same monster heel he was before he left. Its too bad that they didn't utilize this guy properly until the end of his career, but I love watching him in beast mode.

I'm also interested in swagger now... well, not so much swagger, but rather his manager. It should be interesting how that angle develops and how far wwe is willing to push it... they've already pushed further than I expected, and I had to consider for a second whether I was living in 2013 or 1999.

They got enough things happening right now to keep my interest for 3 hours every monday. Enjoy it while it lasts.

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02-14-2013, 07:04 PM
  #325
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Its a pretty sweet time to be a wrestling fan. Rock, Jericho, Punk, and lesnar are all here for the time being as top end guys and I'm going to savor it while it lasts. It creates trickle down effect and the roster all of sudden looks pretty damn deep.

I'm also pumped that Henry came back as the same monster heel he was before he left. Its too bad that they didn't utilize this guy properly until the end of his career, but I love watching him in beast mode.

I'm also interested in swagger now... well, not so much swagger, but rather his manager. It should be interesting how that angle develops and how far wwe is willing to push it... they've already pushed further than I expected, and I had to consider for a second whether I was living in 2013 or 1999.

They got enough things happening right now to keep my interest for 3 hours every monday. Enjoy it while it lasts.
Definitely.

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