I would personally wait until after the season to evaluate players, coaches, etc... to see if their going to be a part of our future moving forward, because I don't think it would be a smart idea to fire Lavi in the middle of the season especially in a shorten season and besides there's not too many options out there right now unless you want Terry Murray, Craig Berube, etc... in which I don't want any of them coaching the Flyers.
At this point, I wouldn't be opposed to firing him. The team has not looked good. I know there are injuries, but at the end of the day, sometimes what a team needs is a shakeup. I like Laviolette and think he is a good coach, but it may be time.
isnt just possible that homer is much to blame as a coach, i mean where does it say the homer is greatest gm? i mean look at the devils, they were losing players and they still played well and there's no excuses because they have a good farm system.
if this team is losing players and this team is not playing well then it's on the gm because he's drafting lousy players in the farm system, why do you think the phantoms are so bad?
i think it's time for a change in direction with the gm and coach and build this team the right way, if you want to believe the opposite then this team going to worse for years to come, you dont want to hear it but that's where this team is going.
isnt just possible that homer is much to blame as a coach, i mean where does it say the homer is greatest gm? i mean look at the devils, they were losing players and they still played well and there's no excuses because they have a good farm system.
if this team is losing players and this team is not playing well then it's on the gm because he's drafting lousy players in the farm system, why do you think the phantoms are so bad?
i think it's time for a change in direction with the gm and coach and build this team the right way, if you want to believe the opposite then this team going to worse for years to come, you dont want to hear it but that's where this team is going.
Or New Jersey has such a great system that they can plug any players in and not miss a beat. They went from bottom 5 team in the league to Stanley cup finals in 1 season with essentially the same roster except a new coach.
As to the Flyers getting worse and worse: this is a team of 25 years olds and under. Players don't hit their prime until mid to late 20's. So really only Giroux, Read, and Hartnell won't be significantly improving. Defensemen don't hit their prime til even later. I don't get how so many people who were high on this roster last year think its crap now.
The overrating continues. Sure he was a catalyst but let's not go too far. Everybody picked it up once Sutter came in there in the second half and saved them from Vanilla Murray's stifling ways...
Having said this...Sutter is another short shelf lifer....but at least he got them a cup.
Of course if the Kings didnt win and some Kings pointed the finger at Carter then you would be in agreement right? because that was so easy to do when he was here. He got so much undeserved hate around here it wasnt funny.
Was Carter the savior in LA? probably not but he made that team better. He also scored the winner in a critical Cup Final game in OT.
Quote:
Originally Posted by orange is better
I thought we should have fired him last summer and hired Michel therein.
Why? Whats makes him a better option then Laviolette? He wasnt exactly liked when he was in Pittsburgh.
isnt just possible that homer is much to blame as a coach, i mean where does it say the homer is greatest gm? i mean look at the devils, they were losing players and they still played well and there's no excuses because they have a good farm system.
if this team is losing players and this team is not playing well then it's on the gm because he's drafting lousy players in the farm system, why do you think the phantoms are so bad?
i think it's time for a change in direction with the gm and coach and build this team the right way, if you want to believe the opposite then this team going to worse for years to come, you dont want to hear it but that's where this team is going.
I agree they both should be gone before this years draft..
Or New Jersey has such a great system that they can plug any players in and not miss a beat. They went from bottom 5 team in the league to Stanley cup finals in 1 season with essentially the same roster except a new coach.
As to the Flyers getting worse and worse: this is a team of 25 years olds and under. Players don't hit their prime until mid to late 20's. So really only Giroux, Read, and Hartnell won't be significantly improving. Defensemen don't hit their prime til even later. I don't get how so many people who were high on this roster last year think its crap now.
new jersey has a great system that has sizeable forwards/defensemen and skill that fit it, the flyers dont have that, the only reason they were good last year is because they werent on the top lines, they go on the top lines this year and they are getting outmatched and they cant score, they were better on the third and fourth lines.
new jersey has a great system that has sizeable forwards/defensemen and skill that fit it, the flyers dont have that, the only reason they were good last year is because they werent on the top lines, they go on the top lines this year and they are getting outmatched and they cant score, they were better on the third and fourth lines.
That's the rationale that you're going with huh? The young forwards aren't really playing in an elevated role compared to last year. Couturier is still the shutdown guy, and Schenn is still expected to be a contributor in an offensive role. Jagr was a big hit, but stop acting like the offense was gutted in the offseason. JVR shouldn't be considered in the argument because he never got a chance to be a big time contributor last season. Our offense is struggling because Giroux has under-performed and the powerplay sucks. That's about it.
That's the rationale that you're going with huh? The young forwards aren't really playing in an elevated role compared to last year. Couturier is still the shutdown guy, and Schenn is still expected to be a contributor in an offensive role. Jagr was a big hit, but stop acting like the offense was gutted in the offseason. JVR shouldn't be considered in the argument because he never got a chance to be a big time contributor last season. Our offense is struggling because Giroux has under-performed and the powerplay sucks. That's about it.
It is, but I was mostly referring to TF83's remark about the young guys and playing in an elevated role. They're not. They're all being asked to do the same things that they did last year. There's more than enough talent on the roster for them to be effective offensively.
(Not going to include Carle because theoretically we replaced him with a top 4 defenseman in Schenn.)
Still, that's a lot of man-games to lose among your top players over a 15 game season. Over an 82 game season it translates to:
Hartnell (66 games missed / 16 games played)
Simmonds/Couturier/Schenn/Briere (55 games missed / 27 games played)
Jagr (82 games missed / 0 games played)
vanRiemsdyk (82 games missed / 0 games played)
Meszaros (82 games missed / 0 games played)
Those are four top 6 forwards and a top 4 defenseman that are playing less than a 1/3rd of the season.
Couple that with the fact that we had almost no preseason/camp to work around that in a shortened season when we're playing a condensed schedule...
There's a reason anything can happen in a half-season. Let's stay calm and just ride it out.
(Not going to include Carle because theoretically we replaced him with a top 4 defenseman in Schenn.)
Still, that's a lot of man-games to lose among your top players over a 15 game season. Over an 82 game season it translates to:
Hartnell (66 games missed / 16 games played)
Simmonds/Couturier/Schenn/Briere (55 games missed / 27 games played)
Jagr (82 games missed / 0 games played)
vanRiemsdyk (82 games missed / 0 games played)
Meszaros (82 games missed / 0 games played)
Those are four top 6 forwards and a top 4 defenseman that are playing less than a 1/3rd of the season.
Couple that with the fact that we had almost no preseason/camp to work around that in a shortened season when we're playing a condensed schedule...
There's a reason anything can happen in a half-season. Let's stay calm and just ride it out.
See, the injury excuse really isnt too effective, since almost every other team in the league are missing top 4 defenders and/or top 6 forwards. These teams though are still able to perform at a better level then the Flyers.
That's the rationale that you're going with huh? The young forwards aren't really playing in an elevated role compared to last year. Couturier is still the shutdown guy, and Schenn is still expected to be a contributor in an offensive role. Jagr was a big hit, but stop acting like the offense was gutted in the offseason. JVR shouldn't be considered in the argument because he never got a chance to be a big time contributor last season. Our offense is struggling because Giroux has under-performed and the powerplay sucks. That's about it.
yeah, im sticking with it and if some of the young fowards have to go to make this team better then that's what has to be done because sticking what's broken, is not going to make this team better, it's a recipe for disaster.
I believe the Flyers orginazation, is very very slow to observe the negative surrounding players and coaching staff, they focus a ton on the positives and the good memories they've had, and they are way too nice in the way of helping ex-players come back to the team, ie Boosh, Knuble, Feds, the list goes on, IMO the need a GM that is all business, if you aren't good for the team you're gone, coaches and players, I would like to see a GM who's not an ex-Flyer also, the organization needs to sit down and figure out what type of hockey they want to play, what brand and style, honestly it should be based around Giroux, Couts, and Schenn, plug the pieces in, find a coach who can actually put a system out on the ice that fits the players who are in it, look at NJ it doesn't matter who they lost they keep playing winning hockey, they plug in players that work in their system, so to answer the question yes I would fire Lavy and Homer in the offseason and reshape this teams future
I thought we should have fired him last summer and hired Michel therein.
The guy that couldn't win a Cup with Crosby, Malkin, Hossa, Gonchar, Fluery, etc? Yeah he's perfect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by toughfighter83
i mean look at the devils, they were losing players and they still played well and there's no excuses because they have a good farm system.
Also helps when you have the greatest goalie in NHL history on your team for 20 years. I'd like to see where they are in the standings after he retires.
Quote:
if this team is losing players and this team is not playing well then it's on the gm because he's drafting lousy players in the farm system, why do you think the phantoms are so bad?
Look at how many rookies started for this team and played well last year. Plus McGinn this year. I don't see how you can say he drafts lousy players. You can't expect every pick to make an impact in the NHL. That's a nice fantasy, but not realistic at all.
Quote:
i think it's time for a change in direction with the gm and coach and build this team the right way, if you want to believe the opposite then this team going to worse for years to come, you dont want to hear it but that's where this team is going.
Ok GM Extraordinaire tell me, what is the right way to build this team?
I don't understand why you're giving up. This is a young team with loads of potential. You need to have patience. Rome wasn't built in a day.
Last edited by FlyersFan8828: 02-16-2013 at 02:42 PM.
Reason: typo
(Not going to include Carle because theoretically we replaced him with a top 4 defenseman in Schenn.)
Still, that's a lot of man-games to lose among your top players over a 15 game season. Over an 82 game season it translates to:
Hartnell (66 games missed / 16 games played)
Simmonds/Couturier/Schenn/Briere (55 games missed / 27 games played)
Jagr (82 games missed / 0 games played)
vanRiemsdyk (82 games missed / 0 games played)
Meszaros (82 games missed / 0 games played)
Those are four top 6 forwards and a top 4 defenseman that are playing less than a 1/3rd of the season.
Couple that with the fact that we had almost no preseason/camp to work around that in a shortened season when we're playing a condensed schedule...
There's a reason anything can happen in a half-season. Let's stay calm and just ride it out.
Exactly. Let's see how this team plays in a regular 82 game schedule before we make any rash decisions.
I dont think anything is wrong with the core of this team. The problem is a good many players had career years last year and they probably overachieved. This year with the combonation of injuries and a "sophmore slump" for some of these kids its a pretty good reason why where they are in the standings.
That said i still think they are a little ways off from being a contender. There are some holes on this team that need fixing.
If you fire Lavy and let Homer pick the next coach, you will have the same issues as you've had before. Fire Homer and let the next GM decide on Lavy's future.
