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Chris Kreider/JT Miller Discussion Thread (2/16: Kreider recalled to NHL)

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Old
02-16-2013, 12:01 PM
  #601
Bleed Ranger Blue
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
No, but if he would be a point per game player since his injuries I'd take that.
Except he isn't. And for you to blame good players for Kreider's overall incompetence is a sad argument. Just like the Torts bashing is a sad argument.

People are looking for every excuse to shield this guy wen the reality is that Kreider needs to play harder. That's on him. No one else.

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02-16-2013, 12:07 PM
  #602
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If the expectations are for Kreider to become Hagelin y'all are going to be waiting for a while.

Speed does not equal motor. That's like hoping Gaborik learns to work the corners from watching Callahan.

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02-16-2013, 12:08 PM
  #603
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Originally Posted by NvincentYvalentineR View Post
IF. If If if if if if if if if. If every time hagelin made a great pass to some one and they scored, hags would have been rookie of the year.

What you are talking about is a circumstance that is not unique to Chris Kreider. You just attempt to make to appear that way (or maybe you really do believe it





to be the truth) either way it shows a complete lack of objectivity.

And with respect to Dorado, Another young player who has blossomed excessively under Torts is Carl Hagelin. Thanks. Point made, Torts does not ruin young talent or discourage them in any way. It is one if his few strengths.
Yes. If everyone cashed in on Wayne gretzkys chances he'd have had 800 point seasons. That's not the way it works. The goal is to consistently create offense.

The fact we are here arguing about "those 2 passes Kreider made" is straight up ridiculous. How about we focus on how he's producing only 1 or 2 good chances a game. That's the problem. And it stems from being soft and tentative out there. I'd love to hear whose fault that is.

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02-16-2013, 12:13 PM
  #604
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
If the expectations are for Kreider to become Hagelin y'all are going to be waiting for a while.

Speed does not equal motor. That's like hoping Gaborik learns to work the corners from watching Callahan.
That's not it for me Hat. I would counter by saying that if the expectations are for the game to come to Kreider, than this could be a prospect with problems. Kreider's puck pursuit could be a whole lot better. It's a matter of understanding your strengths and maximizing them to better your self as a player. He has a tremendous skill set. It's the mind set that is becoming a bit of a concern. I suspect that's why they sent him down. But that's just me speculating.

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02-16-2013, 12:14 PM
  #605
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Except he isn't. And for you to blame good players for Kreider's overall incompetence is a sad argument. Just like the Torts bashing is a sad argument.

People are looking for every excuse to shield this guy wen the reality is that Kreider needs to play harder. That's on him. No one else.
I'm not saying he's playing great or even well, but he was producing offensive opportunities, high level ones. Also what difference does it make if they're good players? They should have buried those chances, whether they're good players or not. The fact that they're good players mean Kreider had even worse luck.

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02-16-2013, 12:20 PM
  #606
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CK should be brought back. CK JT and Cally should be a line. Give them 15 minutes. Torts needs to encourage CK to go to the net and not worry about being tentative and making a mistake. Just play hockey.

That's what will get CK ready to be a force in the playoffs.

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Old
02-16-2013, 12:26 PM
  #607
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Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
That's not it for me Hat. I would counter by saying that if the expectations are for the game to come to Kreider, than this could be a prospect with problems. Kreider's puck pursuit could be a whole lot better. It's a matter of understanding your strengths and maximizing them to better your self as a player. He has a tremendous skill set. It's the mind set that is becoming a bit of a concern. I suspect that's why they sent him down. But that's just me speculating.
Wasn't trying to call you or anyone else out. By all accounts that's what the coaching staff has been telling Kreider to do as well - "watch Hagelin".

I just have a hard time seeing him ever be able to do that, and think it is definitely in Kreider's head a bit. His puck pursuit needs to improve, and it's not because of physical limitations. Watching him just screams out that he's overthinking every single cut he makes on the ice instead of letting things come naturally.

Which is definitely why I believe sending him down was the right thing to do. It is just also interesting to see how quick the vultures can swarm around a 21 y/o kid but hey that's HF. Happened with MDZ in 10-11 in a big way, among many others.

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02-16-2013, 12:30 PM
  #608
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Im baffled by Kreiders demotion. I think he played well in the games he was up with the big club. Record evidences upon his return.

But, more importantly I think he in his short stint with Richard showed that these two can create offense together. Gaborik on the Right side where we WANTS to play. Kreider on the left wing. Why not give that a chance? They got Pyatt up there instead. Then Callahan with Gaborik moving over to the other side. Guy already said he wants to play on the Right Side? More comfortable there. Guy scored 402x for the Rangers there already.

More importantly for the Rangers I really think they need to utilize what they have at thier disposal regarding this line. I think Tortorella said he wanted more puck possesion out of them. Are these guys puck possesion players? It's not like Nylander/Jagr. I think Richards needs speedy wingers. In the case of Kreider a big speed winger. Open up the ice a bit. Quick transitions. Torts has tried just about every combo. Why not give this one a shot for a period of 2 or 3 games?

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Old
02-16-2013, 12:51 PM
  #609
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Originally Posted by Drewbackatu View Post
Look, Miller probably isn't there yet but bear in mind he's 19 years old and in his 2nd year.
What I see in Miller that I don't see in Kreider right now(despite Kreider having a superior skill set and size) is Miller works harder more often and appears to have a higher hockey IQ.

Again, just my opinion!
Largely agree, except to specify I don't believe Kreider is lazy.
He's tentative.
He knows he's proven he has the ability.
But instead of focusing on making more plays, he's concerned about not being the goat on another throw-away pass like in the playoffs.He needs to get past that and related subliminal memories. With experience, the good will quickly outweigh the bad.

But remember he's had minimal AHL experience. I think we are better off having his talent here and let him learn on the job if we can give him enough minutes, which we can. Once he's less tentative and more confident, we will be fully good to go with him.

He will at minimum be another Dave Keon.
He might or might not yet turn into another Pavel Bure.
It remains to be seen. I stand by what I have said.

On another topic relative to this thread, Miller stays.
I was on record he was good enough to be called up now and stay if his contribution as either depth to what we have now or as replacement on a speed line w/Hags + Cally or Kreider making someone, presumably Stepan or Boyle, movable if there was a profitable upgrade on a return.

It has now been determined by mgmt that despite the biz advantages of not accelerating his contractual status, the play of Miller brings more to the team NOW, despite need for further development, to justify promotion and retaining at the big club.

I stand by what I have said.

My detractors take their shots, which is their right, even if/when they are wrong as in this case.

So to those Ranger brethren here at the Boards whether civil detractor or not a not, who was open minded to give it the benefit of the doubt, and to those who were so arrogant and so sure there was no possible way I could be right about Miller that they had to not merely disagree, which is their right, but constantly vilify and mock or insult me.

He who last , best

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02-16-2013, 01:07 PM
  #610
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I don't want Kreider watching Hags. I want him watching Nash.

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02-16-2013, 01:12 PM
  #611
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I don't want Kreider watching Hags. I want him watching Nash.
Agreed.

He has the size, the speed and the tools to become a guy like that.

Anyone stating that he should be watching Hagelin is mistaken.

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02-16-2013, 01:17 PM
  #612
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Largely agree, except to specify I don't believe Kreider is lazy.
He's tentative.
He knows he's proven he has the ability.
But instead of focusing on making more plays, he's concerned about not being the goat on another throw-away pass like in the playoffs.He needs to get past that and related subliminal memories. With experience, the good will quickly outweigh the bad.

But remember he's had minimal AHL experience. I think we are better off having his talent here and let him learn on the job if we can give him enough minutes, which we can. Once he's less tentative and more confident, we will be fully good to go with him.

He will at minimum be another Dave Keon.
He might or might not yet turn into another Pavel Bure.
It remains to be seen. I stand by what I have said.

On another topic relative to this thread, Miller stays.
I was on record he was good enough to be called up now and stay if his contribution as either depth to what we have now or as replacement on a speed line w/Hags + Cally or Kreider making someone, presumably Stepan or Boyle, movable if there was a profitable upgrade on a return.

It has now been determined by mgmt that despite the biz advantages of not accelerating his contractual status, the play of Miller brings more to the team NOW, despite need for further development, to justify promotion and retaining at the big club.

I stand by what I have said.

My detractors take their shots, which is their right, even if/when they are wrong as in this case.

So to those Ranger brethren here at the Boards whether civil detractor or not a not, who was open minded to give it the benefit of the doubt, and to those who were so arrogant and so sure there was no possible way I could be right about Miller that they had to not merely disagree, which is their right, but constantly vilify and mock or insult me.

He who last , best
Funny. I was all set on complimenting you on writing a post without including a Stepan trade proposal or idea.

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Old
02-16-2013, 01:18 PM
  #613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I don't want Kreider watching Hags. I want him watching Nash.
Nash can do things with the puck that Kreider can't even dream of though.

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02-16-2013, 01:21 PM
  #614
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Yeah, this place is going to the birds.
I completely 100% disagree with the statement that Torts has done nothing I think it's beyond asinine and shows a complete lack of not just hockey knowledge but general sports knowledge. It reeks of entitlement. That said One person having a reeaaally ignorant viewpoint doesn't= this place sucking. This place is alright

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02-16-2013, 01:37 PM
  #615
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As Tortorella pointed out, this is all part of the “process” of teaching a young player the professional game. Tortorella likened it to Michael Del Zotto being sent back to the AHL after drawing comparisons to Brian Leetch at the start of his rookie season as a 19-year-old defenseman.

Tortorella did not rule out Kreider returning to the Rangers but did say the left wing needs to gain some consistency in his game and the speed he shows.
Quote:
“We gave (Kreider) point as far as what he needs to work on,” Tortorella said. “To me, it’s his whole game. It’s not a criticism. It’s part of learning the game. He has speed, has size, a lot of attributes. It’s a matter of getting him to make a difference within the game. Miller struggled away from the puck but he’s done enough on the other side to warrant him staying.”
http://blogs.northjersey.com/blogs/r...ews_and_notes/

Miller will play his 6th game tomorrow. Miller will be arbitration eligible one year earlier. At the end of his ELC,Miller will still be a group II without arb rights. Group III depends on where the NHL and PA set the number of accrued games for this season. Its 7 years accrued(its 40 NHL games in a full season) or 27. Miller will be a group III with 7 years accrued at 26 or at 27.

Kreider will be arb eligible at the end of his SPC in 2014.

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02-16-2013, 01:54 PM
  #616
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the #NYR have recalled @ChrisKreider from @CTWhale
https://twitter.com/NYRangers/status/302868394926043136

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02-16-2013, 01:55 PM
  #617
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lol. Miller down? Probably...

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02-16-2013, 01:56 PM
  #618
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What's going on here...

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Old
02-16-2013, 01:57 PM
  #619
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Chris Kreider recalled (2/16/13)

Kreider back up. That was quick.

Quote:
NEW YORK, February 16, 2013 – New York Rangers President and General Manager Glen Sather announced today that the club has recalled forward Chris Kreider from the Connecticut Whale of the American Hockey League (AHL).

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02-16-2013, 01:57 PM
  #620
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They want him playing every day. It makes sense.

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02-16-2013, 01:58 PM
  #621
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He has since been called up again. Hope he likes travel.

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Old
02-16-2013, 01:58 PM
  #622
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haha, what

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02-16-2013, 01:59 PM
  #623
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They said Nash was sick last night at the season ticket holder Q&A

wouldn't be surprised if this was the reason why

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02-16-2013, 01:59 PM
  #624
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Simple: Nash out, Kreider in. Nash in, Kreider sent back down.

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:00 PM
  #625
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Nash has the flu. He missed a fan forum last night. He didn't skate today.

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