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Old
02-16-2013, 01:37 AM
  #1
Canadian Gold X3
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Coaching Personnel discussion thread.

Since we have an AV discussion thread, why not make a thread to discuss (civilly) Bowness and Brown?

Have at 'er.

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Old
02-16-2013, 01:40 AM
  #2
Vankiller Whale
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Fire everyone. We lost one game out of our last 7. Completely unacceptable!

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:03 AM
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Derp Kassian
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Brown is still using that dumb Drop pass and hadn't fixed the PP but with Kesler in the fold it should improve.

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:07 AM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derp Kassian View Post
Brown is still using that dumb Drop pass and hadn't fixed the PP but with Kesler in the fold it should improve.
I heard someone say they scraped the drop pass. I guess not.

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:16 AM
  #5
PG Canuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natureboy1235 View Post
I heard someone say they scraped the drop pass. I guess not.
They use the drop pass here and there, but for the majority, it seems like they give it to Henrik and he tries to enter the zone all by himself. Can't say I'm a fan of this strategy, as once Henrik is able to enter the zone, he passes to the boards in which the forward/defensemen has no room to make a play with it. Plus he is standing still on the blueline, so if they have to resort to dumping it in, it's an easy clear for the opposition since we're flat footed on the blueline.

I liked what I saw in the first period from the PP though. Simple plays such as setting up one-timers to Kesler can create chances. We're trying to be too cute with the PP and find that perfect pass to score.

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:19 AM
  #6
DJOpus
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I would suggest that if we're going to go with Luongo we should hire Alllaire.

We should hire him for this season either way.

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:46 PM
  #7
AmazingNuck
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Henrik's the problem with the powerplay. He handles the puck more than anybody else, but if you're a defender, you know he's not going to shoot because he only has 19 shots in 13 games. That's ~120 over an 82 game schedule. He has 0 goals this year, is not a threat to score at all, which allows defenders to cheat extensively on passing lanes.

That, and zone entries. Wasting too much energy / time on the PP by not being able to enter the zone with efficiency. We lose an extra 3-5 seconds every single time we have to enter the zone, which is not acceptable if the Canucks want to win the Cup.

Post-lockout: Henrik Sedin points vs. shots

112p - 166 shots
94p - 157 shots
82p - 143 shots
81p - 134 shots
81p - 113 shots
76p - 141 shots
75p - 113 shots

Aside from the 76 point season, there's a clear correlation between the points / shots of Henrik Sedin. Is it safer to say that Henrik shoots more because he has more points, or to say that Henrik has more points because he shoots more? I'd say the latter because if you don't/can't shoot: it doesn't matter what sport you are in, nobody will defend the shot and everybody will focus their energy on cutting down the pass.


Last edited by AmazingNuck: 02-16-2013 at 02:51 PM.
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Old
02-16-2013, 02:48 PM
  #8
Scurr
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Having Kesler back to be the right hand, one time option on the PP is very significant imo and exactly what the PP has been missing.

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:49 PM
  #9
aandbreatheme
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmazingNuck View Post
Henrik's the problem with the powerplay. He handles the puck more than anybody else, but if you're a defender, you know he's not going to shoot because he only has 19 shots in 13 games. That's ~120 over an 82 game schedule. He has 0 goals this year, is not a threat to score at all, which allows defenders to cheat extensively on passing lanes.

That, and zone entries. Wasting too much energy / time on the PP by not being able to enter the zone with efficiency. We lose an extra 3-5 seconds every single time we have to enter the zone, which is not acceptable if the Canucks want to win the Cup.
Well it looked a lot better yesterday and I thought Henrik looked fine. He made great passes to Kesler, who hit the post and then whiffed on the second attempt. Plus, Daniel, Kesler, etc. are there to shoot the puck.

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:51 PM
  #10
NugentHopkinsfan
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Brown looked like a genius when elite puck mover Ehrhoff was leading the breakout and creating on the PP. Without that weapon the PP hasn't been the same, even though everything else has stayed the same!

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Old
02-16-2013, 02:53 PM
  #11
aandbreatheme
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NugentHopkinsfan View Post
Brown looked like a genius when elite puck mover Ehrhoff was leading the breakout and creating on the PP. Without that weapon the PP hasn't been the same, even though everything else has stayed the same!
Enough about Ehrhoff already. He's gone, get over it.

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Old
02-16-2013, 03:00 PM
  #12
AmazingNuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andbreatheme View Post
Well it looked a lot better yesterday and I thought Henrik looked fine. He made great passes to Kesler, who hit the post and then whiffed on the second attempt. Plus, Daniel, Kesler, etc. are there to shoot the puck.
The question isn't about whether the Sedins are producing or not, the question is about whether the Sedins are producing enough for the Canucks to go deep into the playoffs.

There is a big difference between the powerplay looking fine and the powerplay running optimally. Fine is fine if you don't care about going anywhere, but the Canucks need optimal production from the Sedins if they are going to get all the playing time.

Yes, Daniel and Kesler are there to shoot the puck- unfortunately, when the puck is in Henrik's hands, he has to make a pass to Daniel/Kesler before Daniel or Kesler can shoot the puck. Consider the passing lane between Daniel/Kesler and Henrik. Does the puck have a higher percentage of making the distance to Daniel or Kesler if there is a defender that's focused on disrupting the pass, or if there is a defender that has to split his focus between blocking a potential shot from Henrik and a potential pass from Henrik?

I mean, this is a basic concept to every sport. Is a player harder to defend if he's more predictable or less predictable? If a player is going to pass every time, you might as well not guard him because he's no threat to score. Cut down the passing lanes and he's neutralized. A player who can shoot and pass is one that is much harder to neutralize.

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Old
02-16-2013, 03:05 PM
  #13
aandbreatheme
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmazingNuck View Post
The question isn't about whether the Sedins are producing or not, the question is about whether the Sedins are producing enough for the Canucks to go deep into the playoffs.

There is a big difference between the powerplay looking fine and the powerplay running optimally. Fine is fine if you don't care about going anywhere, but the Canucks need optimal production from the Sedins if they are going to get all the playing time.

Yes, Daniel and Kesler are there to shoot the puck- unfortunately, when the puck is in Henrik's hands, he has to make a pass to Daniel/Kesler before Daniel or Kesler can shoot the puck. Consider the passing lane between Daniel/Kesler and Henrik. Does the puck have a higher percentage of making the distance to Daniel or Kesler if there is a defender that's focused on disrupting the pass, or if there is a defender that has to split his focus between blocking a potential shot from Henrik and a potential pass from Henrik?

I mean, this is a basic concept to every sport. Is a player harder to defend if he's more predictable or less predictable? If a player is going to pass every time, you might as well not guard him because he's no threat to score. Cut down the passing lanes and he's neutralized. A player who can shoot and pass is one that is much harder to neutralize.
What I meant was it at least looks like it's headed in the right direction (especially from what we've seen thus far). I don't know what "If you don't care about getting anywhere" is supposed to mean. Henrik can and definitely should work on his shot.

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Old
02-16-2013, 03:22 PM
  #14
VanEric
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This is a pretty pointless discussion, IMO, because none of us really know what the assistants do on a day to day basis. For all we know they suggest stuff that AV doesn't approve of or vice versa.

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02-16-2013, 03:24 PM
  #15
AmazingNuck
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Originally Posted by andbreatheme View Post
What I meant was it at least looks like it's headed in the right direction (especially from what we've seen thus far). I don't know what "If you don't care about getting anywhere" is supposed to mean. Henrik can and definitely should work on his shot.
But it's not. The Sedins are still doing the same things over and over again that caused them to be shut down by just about everybody this year and the 2nd half of last year, only they did it marginally better last night.

Means that I wouldn't care about the Sedins' production as it stands right now if I just wanted them to make the playoffs, but if I wanted them to win the Stanley Cup, then I would want them to produce optimally. They produce enough to make the playoffs, but their style is too easily shut down when the playoffs arrive.

However, he won't. He's on pace for the same number of shots as last year over an 82 game schedule. How many players handle the puck as much as him, yet shoot as little as him?

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02-16-2013, 03:25 PM
  #16
Eddy Punch Clock
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Someone's gotta go to make room for Manny.

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Old
02-16-2013, 03:30 PM
  #17
Lowkey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derp Kassian View Post
Brown is still using that dumb Drop pass and hadn't fixed the PP but with Kesler in the fold it should improve.
I guess a lot of people haven't noticed but it seems to me that almost every team is using this "dumb" drop pass now.

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Old
02-16-2013, 04:01 PM
  #18
ihaveyuidonttouchme
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When do we get to see this so called Garrison's blast on the pp?

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Old
02-16-2013, 06:07 PM
  #19
vanuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andbreatheme View Post
Enough about Ehrhoff already. He's gone, get over it.
His point though was that Brown doesn't look like a PP genius anymore without Hoff, making his work running it seem questionable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy Punch Clock View Post
Someone's gotta go to make room for Manny.
I've wondered - other than having him as a faceoff coach, can they also have him on the bench to advise our centers on how to win draws against certain players? Might be helpful.

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Old
02-17-2013, 11:15 AM
  #20
Bure80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NugentHopkinsfan View Post
Brown looked like a genius when elite puck mover Ehrhoff was leading the breakout and creating on the PP. Without that weapon the PP hasn't been the same, even though everything else has stayed the same!
Btw. Ehrhoff is Buffalo's big minute eater and is the best in +/- on the team.

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