HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

Trade Rumor Thread III: "Trade 40 goal scorer for picks= Cup contenders" edition

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-17-2013, 12:37 AM
  #476
slipknottin
Registered User
 
slipknottin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: CT
Posts: 2,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikos87 View Post
What if he was banged up that day? Is this NHL 13? I thought they added injuries to the GM mode 5 years ago.
Right, Del Zotto was banged up.

Thanks for clarifying that with the link you provided.

slipknottin is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:39 AM
  #477
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Right, Del Zotto was banged up.

Thanks for clarifying that with the link you provided.
Del Zotto played more than Stralman the first game Girardi was out, and 4 minutes less than him the 2nd game Girardi was out. Yep its clear Del Zotto is going to be on the bottom pairing going forward..

Lundsanity30 is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:40 AM
  #478
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,097
vCash: 500
regardless this discussion is kinda pointless, there are links that say the Rangers are not willing to break the 2 year bridge contract for O'Reilly and that O'Reilly is seeking close to 5m per year which the Rangers simply cant afford and would be fools to give out.

Lundsanity30 is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:41 AM
  #479
slipknottin
Registered User
 
slipknottin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: CT
Posts: 2,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Del Zotto played more than Stralman the first game Girardi was out, and 4 minutes less than him the 2nd game Girardi was out. Yep its clear Del Zotto is going to be on the bottom pairing going forward..
That was never my point. My point was that Stralman has been playing as much as Del Zotto lately.

slipknottin is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:42 AM
  #480
slipknottin
Registered User
 
slipknottin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: CT
Posts: 2,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
regardless this discussion is kinda pointless, there are links that say the Rangers are not willing to break the 2 year bridge contract for O'Reilly and that O'Reilly is seeking close to 5m per year which the Rangers simply cant afford and would be fools to give out.
feel free to exit the conversation then.

slipknottin is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:45 AM
  #481
smoneil
Registered User
 
smoneil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Rochester
Country: United States
Posts: 2,252
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Might as well just trade everyone then.

Or they could improve the center position a ton.... by moving a 3rd line defenseman.
Is Duncan Keith a 3rd pair guy? What about Doughty, Subban, Lidstrom, Seabrooke, Enstrom or Ehrhoff?

Del Zotto out-scored all those guys last year.

He was on the ice more per game than guys like Hamonic, Yandle, OEL, Carlson and Timonen. They all 3rd pair guys too?

With all of your over-the-top hyperbole, I'm seriously questioning whether you're even trying to be serious or if you're just trying to troll the entire board in here.

smoneil is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:48 AM
  #482
slipknottin
Registered User
 
slipknottin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: CT
Posts: 2,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
Is Duncan Keith a 3rd pair guy? What about Doughty, Subban, Lidstrom, Seabrooke, Enstrom or Ehrhoff?

Del Zotto out-scored all those guys last year.

He was on the ice more per game than guys like Hamonic, Yandle, OEL, Carlson and Timonen. They all 3rd pair guys too?

With all of your over-the-top hyperbole, I'm seriously questioning whether you're even trying to be serious or if you're just trying to troll the entire board in here.
Del Zotto is a 3rd pairing for the rangers. If hes a top 4, or top 2 pairing elsewhere then he holds tremendously more value for the rangers in a trade than he does staying here.

slipknottin is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:51 AM
  #483
smoneil
Registered User
 
smoneil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Rochester
Country: United States
Posts: 2,252
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Del Zotto is a 3rd pairing for the rangers. If hes a top 4, or top 2 pairing elsewhere then he holds tremendously more value for the rangers in a trade than he does staying here.

You can keep typing it until you're blue in the fingers--The only place where Del Zotto is a 3rd pair guy on this team is in your imagination. He's clearly in the top 4 here.

smoneil is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 12:53 AM
  #484
slipknottin
Registered User
 
slipknottin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: CT
Posts: 2,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
You can keep typing it until you're blue in the fingers--The only place where Del Zotto is a 3rd pair guy on this team is in your imagination. He's clearly in the top 4 here.
Except he really isnt, unless he plays the wrong side, or staal/mcd do.

At LD Staal and McD are going to remain ahead of him.

Really I would call him more of a 4a, and stralman the 4b.

slipknottin is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 01:01 AM
  #485
SnowblindNYR
Registered User
 
SnowblindNYR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 14,917
vCash: 500
BTW, is O'Brien the guy we want in this trade? The guy that got undressed by Mario Lemieux, I mean Ales Hemsky?

SnowblindNYR is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 01:05 AM
  #486
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
BTW, is O'Brien the guy we want in this trade? The guy that got undressed by Mario Lemieux, I mean Ales Hemsky?
I dont want anyone they have on that defense, and EJ is not available.

Lundsanity30 is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 01:18 AM
  #487
smoneil
Registered User
 
smoneil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Rochester
Country: United States
Posts: 2,252
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Except he really isnt, unless he plays the wrong side, or staal/mcd do.

At LD Staal and McD are going to remain ahead of him.

Really I would call him more of a 4a, and stralman the 4b.
You are seriously over-rating Stralman. He has played well here BECAUSE he's been sheltered. Look at his track record. When teams try to play Stralman as anything more than a 3rd pair guy, disaster tends to strike.

And yes, MDZ is behind Staal and McD on the left. He's spent the better part of two years now working on playing his off side. Now that he's finally getting the hang of it, you want to move him!?

Like I said earlier--I still can't tell if you are serious in what you post. You point to lists of players who have had 55 point seasons by the age that RO'R did, but where is your list of defensemen who have put up 40+ points by Del Zotto's age? O'Reilly is doing his thing "with almost no talent" around him (even though Landeskog basically single-handedly doubled O'Reilly's point production last year), but Del Zotto gets no credit for putting up 40+ points while playing significant minutes on his off side?

O'Reilly is a "first line center" (even though he's only a 3rd line center on his own team, behind Stastny and Duchene, and would be a 3rd line center here, behind Richards and Stepan), and yet Del Zotto is a "3rd line guy" (even though he's had top 4 minutes consistently for more than a year, and plays more than 22 minutes per game in all situations).

Every time you cherry pick things to value about RO'R and things to minimize MDZ, it makes people wonder what your real motivation here is.

smoneil is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 01:50 AM
  #488
mike14
Registered User
 
mike14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Melbourne
Country: Australia
Posts: 3,949
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
BTW, is O'Brien the guy we want in this trade? The guy that got undressed by Mario Lemieux, I mean Ales Hemsky?
There's nothing on the Avs D that I'd want, but this is a pretty simple argument. I remember N. Dawes undressing C. Pronger a few years back and I would certainly have taken him at the time

mike14 is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 01:58 AM
  #489
Slick Rick 61
Registered User
 
Slick Rick 61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 409
vCash: 500
The Rangers can't afford to trade any of their top 4 D for O'Reilly. Period. I like him a lot, but it's just addressing one issue and creating another. NYR and COL don't match up well here.

Slick Rick 61 is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 02:25 AM
  #490
BrianBoyle
4 teams in 5 yrs
 
BrianBoyle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the grass
Country: United States
Posts: 51,452
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyrangersfan1416 View Post
The Rangers can't afford to trade any of their top 4 D for O'Reilly. Period. I like him a lot, but it's just addressing one issue and creating another. NYR and COL don't match up well here.
I really don't believe that moving Del Zotto for a F creates an "issue". We have 5 defenseman capable of playing top-4 minutes (DZ, Staal, Girardi, Stralman, and McDonagh). The bottom pairing is playing maybe 10 minutes a night. Gilroy has been solid, and the defenseman we get back from the Avalanche would be NHL-caliber, should the deal go through. A player like Zanon, Wilson, or O'Byrne. The Avs D is terrible, but the individual players aren't terrible in their proper roles. These players are playing way too many minutes because of the Avs' extremely weak defense. In a role where they play 10-15 mins a night, they'll play decent and be a good 3rd pair player.

__________________

Neutral Milk Hotel are literally GOAT
Amy Poehler <3

Credit to Ail for the sig.
BrianBoyle is online now  
Old
02-17-2013, 04:17 AM
  #491
Panfork
Pacioretty Hater
 
Panfork's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 2,377
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
I really don't believe that moving Del Zotto for a F creates an "issue". We have 5 defenseman capable of playing top-4 minutes (DZ, Staal, Girardi, Stralman, and McDonagh). The bottom pairing is playing maybe 10 minutes a night. Gilroy has been solid, and the defenseman we get back from the Avalanche would be NHL-caliber, should the deal go through. A player like Zanon, Wilson, or O'Byrne. The Avs D is terrible, but the individual players aren't terrible in their proper roles. These players are playing way too many minutes because of the Avs' extremely weak defense. In a role where they play 10-15 mins a night, they'll play decent and be a good 3rd pair player.
Wilson is on IR. Zanon and O'Byrne are disgustingly awful. I really want to throw up every time I have to watch them play.

Panfork is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 04:20 AM
  #492
BrianBoyle
4 teams in 5 yrs
 
BrianBoyle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the grass
Country: United States
Posts: 51,452
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panfork View Post
Wilson is on IR. Zanon and O'Byrne are disgustingly awful. I really want to throw up every time I have to watch them play.
I really think it has to do with the fact that they're being very overplayed.

Gilroy was overplayed last year with the Lightning. In a lesser role with the Rangers, he looks a lot more useful. Looking up O'Byrne's minutes, he's playing between 17-20 minutes a night, which is crazy for a player of his caliber. He should be putting in 10-12 minutes TOPS, against lesser lines. He's more than likely playing against good players out there.

BrianBoyle is online now  
Old
02-17-2013, 04:33 AM
  #493
Panfork
Pacioretty Hater
 
Panfork's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 2,377
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
I really think it has to do with the fact that they're being very overplayed.

Gilroy was overplayed last year with the Lightning. In a lesser role with the Rangers, he looks a lot more useful. Looking up O'Byrne's minutes, he's playing between 17-20 minutes a night, which is crazy for a player of his caliber. He should be putting in 10-12 minutes TOPS, against lesser lines. He's more than likely playing against good players out there.
Yeah, well, you'd play Ryan O'Byrne in your 2nd pairing too if your 2 best healthy defensemen were Jan Hejda and Shane O'Brien.

Panfork is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 06:29 AM
  #494
RangerBoy
1994 FOREVER
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 30,989
vCash: 500
The only D on the Avs worth pursuing is Tyson Barrie. He could replace some of the minutes and offense lost in a Del Zotto-O'Reilly trade. Barrie is 5-10. Torts had success with Dan Boyle who is 5-11. Both are right handed. Barrie is in the 2nd season of his 3 year ELC.

Goligoski for Neal and Niskanen.

DZ is the superior player to Goligoski.

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 09:49 AM
  #495
Lion Hound
@JoeTucc26
 
Lion Hound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Country: United States
Posts: 3,700
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
The only D on the Avs worth pursuing is Tyson Barrie. He could replace some of the minutes and offense lost in a Del Zotto-O'Reilly trade. Barrie is 5-10. Torts had success with Dan Boyle who is 5-11. Both are right handed. Barrie is in the 2nd season of his 3 year ELC.

Goligoski for Neal and Niskanen.

DZ is the superior player to Goligoski.
The Neal/Goglioski trade happened in Feb 2011. Neal was in a slight slump at the time but he was hyped as the next big power forward. He was about the same age as ROR. But, Neal was singed already with another year left on his contract. This leads me to believe that Sather has more leverage if the Rangers are truly in on ROR.

I know Brooks dismissed it already but HNIC seemed to think it was very real.

Lion Hound is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 09:58 AM
  #496
Trxjw
Moderator
Bored.
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Land of no calls..
Country: United States
Posts: 15,782
vCash: 500
You can really tell who has watched this kid play and who hasn't. It's the Nash argument all over again.

Del Zotto, on this team, is the 4th best defensemen we have. While he's the best PMD we have, that doesn't necessarily put him in a different class than the other guys. For the sake of argument, let's say the deal is ROR and Barrie for MDZ and a prospect. You've dealt your 4th best defensemen, who has maybe #2 upside, for a guy who is arguably now in a tie as your 2nd best center and has #1 upside. You've also brought back a very good PMD who is right handed and NHL ready.

Center is arguably the most important position on the ice. Adding ROR allows Miller to return to the AHL to continue his development. It also gives us a viable center for Callahan on what has the makings of a very high-end shutdown line.

He's not likely ever going to be a 90pt first line center, but if he can give us 65+ points and elite two-way play, that's just fine by me.

Trxjw is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 10:04 AM
  #497
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
You can really tell who has watched this kid play and who hasn't. It's the Nash argument all over again.

Del Zotto, on this team, is the 4th best defensemen we have. While he's the best PMD we have, that doesn't necessarily put him in a different class than the other guys. For the sake of argument, let's say the deal is ROR and Barrie for MDZ and a prospect. You've dealt your 4th best defensemen, who has maybe #2 upside, for a guy who is arguably now in a tie as your 2nd best center and has #1 upside. You've also brought back a very good PMD who is right handed and NHL ready.

Center is arguably the most important position on the ice. Adding ROR allows Miller to return to the AHL to continue his development. It also gives us a viable center for Callahan on what has the makings of a very high-end shutdown line.

He's not likely ever going to be a 90pt first line center, but if he can give us 65+ points and elite two-way play, that's just fine by me.
How come so many teams are jumping at the bit to trade for him then? There were MANy teams intereted in Nash (he just had a select few that he wanted to go to)?. This is far from a Nash situation, and people didnt want to include DZ for NASH, now we're talking about giving him up for ROR? .. I'd take ROR, just not at the expense of making our defense much worse.

We NEEDED Nash, he was a neccessity, not a luxury. We needed to add more scoring punch and more creativity. We needed someone who had the ability to take over a game, and we got that with Nash. Then we neded some depth to replace guys like AA or Dubi, and we did that with Pyatt, Powe, and the promotion of Miller.


Last edited by Lundsanity30: 02-17-2013 at 10:26 AM.
Lundsanity30 is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 10:28 AM
  #498
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 27,265
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
How come so many teams are jumping at the bit to trade for him then? There were MANy teams intereted in Nash (he just had a select few that he wanted to go to)?. This is far from a Nash situation, and people didnt want to include DZ for NASH, now we're talking about giving him up for ROR? .. I'd take ROR, just not at the expense of making our defense much worse.

We NEEDED Nash, he was a neccessity, not a luxury. We needed to add more scoring punch and more creativity. We needed someone who had the ability to take over a game, and we got that with Nash. Then we neded some depth to replace guys like AA or Dubi, and we did that with Pyatt, Powe, and the promotion of Miller.
People didn't want to move MDZ in a package for Nash. MDZ for Nash? Absolutely.

NYR Viper is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 10:29 AM
  #499
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
I really don't believe that moving Del Zotto for a F creates an "issue". We have 5 defenseman capable of playing top-4 minutes (DZ, Staal, Girardi, Stralman, and McDonagh). The bottom pairing is playing maybe 10 minutes a night. Gilroy has been solid, and the defenseman we get back from the Avalanche would be NHL-caliber, should the deal go through. A player like Zanon, Wilson, or O'Byrne. The Avs D is terrible, but the individual players aren't terrible in their proper roles. These players are playing way too many minutes because of the Avs' extremely weak defense. In a role where they play 10-15 mins a night, they'll play decent and be a good 3rd pair player.
If they are terrible for the Avalanche, what on God's green earth do you think Torts is going to put any kind of trust in them and actually play them more than 5 minutes a game unless he's absolutely forced to. We saw what happens when we have no depth on defense in the playoffs last season, mcdonagh and Girardi played 10,000 minutes a series and we're dead by the time the ECF came around, not looking to be back in that situation again for a guy who would be a luxury here.

Lundsanity30 is offline  
Old
02-17-2013, 10:30 AM
  #500
Lundsanity30
Registered User
 
Lundsanity30's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
People didn't want to move MDZ in a package for Nash. MDZ for Nash? Absolutely.
its also not JUST Del Zotto, its Del Zotto AND a proven forward (at this point) for ROR, so thats still considered a package.

Lundsanity30 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:05 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.