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Toronto Gunnarson to Edmonton for 1st

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Old
02-17-2013, 09:55 AM
  #26
doubledown99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TieClark View Post
As a Leaf fan, I don't like Gunnarsson at all. I think he's a bottom pairing defender at best with no offensive upside. However, if Paul Gaustad is worth a 1st at the deadline, Gunnarsson certainly is too. Edmonton's however, no.
So that is one trade that every Leaf fan refers to. Now there are so many factors at play here:
-quality of the draft
-Nsh needing to make a run based on Suter being UFA and Weber being RFA etc
-quality of playoff field etc

Just because it happened last year doesn't mean it will happen this year. Go look at all the trades that have happened so far this yr. Legit NHL players are going for 3rd, 5th rd picks. So based on recent events I would say his value is a lot lower than a 1st rd pick. I can't wait to revisit these threads after the deadline and see people's reactions to what these players values really were. History tells me when deep drafts like 2003 or 2008 come around, top picks are not moved very much (especially at the deadline). This draft is lauded for its quality so I see the same thing happening....

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02-17-2013, 09:57 AM
  #27
The Saurus
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Originally Posted by Chaz McNulty View Post
I never realized how coveted Carl Gunnarson was around the league. I don't watch the Leafs alot. Can I ask you where he would slot in with the Canucks defense.

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Either above or below Jason Garrison, depending on the needs of the team at the time. For example, if trying to come back from two goals down, the coach would play Jason Garrison a hell of a lot more than Carl Gunnarsson. But if they're trying to nurse a two goal lead, you'll most certainly give more minutes to Carl Gunnarsson.

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02-17-2013, 09:58 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by glovesave_35 View Post
I think you may be overrating the value of the most reliable defenseman on a bad team with defensive issues the last few years. The fact that he's your best defenseman is entirely irrelevant.
Indeed, it is. But those kinds of skills don't evaporate. Carl Gunnarsson is a very good defensive player and that doesn't change whether he's on the Maple Leafs or the Red Wings.

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02-17-2013, 09:59 AM
  #29
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I am not sure that even if he was the best D on the team(he wasn't), that he would be worth a 1st. The best D on the worst defensive team isn't a selling point in my opinion.

I am not saying he is bad or anything, but there are an awful lot of defenseman who would have been the best D on Toronto last year.

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02-17-2013, 10:05 AM
  #30
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I think Gunnarsson may in fact be worth a 1st rounder, but a very late one. The Oilers second is therefore likely closer in value, not that the Leafs should make such a deal.

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02-17-2013, 10:11 AM
  #31
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He is worth a late first at the deadline no doubt. Look what the Leafs got for Versteeg and what Nashville paid for Gaustad. If they're worth a 1s then Gunnar certainly is.

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02-17-2013, 10:11 AM
  #32
Phion Keneuf
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If Kyle Quincey could get a 1st rounder, Gunnarsson could get the 1st overall pick

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02-17-2013, 10:20 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
If Kyle Quincey could get a 1st rounder, Gunnarsson could get the 1st overall pick
There is a big difference between last years draft and this years draft. Also a big difference between Detroit last year and Edmonton this year.

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02-17-2013, 10:22 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by The Saurus View Post
Carl Gunnarsson is certainly worth a first round draft pick. He's capable of playing very difficult minutes and does it well.

Defenders like Carl don't grow on trees and teams will have to pay a significant price to get the Leafs to part ways with him.
Maybe in Toronto, but not many other places. Gunnarsson is a decent defender, but every team in the league has decent defenders and none of them are worth a 1st round draft pick either.

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02-17-2013, 10:26 AM
  #35
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dunno why some Leafs fans would want to trade Gunnarsson away for; he's the best defensive dman you've got.

and as for if he's worth a 1st; i'd say yes. but you're not gonnafind many teams willing to part with their 1st pick of 2013 unless they get something they really want back.

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Old
02-17-2013, 10:30 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaz McNulty View Post
I never realized how coveted Carl Gunnarson was around the league. I don't watch the Leafs alot. Can I ask you where he would slot in with the Canucks defense.

Hamhuis
Bieksa
Edler
Garrison
Ballard
Tanev
He's not... he's severely overrated around Leaf land for several reasons... none of which have to do with his actual skill or play.

He'd probably fit in on the 3rd pairing above Ballard for the Canucks but he's soft as a fluffed pillow and has no offence at all.

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02-17-2013, 10:31 AM
  #37
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Really?

Weber 2nd round
Subban 2nd round
Letang 3rd round
Yandle 4th round
Hamonic 2nd round



Picks are pretty important. Even later round picks. Gunnarson isnt worth a first. IMO a 2nd
Excellent, now take all the other 2nd and 3rd round picks and show me how many became NHLers? I can save you time, 25% of all 2nd round picks become NHLers, even less when you do further down in the rounds.

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02-17-2013, 10:38 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TieClark View Post
As a Leaf fan, I don't like Gunnarsson at all. I think he's a bottom pairing defender at best with no offensive upside. However, if Paul Gaustad is worth a 1st at the deadline, Gunnarsson certainly is too. Edmonton's however, no.

I see so many people say this exact thing and it makes me laugh so much. The Preds overpaid cause they thought it would push them over the top to win it all. It didnt work out for them and I would bet they regret making that deal. If Gunnarsson was the kind of guy that would push you over the top then maybe it might be worth it. But IMO he would be a depth guy for a team looking to make a good run in the playoffs. He will not get you a 1st.

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02-17-2013, 10:40 AM
  #39
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I see so many people say this exact thing and it makes me laugh so much. The Preds overpaid cause they thought it would push them over the top to win it all. It didnt work out for them and I would bet they regret making that deal. If Gunnarsson was the kind of guy that would push you over the top then maybe it might be worth it. But IMO he would be a depth guy for a team looking to make a good run in the playoffs. He will not get you a 1st.
He certainly would from a top 6 or 7 team that needs good defensive players on the blue line.

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02-17-2013, 10:40 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by New Liskeard View Post
Excellent, now take all the other 2nd and 3rd round picks and show me how many became NHLers? I can save you time, 25% of all 2nd round picks become NHLers, even less when you do further down in the rounds.
irrelevant, Gunnarsson still isnt worth a 1st

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02-17-2013, 10:43 AM
  #41
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Edmonton doesn't trade away lottery picks, you have them confused with the Leafs.

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02-17-2013, 10:46 AM
  #42
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OK. I gotta admit. I just deleted half a dozen acronyms which stood for various forms of laughing... but now that I'm ready to put that aside...

No way in hell!

Why waste a first on Gunnar if we've got 1 guy in Klefbom who'll surpass him next year, two others in Marincin and Musil who'll easily surpass him in the next 2-3 years and Gernat who's got a shot at blowing him away offensively in 3-4?

The closest sensible offer I can think of is Kulimen and agree to pay for 1/3 of his contract... but that still doesn't seem palatable enough to me because he isn't consistent enough offensively. When he isn't putting points up Hartikainen makes him a little redundant. If you've ever watched Hartikainen work for the puck behind the net, in the corner or on the side boards, you'd completely agree with me.

Anyhow, no thanks. I'd rather Edmonton pick the most NHL ready player available or whatever you'd consider the safest pick just to be sure that our prospect pool has enough juice in it. Another center wouldn't hurt, since Lander is progressing slowly and we're pretty much ready to buyout horcoff.

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02-17-2013, 10:51 AM
  #43
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irrelevant, Gunnarsson still isnt worth a 1st
Yes, he is. He's a young top four defender and the value of such pieces is very high on the trade market.

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02-17-2013, 10:56 AM
  #44
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Holy overvalue, Batman!

Leaf fans will realize that their current defensive lineup is successful due to a decent system provided through good coaching. In a couple seasons when they're back to being semi-legitimate contenders, guys like Mike Kostka and Mark Fraser will return to the depths of the minor leagues where they belong and a guy like Carl Gunnarson will settle into a bottom pairing role.

The guy's been impressive, but he's nowhere near the return being offered here. When guys like Barkov, Monahan or Lazar may still be on the board at Edmonton's pick, Gunnarson looks pretty redundant.

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02-17-2013, 10:59 AM
  #45
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Holy overvalue, Batman!

Leaf fans will realize that their current defensive lineup is successful due to a decent system provided through good coaching. In a couple seasons when they're back to being semi-legitimate contenders, guys like Mike Kostka and Mark Fraser will return to the depths of the minor leagues where they belong and a guy like Carl Gunnarson will settle into a bottom pairing role.
Carl Gunnarsson is currently nursing a hip injury and hasn't been playing so the Leafs' current success has nothing to do with perceptions of his value.

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02-17-2013, 11:01 AM
  #46
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Yes, he is. He's a young top four defender and the value of such pieces is very high on the trade market.
It might be there from a contending team, but Edmonton is just finishing it's rebuild. Given the injureis at we've taken this year we may very well have a top 10 pick. Gunnar is not worth a top 10 pick...a late 1st yes. A 1st from a contending team looking to shore up it's blueline...quite lkiely. A 1st from a team not looking to makea cup run this year...not so likely. Also consider the change in the draft lottery...every non playoff team now hasa chance at the 1st overall rather than mving up 4 positions. Big change in how teams look at their 1st rounders.

Especially when you consider Tambo's luck and trollface. If any GM is going to win that 1st overall pick via lottery it could very well be him.

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02-17-2013, 11:05 AM
  #47
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Toronto best D from last year a solid solid player with poise and a great puck mover who is responsible in his own end. Great skater

for Edmontons 1st...

Seems like good value..he is worth far more than a 2nd and Edmonton's drafting at # 1 overall days are over now..there a disaster on D and Gunnarsson would become top pairing right away..
counter offer whitny for your the leafs furst

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02-17-2013, 11:09 AM
  #48
belair
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Originally Posted by The Saurus View Post
Carl Gunnarsson is currently nursing a hip injury and hasn't been playing so the Leafs' current success has nothing to do with perceptions of his value.
Irregardless.

The part of my post that you cut off is the very reason why Gunnarson isn't worth a 1st.

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02-17-2013, 11:18 AM
  #49
The Saurus
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Irregardless.

The part of my post that you cut off is the very reason why Gunnarson isn't worth a 1st.
Probably not worth a first from Edmonton but he could fetch a late first. Edmonton's not a good team so I could understand why they'd be hesitant to trade a first for Carl Gunnarsson.

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02-17-2013, 11:22 AM
  #50
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Not giving a 1st for Gunner, maybe a 2nd but not a 1st. I want to give it another 7 games to see how the defense either improves are doesn't. Then we will go from there. Seeing what dmen have gone through already Ellerby, Fistric I don't see Gunner getting a big return. Every team has players like him, it is the top end dmen that teams want.

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