I understand satchmo and many others calling Armia lazy, but slow and weak are things that he is not and I haven't heard those things said about him, at least not by many, in the past year or so.
This. Most people saying Armia wont make it in the NHL haven't seen many or any games from him. Watch few games now and if u still think he's slow and weak u must be in psychosis.
Amazing game from him once again yesterday. He wasn't just dominating in offense, but also working and defending very hard. 2+3 in the last two games and more to come.
In a wet dream. Helm's got a lot of hockey sense to go with his speed.
Helm's also got stone hands though. We'll see in the coming years how Catenacci's game translates to the pros, but I'm inclined to say he has the potential to be quite a bit more dangerous than Helm offensively.
Helm's also got stone hands though. We'll see in the coming years how Catenacci's game translates to the pros, but I'm inclined to say he has the potential to be quite a bit more dangerous than Helm offensively.
What are you basing this on? Helm and Catenacci have virtually identical goal-scoring numbers in the final two years of juniors.
Helm: 66 goals in 129 games
Catenacci: 65 goals in 123 games
I'd be thrilled to death if Catenacci becomes a NHL regular, let alone a player approaching the ilk of Helm.
What are you basing this on? Helm and Catenacci have virtually identical goal-scoring numbers in the final two years of juniors.
Helm: 66 goals in 129 games
Catenacci: 65 goals in 123 games
I'd be thrilled to death if Catenacci becomes a NHL regular, let alone a player approaching the ilk of Helm.
Different leagues, different times. Catenacci is 12th in the OHL in scoring. Helm in his senior year was 35th in the Dub. One of these players clearly better compared to his peers than the other.
I'm not saying Catenacci will be better offensively than Helm, by any means though. Just saying I think the potential is there to contribute more than ~25 points. Any 3rd rounder that becomes an NHLer in any capacity is a win though.
So Catenacci is like Ryan O'Reilly and Armia is an impending bust. Cool.
I didn't say Cat is like O'Reilly - I posed that as a question.
Given that I've seen him play just a pair of times in person, I don't know much about his game. Sounds like a great defensive center at the junior level.
If he's as good as you're saying, I'm sure we'll see him in Buffalo next year. I don't think Buffalo designated him as a recall option in the event of the lockout ending, so they didn't get a chance to see him in training camp when the season started. Usually 3rd rounders aren't much to get excited about, but it seems like Cat could become a very good 2nd or 3rd liner.
He wasn't taken 1st overall in the OHL for nothing. I hope you're right with that last statement.
Ässät was heading out of playoffs and sold their best player, Stephen Dixon, to KHL. After the trade, team's captain held private talks with all players and asked them to start to play for team, not for themselves. The biggest change was in Armia's game, last 7 games (with 7 wins) he has been playing solid game without looking lazy. Doing the dirty work for team, and after couple of games without scoring/points, he's also heating up now offensively.
This apparently tells that kid has it, but still there are big, big question marks about his consistency. In my opinion the learning for Buffalo organization is that Armia needs constant feedback and kick in the ass every now and then. Otherwise he'll start the drifting again.
I didn't say Cat is like O'Reilly - I posed that as a question.
Given that I've seen him play just a pair of times in person, I don't know much about his game. Sounds like a great defensive center at the junior level.
There are some similarities: They have similar OHL offensive numbers (obviously only comparing their first two years). They are both two-way forwards, who play with a bit of an edge. Both went 1st overall in the OHL draft, then didn't get selected in the 1st round of the NHL draft.
I have seen a lot more of Cat than O'Reilly so it is hard for me to make much more of a comparison than that. Funny, I hardly even knew O'Reilly was in the OHL when he was there. Maybe that was because he played with Erie and never scored more than 20 goals.
He wasn't taken 1st overall in the OHL for nothing. I hope you're right with that last statement.
When the team picking first overall is a northern city that has trouble getting kids to report (Soo), the relevance of going first overall lessened.
That type of thing is why Ryan O'Reilly was taken first overall by Erie ahead of Taylor Hall, why Josh Ho-Sang fell to fifth last year despite being the second best player in the draft, and why who I assume your namesake is fell to the 67's in his draft year.
It happens every year and is bound to happen this year again, even with the compensation system in place for first rounders.
Anyways, OHL teams do not look at NHL potential when selecting, so the two aren't really connected.
Sometimes you'll see a team opt to take a kid that doesn't project well to the NHL at all and ones that are bound struggle during their 16 and 17 year old years, but become OHL franchise players at 18, 19, and 20.
Catenacci going first overall is very much a mix of those two factors, rather than an indicator of his NHL prospects.
He had a very strong start from what I saw. His skating is definitely one of his best assets, and his defensive IQ and stickwork were pretty good too. Offensively, he's not amazing, but he makes a good first pass and does a good job getting his shots through, though he's not much of a threat to score with them. Does all right in the corners, but he needs to get stronger and doesn't really look to make big hits. After a bit, he hit a rough patch (and really the whole team did -- they were BAD defensively until the lockout ended and they got Pardy instead of Brennan and the level of talent in the league went down). Seems like he's gotten back on track since then though.
I'd say he projects as anywhere from a 2-4 guy in the NHL if all goes well. Maybe puts up 30 points, logging fairly tough defensive minutes.
When the team picking first overall is a northern city that has trouble getting kids to report (Soo), the relevance of going first overall lessened.
That type of thing is why Ryan O'Reilly was taken first overall by Erie ahead of Taylor Hall, why Josh Ho-Sang fell to fifth last year despite being the second best player in the draft, and why who I assume your namesake is fell to the 67's in his draft year.
It happens every year and is bound to happen this year again, even with the compensation system in place for first rounders.
Anyways, OHL teams do not look at NHL potential when selecting, so the two aren't really connected.
Sometimes you'll see a team opt to take a kid that doesn't project well to the NHL at all and ones that are bound struggle during their 16 and 17 year old years, but become OHL franchise players at 18, 19, and 20.
Catenacci going first overall is very much a mix of those two factors, rather than an indicator of his NHL prospects.
I know this is the Sabres board, but for clarity Ho-Sang was not ahead of McKeown (and supposedly would have reported to Kingston). Kingston passed on Ho-Sang due to his selfish personality and their need for a Doughty like defenceman. He should have went third.
I agree though with your overall point that being first overall for about half a dozen teams doesn't guarentee you the best (or even a top 5) player. And it's a catch 22, as usually the top players don't want to play for the 'bad' programs, which are the ones picking in the top 5.
When the team picking first overall is a northern city that has trouble getting kids to report (Soo), the relevance of going first overall lessened.
That type of thing is why Ryan O'Reilly was taken first overall by Erie ahead of Taylor Hall, why Josh Ho-Sang fell to fifth last year despite being the second best player in the draft, and why who I assume your namesake is fell to the 67's in his draft year.
It happens every year and is bound to happen this year again, even with the compensation system in place for first rounders.
Anyways, OHL teams do not look at NHL potential when selecting, so the two aren't really connected.
Sometimes you'll see a team opt to take a kid that doesn't project well to the NHL at all and ones that are bound struggle during their 16 and 17 year old years, but become OHL franchise players at 18, 19, and 20.
Catenacci going first overall is very much a mix of those two factors, rather than an indicator of his NHL prospects.
My last name actually, no relation
What you said does make sense though, so thanks for clearing that up.
Any chance Armia gets a shot at next year's Olympic team?
When Armia get his a-game on, he is the best wing from finland (overall Selanne may be better thou ). consistency is the issue. But it all depends how next season goes.
I think he has a good chance.
