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Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Jake Gardiner

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Old
02-18-2013, 12:36 PM
  #51
Anth93
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Originally Posted by Badger Mayhew View Post
Um...no. Carlyle played him up to 25 minutes a night last year when he took over.
I remember Carlyle once saying he's the only player that's showed up after a tough home stand.

Carlyle loves Gardiner.

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Old
02-18-2013, 12:38 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Anth93 View Post
This is one of my favorite anti-Leaf quotes I've read in some time.

You're suggesting the Leafs trade their outstanding sophomore dman for a 3rd liner, some player I've never heard of and a late first prospect a la Percy/Finn.

It's not about placing value on Gardiner that's similar to Niedermayer, it's more about how he played and skates like a young Niedermayer. His potential is through the roof.

A top 4 that could consist of Rielly and Gardiner? Count me in, he's going nowhere.
It's not anti-leaf... it's just facing the reality that Gardiner has a ways to go before he can even match his rookie play, let alone expound upon it.

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Old
02-18-2013, 12:41 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
It's not anti-leaf... it's just facing the reality that Gardiner has a ways to go before he can even match his rookie play, let alone expound upon it.
Oh it absolutely is. Why don't you trade Landeskog for Kulemin, Percy and Scrivens.

On second thought, he's not playing.. Leafs better not overpay.

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02-18-2013, 12:42 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Anth93 View Post
Oh it absolutely is. Why don't you trade Landeskog for Kulemin, Percy and Scrivens.

On second thought, he's not playing.. Leafs better not overpay.
Don't make this something it's not. But that would address zero needs for us. Meanwhile in this trade, the Leafs greatly improve their goaltending.

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02-18-2013, 12:49 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Don't make this something it's not. But that would address zero needs for us. Meanwhile in this trade, the Leafs greatly improve their goaltending.
There is no difference.

Leafs improve their goaltending? Brian Elliot couldn't play in the AHL at the rate he's going. Ben Scrivens has a .927/2.23 line through 7 games vs Elliot and his .849/3.57 line. IMPROVED GOALTENDING.

Leafs address zero needs with this one, or wait according to you they're getting excellent value. Strange.

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02-18-2013, 12:51 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Don't make this something it's not. But that would address zero needs for us. Meanwhile in this trade, the Leafs greatly improve their goaltending.
Did you just actually say that? Elliott is horrible. He's about to be placed on waivers he's been so bad. The guy doesnt even have an .850 save percentage. St Louis is scared to even play him right now.

It's hard to give a guy the benefit of a slow start or that he hasnt hit his groove yet when he's already on his third team and he was brutal with the other two. People are looking at that right now, a lot more than his limited success last year with Stl.

He's no Ron Tugnutt...

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02-18-2013, 12:52 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Anth93 View Post
There is no difference.

Leafs improve their goaltending? Brian Elliot couldn't play in the AHL at the rate he's going. Ben Scrivens has a .927/2.23 line through 7 games vs Elliot and his .849/3.57 line. IMPROVED GOALTENDING.

Leafs address zero needs with this one, or wait according to you they're getting excellent value. Strange.
Well if you want to apply such a narrow scope then absolutely you're right. The reality of it is that Elliott is slumping right now after a lockout . . . that'll happen for a goaltender. But last year, Elliott was spectacular no matter which way you want to downplay it. A 0.940 SV% with a 1.5X GAA? That's out of this world. If you don't buy at his low point, you can't afford him.

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Old
02-18-2013, 12:53 PM
  #58
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Depends what the leafs wanted....Unless they packaged, a similar prospect forward coming off a decent 1st campaign.

Henrique? I know he is hyped because of how well he looked....But id say value is similar.

Hagelin? another hyped, speedy player....

Read?

Just looking at value here....not where those 3 fit on our team.

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Old
02-18-2013, 12:58 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Well if you want to apply such a narrow scope then absolutely you're right. The reality of it is that Elliott is slumping right now after a lockout . . . that'll happen for a goaltender. But last year, Elliott was spectacular no matter which way you want to downplay it. A 0.940 SV% with a 1.5X GAA? That's out of this world. If you don't buy at his low point, you can't afford him.
Do you not remember when Colorado tried to pretend that Brian Elliot was an adequate starter? He may have been worse then than he is now. Which is really quite remarkable.

Anyways, I'd encourage you to go back to the other thread where you can defend a good player (ROR) and not an awful one in hopes of angering Leaf fans.

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02-18-2013, 01:07 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Anth93 View Post
Do you not remember when Colorado tried to pretend that Brian Elliot was an adequate starter? He may have been worse then than he is now. Which is really quite remarkable.

Anyways, I'd encourage you to go back to the other thread where you can defend a good player (ROR) and not an awful one in hopes of angering Leaf fans.
Well, agree to disagree. There was a lot to like about Elliott's time in Colorado, believe it or not. We'll just have to see how he responds, but I'm willing to bet he finishes pretty strong.

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Old
02-18-2013, 01:12 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Well, agree to disagree. There was a lot to like about Elliott's time in Colorado, believe it or not. We'll just have to see how he responds, but I'm willing to bet he finishes pretty strong.
I think you're confusing "a lot" of good with two wins..

Anyways, I disagree. I predict Jake Allen takes over and he goes on waivers soon.

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02-18-2013, 01:19 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Anth93 View Post
I think you're confusing "a lot" of good with two wins..

Anyways, I disagree. I predict Jake Allen takes over and he goes on waivers soon.
Right, because good play of one player is solely indicated by wins. I suppose not having seen any of those games, you don't have much to go on, but he showed some obvious talent. Not an easy task to undertake mid-tank.

It would be awful asset management to waive Elliott. They need his value to come up.

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Old
02-18-2013, 01:32 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Anth93 View Post
There is no difference.

Leafs improve their goaltending? Brian Elliot couldn't play in the AHL at the rate he's going. Ben Scrivens has a .927/2.23 line through 7 games vs Elliot and his .849/3.57 line. IMPROVED GOALTENDING.

Leafs address zero needs with this one, or wait according to you they're getting excellent value. Strange.
Chris Stewart 6 goals in 15 games
Phil Kessel 2 goals in 15 games

Chris Stewart is a better player than Phil Kessel because he's more aggressive, has a better defensive game and is a better goal scorer. (We're forgetting last year, right?)

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02-18-2013, 01:35 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
I think that St. Louis deal is an overpayment considering Gardiner had a concussion and still isn't back in the NHL. Toronto fans value Gardiner like he's Niedermayer, but the reality of it is he isn't even playing in the NHL right now.
You can't be serious....

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Old
02-18-2013, 01:36 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by stlblues9 View Post
Chris Stewart 6 goals in 15 games
Phil Kessel 2 goals in 15 games

Chris Stewart is a better player than Phil Kessel because he's more aggressive, has a better defensive game and is a better goal scorer. (We're forgetting last year, right?)
Lol sure buddddd

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02-18-2013, 01:40 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Well if you want to apply such a narrow scope then absolutely you're right. The reality of it is that Elliott is slumping right now after a lockout . . . that'll happen for a goaltender. But last year, Elliott was spectacular no matter which way you want to downplay it. A 0.940 SV% with a 1.5X GAA? That's out of this world. If you don't buy at his low point, you can't afford him.
Quote:
...we can see that randomness becomes less of an issue with a young goalie once they've posted an even strength save percentage around .930 for about 2000 shots. In fact at 2388 shots, where Reimer is at, we can say the probability that he as at least an AVERAGE NHL goalie with about 97.5% certainty.
From Mr. Steve Burtch over at PPP. We don't need another goalie.

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02-18-2013, 01:46 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
Lol sure buddddd
He has a good point. You cannot simply look at this year to evaluate a player. You have to look at previous years as well. Leaf fans simply seem to be looking at Elliot's performance this year, while entirely ignoring last year.


What stlblues9 did is do the same thing for Kessel/Stewart. Ignore last year, look at this year. Look how ridiculous it looks. That is what Leaf fans look like doing that for Elliot.

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02-18-2013, 01:47 PM
  #68
Anth93
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Originally Posted by Crisp Breakout View Post
Right, because good play of one player is solely indicated by wins. I suppose not having seen any of those games, you don't have much to go on, but he showed some obvious talent. Not an easy task to undertake mid-tank.

It would be awful asset management to waive Elliott. They need his value to come up.
I don't get it, you actually think people only look at wins? Elliott's numbers were absolutely horrendous when with the Avalanche. What could be good other than those two wins?

Bad asset management would be to play an awful goaltender when there are capable replacements. Good asset management would be to get rid of the awful goaltender.

Jonathan Cheechoo was once given the benefit of the doubt because he couldn't replicate his 50 goals from the year before.. "SURELY HE'LL BOUNCE BACK. BETTER HANG ON TO HIM"
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Originally Posted by stlblues9 View Post
Chris Stewart 6 goals in 15 games
Phil Kessel 2 goals in 15 games

Chris Stewart is a better player than Phil Kessel because he's more aggressive, has a better defensive game and is a better goal scorer. (We're forgetting last year, right?)
Wait what is this and where are you coming from?

Thanks for telling me something that is completely unrelated to this thread. You're obviously wrong by the way.

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02-18-2013, 01:49 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Avs44 View Post
He has a good point. You cannot simply look at this year to evaluate a player. You have to look at previous years as well. Leaf fans simply seem to be looking at Elliot's performance this year, while entirely ignoring last year.


What stlblues9 did is do the same thing for Kessel/Stewart. Ignore last year, look at this year. Look how ridiculous it looks. That is what Leaf fans look like doing that for Elliot.
Phil Kessel vs Brian Elliott.

Moving on......

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02-18-2013, 01:53 PM
  #70
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Gardiner would be playing in the NHL but you know, Mike Kostka took his spot and minutes and is never giving them back

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02-18-2013, 01:53 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Anth93 View Post
Phil Kessel vs Brian Elliott.

Moving on......
That was not his point at all.


I'm sorry you could not understand it.

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02-18-2013, 01:54 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Avs44 View Post
He has a good point. You cannot simply look at this year to evaluate a player. You have to look at previous years as well. Leaf fans simply seem to be looking at Elliot's performance this year, while entirely ignoring last year.


What stlblues9 did is do the same thing for Kessel/Stewart. Ignore last year, look at this year. Look how ridiculous it looks. That is what Leaf fans look like doing that for Elliot.
There's a big difference though. Kessel has done it throughout his career so far. Elliot has really had ONE good year. Something that we've seen all to often with goaltenders in the league.

The analogy just doesnt hold merit. Especially considering Elliot didnt even play 40 games last year. At best Elliot will settle into a backup role in this league with a ceiling of starting in his early 30s. The way he's looked this year and in several other stretches in his career, he'd have a tough time playing in the AHL right now.

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02-18-2013, 01:56 PM
  #73
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That was not his point at all.


I'm sorry you could not understand it.
lol.

All you can do is laugh..

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02-18-2013, 01:56 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Petes2424 View Post
There's a big difference though. Kessel has done it throughout his career so far. Elliot has really had ONE good year. Something that we've seen all to often with goaltenders in the league.

The analogy just doesnt hold merit. Especially considering Elliot didnt even play 40 games last year. At best Elliot will settle into a backup role in this league with a ceiling of starting in his early 30s. The way he's looked this year and in several other stretches in his career, he'd have a tough time playing in the AHL right now.
Elliott had one good year and Gardiner had one good year. And Elliott's year was way more stellar than the one of Gardiner. So where is the problem? And you also get Schmaltz (recent 1st rnd pick) and a great 3rd liner in D'Agostino.
Leafs fans

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02-18-2013, 01:57 PM
  #75
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Cody McLeod + David Van der Gulik?

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