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Bylsma/coaching staff discussion thread II

View Poll Results: So can Bylsma still lead them to the promised land?
Sure why not, Bylsma’s system is fine. The team will win another cup with him 40 33.33%
Nah, Bylsma has a better chance of winning dancing with the stars than another cup 80 66.67%
Voters: 120. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-18-2013, 12:00 PM
  #101
UnderratedBrooks44
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If Sutter gets hurt, who does everyone thing automatically steps into the role of third line center?
I'm guessing Jeffrey, what about it?

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02-18-2013, 12:04 PM
  #102
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I'm guessing Jeffrey, what about it?
Just helping you make your point.

There's no room for him as the team is currently constructed, and it was even worse when Staal was here.

But because he played "well" in one game with Geno and Neal (ironically, in the team's worse performance of the season) then he's being mishandled for not continuing to get a shot.

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02-18-2013, 12:12 PM
  #103
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Just helping you make your point.

There's no room for him as the team is currently constructed, and it was even worse when Staal was here.

But because he played "well" in one game with Geno and Neal (ironically, in the team's worse performance of the season) then he's being mishandled for not continuing to get a shot.
Yeah I have a big problem with this rhetoric about Bylsma mishandling rookies, and again I don't even like the guy. It's all because of Strait's quote, which I take with a grain if salt. Overreaction to athlete's quotes when they're just trying to come up with **** to say and get out of the interview is so overrated. He was afraid to make a mistake because the Penguins had a lot of Dmen and he didn't know when he'd get in the lineup next for that same reason. Tangradi was afraid to make a mistake because there was pressure on him. That's fine dude. Go to the Jets where there's no pressure to perform. All that doesn't mean it's Bylsma's fault though.

Shero mistakenly kept Lovejoy over Strait and Tangradi sucks. That's all this is.

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02-18-2013, 12:29 PM
  #104
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Just helping you make your point.

There's no room for him as the team is currently constructed, and it was even worse when Staal was here.

But because he played "well" in one game with Geno and Neal (ironically, in the team's worse performance of the season) then he's being mishandled for not continuing to get a shot.
I think he should be in over TK, not on Geno's LW. And Jeffrey has a lot more good games here than just one this season. He was a solid player for us when Sid and Geno were out until he went out himself.

as a whole though, you are right. Bylsma is getting way too much criticism here.

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02-18-2013, 12:55 PM
  #105
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Yeah I have a big problem with this rhetoric about Bylsma mishandling rookies, and again I don't even like the guy. It's all because of Strait's quote, which I take with a grain if salt. Overreaction to athlete's quotes when they're just trying to come up with **** to say and get out of the interview is so overrated. He was afraid to make a mistake because the Penguins had a lot of Dmen and he didn't know when he'd get in the lineup next for that same reason. Tangradi was afraid to make a mistake because there was pressure on him. That's fine dude. Go to the Jets where there's no pressure to perform. All that doesn't mean it's Bylsma's fault though.

Shero mistakenly kept Lovejoy over Strait and Tangradi sucks. That's all this is.
That's a cut and paste answer for rookies or depth guys who go to teams lower on the totem pole. The Kings released a D-man (forgot his name) recently and he essentially said the same thing when he was picked up by the Islanders.

Bylsma has his share of faults that even a backer like myself has with him, but what I don't like is taking valid points like an over reliance on the stretch pass - and applying them to literally everything else that's wrong with the team.

I've repeated it over and over again, but I'll do it one more time: When the Penguins jettison a player, whether rookie or vet, and he goes on to flourish elsewhere, then I'll listen. Until that day comes, it's nothing but white noise.

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02-18-2013, 01:01 PM
  #106
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I think he should be in over TK, not on Geno's LW. And Jeffrey has a lot more good games here than just one this season. He was a solid player for us when Sid and Geno were out until he went out himself.

as a whole though, you are right. Bylsma is getting way too much criticism here.
It's just that every single one of our prospects has a fatal flaw.

Tangradi for example. Big guy but not a great skater? Fine, show me some hands. Your hands are average? Run someone over on the forecheck. No? Show me SOMETHING other than an average NHL play that I should slobber over. Yeah, he didn't get a ton of ice time, but even Craig Adams finds the net once in a while by accident.

Jeffrey's a center, but we have more than enough of those. Moving him to wing is a fine idea, until you realize he doesn't have the size or the skating ability to do well there for any extended period of time.

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02-18-2013, 01:07 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
Yeah I have a big problem with this rhetoric about Bylsma mishandling rookies, and again I don't even like the guy. It's all because of Strait's quote, which I take with a grain if salt. Overreaction to athlete's quotes when they're just trying to come up with **** to say and get out of the interview is so overrated. He was afraid to make a mistake because the Penguins had a lot of Dmen and he didn't know when he'd get in the lineup next for that same reason. Tangradi was afraid to make a mistake because there was pressure on him. That's fine dude. Go to the Jets where there's no pressure to perform. All that doesn't mean it's Bylsma's fault though.

Shero mistakenly kept Lovejoy over Strait and Tangradi sucks. That's all this is.
Total agreement with the first paragraph.

As far as taking Lovejoy over Strait, it's a gamble that makes sense. Lovejoy has been around figuratively forever, I think they were comfortable with him as a 7/8 guy and didn't want to lose him for anything.

Strait, of the three bubble defensemen (Lovejoy, Bortuzzo) was the most likely to clear waivers. Strait didn't have Bortuzzo's size or Lovejoy's experience. Strait is also older than Bort and not as good of a skater as Lovejoy.

That and no trades were being made around waiver time for fringe players. Shero held on to Lovejoy, but he turned that into a 5th round pick. It's highly doubtful 10-15 games into the season he would turn Strait into even a 5th round pick.

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02-18-2013, 01:15 PM
  #108
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DB is doing fine and its important to have continuity. Like I keep saying, fans turn on every coach, so any new coach has his honeymoon period, then he starts getting criticized. I'd rather see DB work on his weaknesses and grow as a coach, than start over. I still have faith in him, even though I hate his biased attitude towards vets.

People are seeing with BB that these kids don't come in and set the world on fire. It isn't a coincidence Tangradi's best two games as a pro were as a Jet, where he is getting legit third line minutes. It isn't a difficult concept to grasp, but bitter fans would rather rip on a prospect than accept you have to be patient.

We'll see how BB, Despres and Bort develop under DB. I want to give him credit if they develop and will gladly do so, but for now I don't like what he is doing. This goes beyond benching rookies who don't deserve it... It is his lack of trust in these guys that pisses me off.

When injuries hit, Bort and Despres got a lot of minutes, even PK and PP time and they added an element the team lacked for yrs. They made mistakes, but their play was overall positive and they played well. Now they are being benched/having their minutes cut, etc.

DB needs to start trusting these guys so they can develop and be ready for the playoffs. They have several more rookies who could make the jump next season. At some point you have to play these guys and accept you will have a couple rookies on your blueline. With so many in the pipeline, it is inevitable.

I honestly would rather have Bort and Despres in the lineup come playoff time than Nisky. I think Nisky doesn't bring the size or physical edge these two have... I also suspect Nisky may wear down in a physical series/as the team gets deeper into the playoffs.

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02-18-2013, 01:41 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
DB is doing fine and its important to have continuity. Like I keep saying, fans turn on every coach, so any new coach has his honeymoon period, then he starts getting criticized. I'd rather see DB work on his weaknesses and grow as a coach, than start over. I still have faith in him, even though I hate his biased attitude towards vets.

People are seeing with BB that these kids don't come in and set the world on fire. It isn't a coincidence Tangradi's best two games as a pro were as a Jet, where he is getting legit third line minutes. It isn't a difficult concept to grasp, but bitter fans would rather rip on a prospect than accept you have to be patient.

We'll see how BB, Despres and Bort develop under DB. I want to give him credit if they develop and will gladly do so, but for now I don't like what he is doing. This goes beyond benching rookies who don't deserve it... It is his lack of trust in these guys that pisses me off.

When injuries hit, Bort and Despres got a lot of minutes, even PK and PP time and they added an element the team lacked for yrs. They made mistakes, but their play was overall positive and they played well. Now they are being benched/having their minutes cut, etc.

DB needs to start trusting these guys so they can develop and be ready for the playoffs. They have several more rookies who could make the jump next season. At some point you have to play these guys and accept you will have a couple rookies on your blueline. With so many in the pipeline, it is inevitable.

I honestly would rather have Bort and Despres in the lineup come playoff time than Nisky. I think Nisky doesn't bring the size or physical edge these two have... I also suspect Nisky may wear down in a physical series/as the team gets deeper into the playoffs.
jiggy
you probably forgot more about hockey this morning than I will ever know (to use this cliche) but I am really curios how you figure this out. I really really like Niskanen, I watch him closely. The big concern on him what Kirk brought up first having watch him in Dallas, was that he got scared after gets hit, starts hearing footsteps, that still is a little bit true but I watch him and I see guy who gets to the puck fast who escapes majority of forechecks, who plays smart with the stick, who has high IQ with the puck, who is confident to pinch in on the blue line (which is what we desperatly need), who can put the puck on the net....I see all of that and somehow there is this stigma he is not good for playoffs, based on what? last year? if that's the case I don't want to see Orpik on the team comes play off cause he stunk not just last year but year before too, how about Martin, Engo? None of these I would rather have than Niskanen.

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02-18-2013, 02:04 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
DB is doing fine and its important to have continuity. Like I keep saying, fans turn on every coach, so any new coach has his honeymoon period, then he starts getting criticized. I'd rather see DB work on his weaknesses and grow as a coach, than start over. I still have faith in him, even though I hate his biased attitude towards vets.

People are seeing with BB that these kids don't come in and set the world on fire. It isn't a coincidence Tangradi's best two games as a pro were as a Jet, where he is getting legit third line minutes. It isn't a difficult concept to grasp, but bitter fans would rather rip on a prospect than accept you have to be patient.

We'll see how BB, Despres and Bort develop under DB. I want to give him credit if they develop and will gladly do so, but for now I don't like what he is doing. This goes beyond benching rookies who don't deserve it... It is his lack of trust in these guys that pisses me off.

When injuries hit, Bort and Despres got a lot of minutes, even PK and PP time and they added an element the team lacked for yrs. They made mistakes, but their play was overall positive and they played well. Now they are being benched/having their minutes cut, etc.

DB needs to start trusting these guys so they can develop and be ready for the playoffs. They have several more rookies who could make the jump next season. At some point you have to play these guys and accept you will have a couple rookies on your blueline. With so many in the pipeline, it is inevitable.

I honestly would rather have Bort and Despres in the lineup come playoff time than Nisky. I think Nisky doesn't bring the size or physical edge these two have... I also suspect Nisky may wear down in a physical series/as the team gets deeper into the playoffs.
I see Bennett do a thing or two though. He and Tangradi have had roughly the same impact on games so far, but I see Bennett come up the ice in stride with the attack. I see the puck come to him at a time he needs to immediately make a good decision with it, and he does. It's not much, but you I can see a player that has a chance at being legit at this level. Maybe not great, but a decent producer. Other than Tangradi's size I didn't see anything of not or anything that might grow. That goes for his entire time here, not just this season. That's just what I see. Bennett is really raw but I don't have to squint to see he has some kind of chance to make it. All players are treated differently because they're not all the same, i.e. how Bennett is treated compared to Tangradi.

I don't see how Despres/Bort are being punished. They rotated Bort in yesterday to get him in the mix, that's all I saw. Maybe you meant something else. As for Niskanen, I don't see what makes either rookie decidedly better than him. Other than Despres' high end plays he can make, which are offset by his deficiences like turning the puck over, I just don't see it personally.

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02-18-2013, 02:06 PM
  #111
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People are seeing with BB that these kids don't come in and set the world on fire. It isn't a coincidence Tangradi's best two games as a pro were as a Jet, where he is getting legit third line minutes. It isn't a difficult concept to grasp, but bitter fans would rather rip on a prospect than accept you have to be patient.
So had Tangradi simply been on the third line, where Cooke and Kennedy have struggled mightily to produce this season, he would have figured everything out? I don't buy that for a second.

The team was patient with him. 45 games with one flukey goal and a handful of scoring chances. If you're going to give much more rope than that to young players who have shown you nothing you're setting an absurd precedent that every rookie with some semblance of talent or pedigree should get a full season with consistent minutes to show their worth. Even the Islanders and Bluejackets aren't that generous in handing out opportunities.

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02-18-2013, 02:09 PM
  #112
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jiggy
you probably forgot more about hockey this morning than I will ever know (to use this cliche) but I am really curios how you figure this out. I really really like Niskanen, I watch him closely. The big concern on him what Kirk brought up first having watch him in Dallas, was that he got scared after gets hit, starts hearing footsteps, that still is a little bit true but I watch him and I see guy who gets to the puck fast who escapes majority of forechecks, who plays smart with the stick, who has high IQ with the puck, who is confident to pinch in on the blue line (which is what we desperatly need), who can put the puck on the net....I see all of that and somehow there is this stigma he is not good for playoffs, based on what? last year? if that's the case I don't want to see Orpik on the team comes play off cause he stunk not just last year but year before too, how about Martin, Engo? None of these I would rather have than Niskanen.
It is just a feeling I have about Nisky. It isn't so much Nisky, but Martin as well. I think Martin is a better blueliner, which is why I stood in his corner this Summer. I am just not comfortable with two guys who are similar in physical play and demeanor on the ice like Nisky and Martin. However, I prefer Martin over Nisky.

The hit the other day on Nisky early in the period shook him up pretty bad and he didn't look comfortable on the ice after that. I just have a bad feeling about him when a fierce forecheck is bearing down on this team over a seven game series. The Flyers forecheck in the playoffs wasn't nearly as punishing as the Rangers, Devils, Kings, etc.

I just prefer big, physical guys like Despres and Bort who will get in guys faces and get under their skin all series long, especially Bort and we have seen the difference maker Despres can be. Nisky is just a steady, less talented Paul Martin clone.

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02-18-2013, 02:20 PM
  #113
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I see Bennett do a thing or two though. He and Tangradi have had roughly the same impact on games so far, but I see Bennett come up the ice in stride with the attack. I see the puck come to him at a time he needs to immediately make a good decision with it, and he does. It's not much, but you I can see a player that has a chance at being legit at this level. Maybe not great, but a decent producer. Other than Tangradi's size I didn't see anything of not or anything that might grow. That goes for his entire time here, not just this season. That's just what I see. Bennett is really raw but I don't have to squint to see he has some kind of chance to make it. All players are treated differently because they're not all the same, i.e. how Bennett is treated compared to Tangradi.
Aside from being responsible on the ice, BB isn't doing anything special. Tangradi had a really nice power move where he wrapped the puck around the net once to like BB. BB is flubbing passes, fanning on shots, and basically doing nothing to remotely suggest he is an elite offensive talent yet.

Somehow people are seeing things that aren't there yet, but by the same token equally tearing down Tangradi. Tangradi has looked better in his two games with the Jets than BB has. I think BB is the much better prospect, but people are really grasping at straws to find something here with BB's play.

Neither of these two guys will magically get better without consistent minutes. I keep saying it, but relatively few people truly grasp it. We already have some people wanting BB sent back. It's ****ing tiresome how impatient people are and to endlessly cite Tangradi's amount of games played as a legit chance without looking at his TOI.

Both guys are getting legit shots now. Lets see what happens, good or bad.

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I don't see how Despres/Bort are being punished. They rotated Bort in yesterday to get him in the mix, that's all I saw. Maybe you meant something else. As for Niskanen, I don't see what makes either rookie decidedly better than him. Other than Despres' high end plays he can make, which are offset by his deficiences like turning the puck over, I just don't see it personally.
When both are playing, DB is cutting their ice time dramatically now. These guys showed they could help you win, why reduce them to 8-10 mins and wear out your top four? It is just a bad all around idea.

Nisky is a decent top four guy, but he is being built up way too much around here.

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02-18-2013, 02:32 PM
  #114
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So had Tangradi simply been on the third line, where Cooke and Kennedy have struggled mightily to produce this season, he would have figured everything out? I don't buy that for a second.

The team was patient with him. 45 games with one flukey goal and a handful of scoring chances. If you're going to give much more rope than that to young players who have shown you nothing you're setting an absurd precedent that every rookie with some semblance of talent or pedigree should get a full season with consistent minutes to show their worth. Even the Islanders and Bluejackets aren't that generous in handing out opportunities.
You continue to spew the same garbage as others about his "legit" shot.

Find me an 8-10 game stretch where he played over 12-14 mins a night like Boychuk.

MB already did the leg work and I can tell you it never happened. He never even had an eight game stretch on just the fourth line. You can't build momentum and confidence without consistent, rolled over minutes from game to game.

Tangradi is gone, so at this point it's done. However, DB has three rookies with potential on the team right now that he better learn to be patient with. There is going to be a number of talented rookies coming through the system over the next few yrs and this team is relying on their development.

So DB better start learning how to implement them now and trust them, because this org can't afford to **** up anyone else.

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02-18-2013, 02:39 PM
  #115
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Aside from being responsible on the ice, BB isn't doing anything special. Tangradi had a really nice power move where he wrapped the puck around the net once to like BB. BB is flubbing passes, fanning on shots, and basically doing nothing to remotely suggest he is an elite offensive talent yet.

Somehow people are seeing things that aren't there yet, but by the same token equally tearing down Tangradi. Tangradi has looked better in his two games with the Jets than BB has. I think BB is the much better prospect, but people are really grasping at straws to find something here with BB's play.

Neither of these two guys will magically get better without consistent minutes. I keep saying it, but relatively few people truly grasp it. We already have some people wanting BB sent back. It's ****ing tiresome how impatient people are and to endlessly cite Tangradi's amount of games played as a legit chance without looking at his TOI.

Both guys are getting legit shots now. Lets see what happens, good or bad.



When both are playing, DB is cutting their ice time dramatically now. These guys showed they could help you win, why reduce them to 8-10 mins and wear out your top four? It is just a bad all around idea.

Nisky is a decent top four guy, but he is being built up way too much around here.
This is Bennett's first go round with the big club. Tangradi's has passed and he hadn't made any improvements in my opinion, and obviously the organization agrees. We can call a draw on making mountains out of mole hills as far as each guy's talent, but it's much earlier for Bennett than it is Tangradi. If Bennett gets sent down I have no problem with it being because he didn't look enough like he belonged, but he still has two more cracks at it until it's time to wonder if he has it at all.

I never gushed over Nisky and I'm not sold on him in the top 4 anyways, so I hear you there. I think it's worth mentioning that guys magically seem to look solid as a rock when they play with Letang. When Niskanen was bumped up to the top 4 in the past because of injury, I wasn't impressed. I guess if he does play with Letang then what's the difference, but when speaking of Niskanen himself I don't think I'd prefer him in the top 4.

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02-18-2013, 02:48 PM
  #116
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You continue to spew the same garbage as others about his "legit" shot.

Find me an 8-10 game stretch where he played over 12-14 mins a night like Boychuk.
Boychuk looked better in his first game than Tangradi had in any game he's ever played as a Penguin, which is much more of an indictment on Tangradi's play than it is an endorsement of Boychuks. You seem to want to brush that aside because it clashes with your agenda. Not my problem.

Quote:
Tangradi is gone, so at this point it's done. However, DB has three rookies with potential on the team right now that he better learn to be patient with. There is going to be a number of talented rookies coming through the system over the next few yrs and this team is relying on their development.

So DB better start learning how to implement them now and trust them, because this org can't afford to **** up anyone else.
This organization didn't **** up Tangradi, he just sucked and couldn't earn a spot in a lineup that he should have his name penciled in the top 9 for if he was anywhere near as talented as we were lead to believe.

Teams everywhere have prospects just like Tangradi who don't get anywhere near the opportunity that he got. This is the NHL. You aren't often handed opportunities, and when you are, you damn well better take advantage of them if you want to stick. Tangradi didn't, and now he's gone. Boychuk will likely soon follow. That's how it goes when you're playing at the highest level of a sport.

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02-18-2013, 02:51 PM
  #117
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02-18-2013, 02:53 PM
  #118
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This is Bennett's first go round with the big club. Tangradi's has passed and he hadn't made any improvements in my opinion, and obviously the organization agrees. We can call a draw on making mountains out of mole hills as far as each guy's talent, but it's much earlier for Bennett than it is Tangradi. If Bennett gets sent down I have no problem with it being because he didn't look enough like he belonged, but he still has two more cracks at it until it's time to wonder if he has it at all.

I never gushed over Nisky and I'm not sold on him in the top 4 anyways, so I hear you there. I think it's worth mentioning that guys magically seem to look solid as a rock when they play with Letang. When Niskanen was bumped up to the top 4 in the past because of injury, I wasn't impressed. I guess if he does play with Letang then what's the difference, but when speaking of Niskanen himself I don't think I'd prefer him in the top 4.
It's basically the same **** around here...

Tangradi came up and people gushed over him, even though he looked as ordinary as BB has. It was the same with Caputi as well. After awhile, people grow impatient, then turn on guys. It isn't just Pens fans, as I tried to tell Leafs fans to be patient with Kadri and that Wilson was mishandling him. So many fans overrate prospects, turn on them way too early, etc.

BB is the next great hope around here and I really don't want to see the stupidity that happens when people realize it is going to take months or longer of consistent ice time before he even begins to look comfortable. If DB even lets that happen.

Tangradi is gone, but DB continues to bench rookies and cut their minutes for no reason. With all of the talent heading for the big club over the next several seasons, I'm worried about DB botching the development of these kids.

If I see him develop BB, Bort and Despres, then I will give him his dues and worry less. Until I see it, and he keeps benching/cutting their ice time, I am going to question him.

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02-18-2013, 02:55 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Mr Jiggyfly View Post
When both are playing, DB is cutting their ice time dramatically now. These guys showed they could help you win, why reduce them to 8-10 mins and wear out your top four? It is just a bad all around idea.

Nisky is a decent top four guy, but he is being built up way too much around here.
When 2 of our top 4 were out, we lost our last two games. Since they've come back and the rookies' minutes were reduced, we've won 3 in a row.

Maybe it's because we were playing Jersey. But maybe giving top 4 minutes to our top 4 defensemen has played a part in returning to our winning ways.

I think we might be building up our rookies too much around here. Let them earn trust over time. DB has gone out of his way to make a spot for Despres AND gone out of his way to rotate Bort in to get some time - they're clearly priorities. We don't need to be giving them 15 minutes a night right off the hop to bring them along.

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02-18-2013, 03:00 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
When 2 of our top 4 were out, we lost our last two games. Since they've come back and the rookies' minutes were reduced, we've won 3 in a row.

Maybe it's because we were playing Jersey. But maybe giving top 4 minutes to our top 4 defensemen has played a part in returning to our winning ways.

I think we might be building up our rookies too much around here. Let them earn trust over time. DB has gone out of his way to make a spot for Despres AND gone out of his way to rotate Bort in to get some time - they're clearly priorities. We don't need to be giving them 15 minutes a night right off the hop to bring them along.
That's driving me nuttier than the rest of it.

Despres and Bort are full of warts, and it seems that their plentiful mistakes are glossed over for every time they make a good play.

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02-18-2013, 03:03 PM
  #121
IcedCapp
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
When 2 of our top 4 were out, we lost our last two games. Since they've come back and the rookies' minutes were reduced, we've won 3 in a row.

Maybe it's because we were playing Jersey. But maybe giving top 4 minutes to our top 4 defensemen has played a part in returning to our winning ways.

I think we might be building up our rookies too much around here. Let them earn trust over time. DB has gone out of his way to make a spot for Despres AND gone out of his way to rotate Bort in to get some time - they're clearly priorities. We don't need to be giving them 15 minutes a night right off the hop to bring them along.
I don't think that's quite fair. Who were the top-4 during the 5-game winning streak, when the Pens played some of their best hockey?

The two losses to the devils had very little to do with who the top-4 D were.

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02-18-2013, 03:13 PM
  #122
Mr Jiggyfly
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Originally Posted by Malkin4Top6Wingerz View Post
Boychuk looked better in his first game than Tangradi had in any game he's ever played as a Penguin, which is much more of an indictment on Tangradi's play than it is an endorsement of Boychuks. You seem to want to brush that aside because it clashes with your agenda. Not my problem.
At least Boychuk got rolled minutes for all of his games. Giving a guy six random shifts over 2-3 games is not a legit shot.

Who exactly has looked good on the second line? Last time I checked all the other guys who swung onto that line didn't get a point or light **** up and they all had regular shifts to prove something. Of course when Jeffrey did well he got benched to. He sucks also.

Just because you got your hopes up Tangradi was the second coming of Stevens and had to be the "answer" right now, isn't my problem either boss.

Quote:
This organization didn't **** up Tangradi, he just sucked and couldn't earn a spot in a lineup that he should have his name penciled in the top 9 for if he was anywhere near as talented as we were lead to believe.

Teams everywhere have prospects just like Tangradi who don't get anywhere near the opportunity that he got. This is the NHL. You aren't often handed opportunities, and when you are, you damn well better take advantage of them if you want to stick. Tangradi didn't, and now he's gone. Boychuk will likely soon follow. That's how it goes when you're playing at the highest level of a sport.
He did earn a spot in the lineup, but DB decided last season and this season to give his minutes to waiver wire fodder and washed up vets.

DB made up his mind about Tangradi a long time ago and didn't want him on the team. Those are impossible odds for any rookie to overcome. At least he is away from DB now and the ridiculous venom of fans who expected too much.

Now it is starting all over with BB... The high expectations... People seeing stuff that isn't there... I give it a month before people start turning on him if he doesn't adjust quickly enough for people's liking.

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02-18-2013, 03:14 PM
  #123
Jag68Sid87
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Originally Posted by MtlPenFan View Post
That's driving me nuttier than the rest of it.

Despres and Bort are full of warts, and it seems that their plentiful mistakes are glossed over for every time they make a good play.
Why are they the only ones who cannot afford to make any mistakes, though? Why do all vets get a free pass with Bylsma? This isn't 2010. We're not the defending champs. Why does Disco still coach like we are?

I want more accountability across the board. Including guys who won the Cup here, including 10-year vets, including guys who embody this team's north-south game.

Everybody should be accountable, not just the most recent Pens.

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02-18-2013, 03:15 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by IcedCapp View Post
I don't think that's quite fair. Who were the top-4 during the 5-game winning streak, when the Pens played some of their best hockey?

The two losses to the devils had very little to do with who the top-4 D were.
I'm not saying Despres and Bort haven't made contributions to wins - they're both good, promising young players. I just think that they got exposed a bit vs. Jersey and we could've fared better with more composure and experience on the back end.

They'll get their chances as the season progresses. But we're rolling along quite well right now, and Niskanen is a big part of that.

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02-18-2013, 03:24 PM
  #125
Mr Jiggyfly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
When 2 of our top 4 were out, we lost our last two games. Since they've come back and the rookies' minutes were reduced, we've won 3 in a row.

Maybe it's because we were playing Jersey. But maybe giving top 4 minutes to our top 4 defensemen has played a part in returning to our winning ways.

I think we might be building up our rookies too much around here. Let them earn trust over time. DB has gone out of his way to make a spot for Despres AND gone out of his way to rotate Bort in to get some time - they're clearly priorities. We don't need to be giving them 15 minutes a night right off the hop to bring them along.
So we are ignoring who was playing when they won five in a row?

Cool.

Rotating them in and out is fine. Reducing them to 8-10 mins is not only going to hamper their development, but wear out your top four.

You can't keep giving your top four big minutes over a shortened season and not expect injuries, fatigue, etc.

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