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Old
02-18-2013, 04:19 PM
  #26
Captain Hook
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^ He is more of a sniper obviously but I'm pretty sure Neal usually gets a fairly even number of assists and goals. The only reason he hasn't this season is because Malkin only has 3 goals and the revolving door at LW on that line probably has a combined zero.

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Old
02-18-2013, 04:24 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Honour Over Glory View Post
Granato likened it to Joe Sakic's release. Which, if you have seen any of Neal the last season and a half, is pretty dead on. The release is just insane. People saying he's benefiting from Malkin need to watch this season where Malkin has been off his game for most of the season while Neal is still trucking along on his 30+ goal pace.
Yeah, not to mention the beginning of last season, where Malkin was still rusty and Neal was scoring goals at the same pace and leading the team in points. He was carrying the Pens' offense until Malkin broke out in mid-December.

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Old
02-18-2013, 04:34 PM
  #28
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With the Penguins, people like to give all the credit to Malkin & Crosby, which I guess wouldn't be that wrong most of the time, but in regards to Neal, it's so off base if people think he's a product of Malkin.

Those people likely saw a game or two and based their entire opinion about him off that.

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Old
02-18-2013, 05:12 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Honour Over Glory View Post
With the Penguins, people like to give all the credit to Malkin & Crosby, which I guess wouldn't be that wrong most of the time, but in regards to Neal, it's so off base if people think he's a product of Malkin.

Those people likely saw a game or two and based their entire opinion about him off that.
Being a Stars fan and seeing Neal play both in Dallas and later in Pittsburgh, I do believe that he is a product of Malkin, but it's not a matter of Malkin carrying him; they've just had some great chemistry that's allowed them to thrive. Neal is a great player, but without the chemistry between the two of them he would just be a good player.

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Old
02-18-2013, 05:22 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
IMO on the Habs, he'd be a young 50-60 pt scoring winger, something we could use. Not quite a valuable to the Habs as Max Pacioretty, but close.
Lol. . . "The Real Deal" is clearly a better player than "Patches", whether on the Habs or not. Let's not get too silly here.

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Old
02-18-2013, 08:00 PM
  #31
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I think Malkin is why he got 41 assists, not why he got 40 goals.

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Old
02-18-2013, 08:18 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Honour Over Glory View Post
Stars fans, this isn't the same player you had, he's evolved a lot since he joined the Pens. Which is all you can ask for. And yes, his value to the Pens is way higher than it is to any other team, but then again, a 25yr old that has been a consistent 20 goal scorer that has scored 40 on a very good long term contract might have a decent value as well.
Any Stars fan that watched him could tell that the guy could get 35+ goals year in year out. He had an unreal release then and still does now. I'd assume to any contending team he is a piece they would desire and has a high value league-wide.

Doubt Pittsburgh considers trading him.

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Old
02-18-2013, 08:26 PM
  #33
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David Booth, Zach Kassian, 1st rounder

For

James Neal

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Old
02-18-2013, 08:30 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by ohnoeszz View Post
David Booth, Zach Kassian, 1st rounder

For

James Neal
ehh... no thanks

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Old
02-18-2013, 08:36 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Halberstram View Post
Lol. . . "The Real Deal" is clearly a better player than "Patches", whether on the Habs or not. Let's not get too silly here.
Neal's best non-Malkin season is 55pts. He had centers like Richards and Ribeiro. Pacioretty had 65 with Desharnais as his center.

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Old
02-18-2013, 08:40 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Neal's best non-Malkin season is 55pts. He had centers like Richards and Ribeiro. Pacioretty had 65 with Desharnais as his center.
yeah and Neal was 22 when he did that and scored 27 goals. Sure Malkin has helped him a ton but assuming he couldn't make the jump to become a 30+ goal scorer without Malkin is stupid. He also only had 2 PP goals that year. He's getting a lot more PP time and as we've seen, he is a monster on the PP. He was mostly second unit in Dallas, I believe. Stars fans are welcome to correct me on that though.

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Old
02-18-2013, 08:47 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by DoctrSteveBrule View Post
yeah and Neal was 22 when he did that and scored 27 goals. Sure Malkin has helped him a ton but assuming he couldn't make the jump to become a 30+ goal scorer without Malkin is stupid. He also only had 2 PP goals that year. He's getting a lot more PP time and as we've seen, he is a monster on the PP. He was mostly second unit in Dallas, I believe. Stars fans are welcome to correct me on that though.
Both good talents. That's all I'm saying. Yes, I think Paciorettys numbers would be in line with Neal if he was playing with a center like Malkin, rather than Desharnais.

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Old
02-18-2013, 09:27 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Neal's best non-Malkin season is 55pts. He had centers like Richards and Ribeiro. Pacioretty had 65 with Desharnais as his center.
One year. . . Congrats.

Neal is still better, and at worst, has always been a steady 20 goal guy. Names are great, but chemistry means more. Patches had that last year as did Neal. Let's see Patches put up numbers consistently. This year he's been wretched. Neal has a world class shot and release, and knows how to find the empty space. Patches can't touch Neal in any of these ways.

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Old
02-18-2013, 09:50 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Sir Gary Oak View Post
Goligoski and Niskanen
Which Dallas GM pulled the trigger on that trade? Was it the Brett Hull Co-GM era?

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Old
02-18-2013, 11:11 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Halberstram View Post
One year. . . Congrats.

Neal is still better, and at worst, has always been a steady 20 goal guy. Names are great, but chemistry means more. Patches had that last year as did Neal. Let's see Patches put up numbers consistently. This year he's been wretched. Neal has a world class shot and release, and knows how to find the empty space. Patches can't touch Neal in any of these ways.
10pts in 11 games, while also suffering an appendix removal that was supposed to keep him out a month is wretched? Damn, I wish I was that wretched.

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Old
02-18-2013, 11:17 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
10pts in 11 games, while also suffering an appendix removal that was supposed to keep him out a month is wretched? Damn, I wish I was that wretched.
He's a tough kid, props for that. One goal, flukey one at that, in 11 games is wretched for a winger that is paid to score goals.

Neal is better.

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Old
02-18-2013, 11:19 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Halberstram View Post
One year. . . Congrats.

Neal is still better, and at worst, has always been a steady 20 goal guy. Names are great, but chemistry means more. Patches had that last year as did Neal. Let's see Patches put up numbers consistently. This year he's been wretched. Neal has a world class shot and release, and knows how to find the empty space. Patches can't touch Neal in any of these ways.
Unlucky=/=wretched.

He's shooting at a pretty similar rate as last year (around 3 shots per game) but his shooting % before tonight was.......


0%.

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Old
02-18-2013, 11:28 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus Halberstram View Post
He's a tough kid, props for that. One goal, flukey one at that, in 11 games is wretched for a winger that is paid to score goals.

Neal is better.
Neal's team worst -6 rating is certainly impressive.

Btw, Pacioretty has always been considered a better passer than goal scorer. He's paid to produce, which he's doing, and despite his 'wretched' play, and health issues, is producing more ppg than Neal and is actually a plus player. And all without riding the Malkin pony.

Neal's a good player, but under the same circumstances as Pacioretty, he'd be a 50-60 pt player like he was in Dallas. At a similar age and under similar, but less ideal circumstances, Pacioretty got 65pts and 24 in 37 gamed the previous year.


Last edited by Psycho Papa Joe: 02-18-2013 at 11:33 PM.
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Old
02-18-2013, 11:35 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Neal's team worst -6 rating is certainly impressive.

Btw, Pacioretty has always been considered a better passer than goal scorer. He's paid to produce, which he's doing, and despite his 'wretched' play, and health issues, is producing more ppg than Neal and is actually a plus player. And all without riding the Malkin pony.

Neal's a good player, but under the same circumstances as Pacioretty, he'd be a 50-60 pt player like he was in Dallas. At a similar age and under similar, but less ideal circumstances, Pacioretty got 65pts and 24 in 37 gamed the previous year.
Like he was in Dallas in his first three seasons in the league? Should we use Pacioretty's first three seasons' numbers or are we only allowed to use Neal's?

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Old
02-18-2013, 11:46 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by alcanalz View Post
Like he was in Dallas in his first three seasons in the league? Should we use Pacioretty's first three seasons' numbers or are we only allowed to use Neal's?
Leave Papa Joe alone. He had to bring up the most laughable stat in all of sport to make some abstract point that had nothing to do with the fact that Neal is a better player than Patches. He'll be OK.

Those who can make a poll, please make a Neal vs. Pacioretty poll. Curious to see the outcome. Hopefully Neal's awful plus/minus won't hurt him too much.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:00 AM
  #46
Psycho Papa Joe
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Like he was in Dallas in his first three seasons in the league? Should we use Pacioretty's first three seasons' numbers or are we only allowed to use Neal's?
Try using numbers at the same ages. At the same age as Pacioretty was last year, Neal had 45 pts.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:02 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Marcus Halberstram View Post
Leave Papa Joe alone. He had to bring up the most laughable stat in all of sport to make some abstract point that had nothing to do with the fact that Neal is a better player than Patches. He'll be OK.

Those who can make a poll, please make a Neal vs. Pacioretty poll. Curious to see the outcome. Hopefully Neal's awful plus/minus won't hurt him too much.
Anybody with a clue would realize plus minus needs to be viewed in context. The context in this case is that Neal is his teams worst.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:05 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Anybody with a clue would realize plus minus needs to be viewed in context. The context in this case is that Neal is his teams worst.
Grasping. At. Straws.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:05 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Anybody with a clue would realize plus minus needs to be viewed in context. The context in this case is that Neal is his teams worst.

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:09 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Try using numbers at the same ages. At the same age as Pacioretty was last year, Neal had 45 pts.
Nice little twisting of the arm to make Neal's previous seasons obsolete in the argument so that yours looks better.

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