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02-18-2013, 10:29 AM
  #201
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Originally Posted by GhostOfSeanAvery View Post
Correlation=/=causation. The big difference between last year and the prior post-lockout years was Lundqvist doing 99% of the work instead of 98%. The offense actually declined from the prior season, remember?
Correlation doesn't equal causation . . . except when it does, and this is certainly one of those times. If you want to make a list of reasons for the Rangers success in 11-12 as compared to 10-11, Richards is clearly #1 in my book. McDonagh would probably be #2. Lundqvist played no better or worse than he has played throughout his NHL career, which is to say that he's been elite from the get go.

And the offense declined at a slower rate than the rest of the league. The Rangers went from being 16th in goals per game in 2010-11 to 11th in 2011-12.

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02-18-2013, 10:59 AM
  #202
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If it wasn't for Richards playing at such a high level for the last month and a half/ two months of last season, we don't finish first in the East. Talks of buying him out are incredibly premature, let's see what he can do with more than half the season remaining.

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02-18-2013, 05:55 PM
  #203
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Are there any stats on how often a center gets kicked from the drop?

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02-18-2013, 06:12 PM
  #204
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
If it wasn't for Richards playing at such a high level for the last month and a half/ two months of last season, we don't finish first in the East. Talks of buying him out are incredibly premature, let's see what he can do with more than half the season remaining.
He probably has to be bought out at some point. Do we really want him on the books until 2020?

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02-18-2013, 06:48 PM
  #205
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Originally Posted by stan the caddy View Post
He probably has to be bought out at some point. Do we really want him on the books until 2020?
Its nice to have the option in the back pocket in Summer 2014.

A ton can happen between now and then. We can speculate on a message board, but I assure you the Rangers front office isnt giving it any thought whatsoever right now.

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02-19-2013, 10:15 AM
  #206
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Its nice to have the option in the back pocket in Summer 2014.

A ton can happen between now and then. We can speculate on a message board, but I assure you the Rangers front office isnt giving it any thought whatsoever right now.
The front office should not give it any consideration right now...it would be silly to buy Richards out DURING the season.

But they should give a buyout serious consideration this summer, or perhaps in 2014. This could be our only chance to get out from this contract and cap hit.

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02-19-2013, 10:25 AM
  #207
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Looked at the stats. 11 points in 14 games. That's prorated for 64 points in an 82 game season. He had 66 points last year. That included a super hot stretch in March. Richards is on pace for virtually the same amount of points and he hasn't even had a hot stretch.

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02-19-2013, 10:27 AM
  #208
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Originally Posted by Hellion View Post
Are there any stats on how often a center gets kicked from the drop?
I think it seems like Richards has more of them because he complains about every one.

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02-19-2013, 10:28 AM
  #209
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
Looked at the stats. 11 points in 14 games. That's prorated for 64 points in an 82 game season. He had 66 points last year. That included a super hot stretch in March. Richards is on pace for virtually the same amount of points and he hasn't even had a hot stretch.
But it's not the points. He has been playing with Nash and Gaborik most of the season. guys who create their own offense. He hasn't really done a whole lot for those points.

I think what I, and most other people want from Richards, is to be a difference maker. For 6.7 million/season, he is supposed to a difference-maker every game. If not, then he is highly overpaid.

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02-19-2013, 10:29 AM
  #210
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
Looked at the stats. 11 points in 14 games. That's prorated for 64 points in an 82 game season. He had 66 points last year. That included a super hot stretch in March. Richards is on pace for virtually the same amount of points and he hasn't even had a hot stretch.
Which blows my mind. For a season that started off poor and has now reached atrocious levels, he has managed to maintain consistency in point production.

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02-19-2013, 10:35 AM
  #211
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
But it's not the points. He has been playing with Nash and Gaborik most of the season. guys who create their own offense. He hasn't really done a whole lot for those points.

I think what I, and most other people want from Richards, is to be a difference maker. For 6.7 million/season, he is supposed to a difference-maker every game. If not, then he is highly overpaid.
Very true. He's piled up some points, but hasn't been the catalyst for our offense that his numbers would suggest.

However, I don't mind him being a 65-70 point players during the regular season if he continues to be money in the playoffs. His cap hit is high, but at the worst I can see him being our better version of Briere. He's unspectacular if not solid during the regular season, but a beast in the playoffs. I'll take that for now. Still want to see him be more of a difference maker now, though.

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02-19-2013, 10:48 AM
  #212
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Originally Posted by Bob Richards View Post
Which blows my mind. For a season that started off poor and has now reached atrocious levels, he has managed to maintain consistency in point production.
when he ends the season with ~65 points and a +10 all the buyout talks will be forgotten and everyone will look at his season as a decent one, the one thing i take from his point production is that he hasnt brought the people around him down, hes clearly still trying to find his groove but hes also still producing numbers, i can live with that while he gets his **** together.

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02-19-2013, 10:54 AM
  #213
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What troubles me is how everyone seems to have gotten better. Names that were being criticized at the seasons beginning like Stepan, Halpern, Lundqvist, Hagelin and Boyle have improved. Richards has gotten worse with his game against the Islanders being laughably bad.

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Old
02-19-2013, 10:55 AM
  #214
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
But it's not the points. He has been playing with Nash and Gaborik most of the season. guys who create their own offense. He hasn't really done a whole lot for those points.

I think what I, and most other people want from Richards, is to be a difference maker. For 6.7 million/season, he is supposed to a difference-maker every game. If not, then he is highly overpaid.
Getting points playing with good players isn't a gimme. Stepan has played with Nash for a while now and even though he's been playing better has 7 points in 14 games. Pens fans complain that all of the wingers put on a line of Malkin and Neal have 1 or 2 combined points.

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02-19-2013, 10:58 AM
  #215
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
Getting points playing with good players isn't a gimme. Stepan has played with Nash for a while now and even though he's been playing better has 7 points in 14 games. Pens fans complain that all of the wingers put on a line of Malkin and Neal have 1 or 2 combined points.
Not saying it's a gimme, but watching the games he has been anything but a difference-maker. He hasn't looked dangerous with the puck for a while now. He was brought in to help carry the offense. I would say he is failing right now.

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02-19-2013, 11:14 AM
  #216
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
Not saying it's a gimme, but watching the games he has been anything but a difference-maker. He hasn't looked dangerous with the puck for a while now. He was brought in to help carry the offense. I would say he is failing right now.
no doubt hes failing to carry the offense or really have a significant impact on that side of the puck, hes said it himself hes gotta find his groove, the lockout clearly took a toll on him, the thing im happy with is other guys like hagelin and stepan have stepped up and were still playing well as a team. Im 100% confident Richards will get his **** together and round back into shape, hes far from done or needing to be bought out, in the meantime other guys need to carry the load and their doing it so far.

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02-19-2013, 11:24 AM
  #217
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Originally Posted by Rangerdanger20 View Post
no doubt hes failing to carry the offense or really have a significant impact on that side of the puck, hes said it himself hes gotta find his groove, the lockout clearly took a toll on him, the thing im happy with is other guys like hagelin and stepan have stepped up and were still playing well as a team. Im 100% confident Richards will get his **** together and round back into shape, hes far from done or needing to be bought out, in the meantime other guys need to carry the load and their doing it so far.
Get your optimism out of here.

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02-19-2013, 12:02 PM
  #218
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he's shown some flashes...the great player he was is still there, he just needs to get it going. he made some great 1 touch passes, he made some great cross ice passes, and hes made some AWFUL passes...the guy just needs to get going...i do wonder how much missing pretty much the entire training camp effected him...

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02-19-2013, 12:53 PM
  #219
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The bottom line IMO is when you sign a player to a contract like that he is supposed to be that ROCK up front on your roster. Like Hank in goal. How often do we ever have a Hank thread going? Not often at all and we probably take him for granted at times. For the money Richie is getting and considering this is the part of his contract we need to be getting full value of his cap hit, the fact that there is even a question of if he's been good enough to keep through our buyout option shows to me he hasn't been good enough. I'm not saying it's in stone that we buy him out, I'm simply saying he should be one of those players who we have good things to say most nights, nothing to say some nights and negative things on a rare occasion. That simply hasn't been the case.

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02-19-2013, 01:27 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by NY Lito View Post
Get your optimism out of here.
sorry, I seam to be the only one here that thinks a 32 year old #1 center can have a bounce back second half of the season and aparantly save his career since most people think we should buy him out and use the money to sign another #1c, since they clearly grow on trees around here (see last ~6 years)

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02-19-2013, 02:31 PM
  #221
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He looked a little better on Sunday IMO.

What I see is a conditioning thing. He doesn't have that second step to his game and his stops and starts are too long. Gross wrote up a piece on him about 10 days ago and Brad was quoted as saying that there are nights he doesn't feel in game shape.

Many have mentioned how cerebral a player he is and how he can get away with not having the greatest physical attributes on the ice - and I agree - but only to a certain extent. He has found himself in tight situations where he normally buys himself a half-second more (and thats all he needs) to make a play, instead he gets knocked off the puck or doesnt get a clean pass or shot off.

Its getting there though, and I think veterans like Richards rely heavily on camps to prime themselves for the season. We are 5 weeks into the season now so it should start to come around.

Like a lot of fans I get worried, but its understandable considering his age. I feel like Brad is the type of competitor that will will his way through this.

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02-19-2013, 02:34 PM
  #222
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I think Richards is still working himself back into form. He hasn't really ever appeared to be the legit #1 center we were all hoping for in terms of putting up elite offensive numbers and helping control the flow of a game, but he still has the ability to be a game breaker and open a game up, which is more than any other center we have had in a while.

Given his age, lack of a preseason and his flu at the start of the season I hope to see a better Richards in another few weeks. But maybe I am just optimistic....

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02-19-2013, 02:36 PM
  #223
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Originally Posted by The Sweetness View Post
I think Richards is still working himself back into form. He hasn't really ever appeared to be the legit #1 center we were all hoping for in terms of putting up elite offensive numbers and helping control the flow of a game, but he still has the ability to be a game breaker and open a game up, which is more than any other center we have had in a while.

Given his age, lack of a preseason and his flu at the start of the season I hope to see a better Richards in another few weeks. But maybe I am just optimistic....
Not allowed on these boards. He's clearly past it and should have been bought out already.

He'll be fine. He's come out of the gates slow. If he's playing like this come game 25 or 30 then there's cause for concern. Otherwise just wait it out.

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02-19-2013, 02:37 PM
  #224
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He looked a little better on Sunday IMO.

What I see is a conditioning thing. He doesn't have that second step to his game and his stops and starts are too long. Gross wrote up a piece on him about 10 days ago and Brad was quoted as saying that there are nights he doesn't feel in game shape.

Many have mentioned how cerebral a player he is and how he can get away with not having the greatest physical attributes on the ice - and I agree - but only to a certain extent. He has found himself in tight situations where he normally buys himself a half-second more (and thats all he needs) to make a play, instead he gets knocked off the puck or doesnt get a clean pass or shot off.

Its getting there though, and I think veterans like Richards rely heavily on camps to prime themselves for the season. We are 5 weeks into the season now so it should start to come around.

Like a lot of fans I get worried, but its understandable considering his age. I feel like Brad is the type of competitor that will will his way through this.
Good post. I just saw that I wrote something very similar a few minutes after you, but thought you expressed yourself a bit better.

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02-19-2013, 02:44 PM
  #225
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Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
He looked a little better on Sunday IMO.

What I see is a conditioning thing. He doesn't have that second step to his game and his stops and starts are too long. Gross wrote up a piece on him about 10 days ago and Brad was quoted as saying that there are nights he doesn't feel in game shape.

Many have mentioned how cerebral a player he is and how he can get away with not having the greatest physical attributes on the ice - and I agree - but only to a certain extent. He has found himself in tight situations where he normally buys himself a half-second more (and thats all he needs) to make a play, instead he gets knocked off the puck or doesnt get a clean pass or shot off.

Its getting there though, and I think veterans like Richards rely heavily on camps to prime themselves for the season. We are 5 weeks into the season now so it should start to come around.

Like a lot of fans I get worried, but its understandable considering his age. I feel like Brad is the type of competitor that will will his way through this.
hit the nail on the head there, thats probably the most level headed and non ridiculous statement anyones made about richards in a long time, and i couldnt agree more. hes a guy thats always relied on his hockey iq and its not like he lost half his brain cells overnight, hes never been a fast guy or a physical players but he needs to be in top physical shape to get himself into the positions to make plays, and hes not getting there right now, but im totally confident he will be very soon, like you said were 5 weeks in the rust should start to fall off pretty soon just like it would in camp.

also for those who want to buy richards out, who do we sign in the offseason? millers not going to be ready to be a #1, stepan would be a poor mans #1 and if perry makes it to free agency which i doubt he will hes going to get a hell of a pay day. The islanders just traded a 2nd to put more $ on the cap, some team will likely be in the same position in a few years down the line, and a seasoned vet like richards would be a great addition to groom some young players, and also add his high cap hit. also buying him out just after signing him will give the team a bad reputation, guys are going to rethink singing a retirenment contract with us, just to be bought out a few years later because putting up 65 points apparently isnt enough around here.

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