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2014 Olympics and the NHL (UPD: NHL, NHLPA, IIHF, IOC meeting this week)

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Old
02-16-2013, 10:50 AM
  #226
The CyNick
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Originally Posted by saskriders View Post
Why should North America reep all the benefits
Because that's where the owners who pay the players salaries are, and that's where revenues can be maximized. Its not exactly rocket science.

When europe starts contributing to nhl revenues like north america has been, then you change things up.

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02-16-2013, 10:54 AM
  #227
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Dont the NHL get more fans in USA and the rest of the world if there is a olympic with NHL-players? Then i really think they do benifit from it. By the way its's a pretty disgusting point-of-view that everything must benifit you. Every year the NHL takes the best players from Europe for money much less then what they´re worth, is it so much to ask that they repay those countries by allowing their players to play a olympics every fourth year?

In every other sports they understand that in order to get the sport to grow , you must have a big national team tournament with the best players. World cup of hockey wont do it, as it felt pretty biased. Canadian referees during canadian games if i remember correctly. Also there was no qualification, so it's kinda of irrelavant for pretty good hockey countries like Slovenia, Belarus, Norway, and big countries like France, Ukraine, Poland, GB, even Italy and Spain and so on where people probably would watch the olympics hockey because it's the olympics. And at national team tournament should not be played in so many locations.

If the NHL choose not to parcipitate in the olympics i think they shoot themselves in the foot because it's a great way to increase NHL-interest worldwide.
Where are the benefits the nhl has received from participation in the playoffs since 98?

Why should the nhl assume all the risk and get zero benefits?

Its frankly illogical that they have participated for this long.

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02-16-2013, 01:17 PM
  #228
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MOD NOTE: Olympic referees (where they come from, quality of officiating) is way beyond the scope of this thread and forum.

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02-16-2013, 02:54 PM
  #229
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That's ridiculous.

The quality of officiating has a lot to do with which refs are chosen. And its a given the non north american refs are not as good as the nhl ones. If they were as good, they would be in the nhl.

The sensitivity in some of these forums is absurd.

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02-16-2013, 03:24 PM
  #230
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Where are the benefits the nhl has received from participation in the playoffs since 98?
It seems like the NBA is working through many of these same issues with the IOC. Probably safe to assume the two leagues are coordinating efforts...?

 
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02-16-2013, 03:32 PM
  #231
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The difference is the NBA doesn't have to shut down for the Olympics, because they aren't on ice/snow so were moved to the summer games.

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02-16-2013, 04:16 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Because that's where the owners who pay the players salaries are, and that's where revenues can be maximized. Its not exactly rocket science.

When europe starts contributing to nhl revenues like north america has been, then you change things up.
This is the Olympics though

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02-16-2013, 04:35 PM
  #233
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Originally Posted by saskriders View Post
This is the Olympics though
Yes it is.

What does that have to do with the point?

The nhl and its owners should benefit from the olympic partnership. Currently they do not.

Nhl would be better off doing the world cup thing and cutting the ioc out of the equation and the profits.

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02-16-2013, 04:40 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
Yes it is.

What does that have to do with the point?

The nhl and its owners should benefit from the olympic partnership. Currently they do not.

Nhl would be better off doing the world cup thing and cutting the ioc out of the equation and the profits.
Being in the world (sports) media's headlights once every 4 years should be enough. The rest of the time, NHL is rather nonexistent.

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02-16-2013, 08:12 PM
  #235
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On the hot stove tonight, indication was that NHL/NHLPA access to players has been given. There is still a concern that the hotel selected is secure (near Georgian border), and there's pressure for the IOC to cover ($7m) insurance costs (for players to participate in camps, games).

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02-18-2013, 06:19 AM
  #236
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Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
Being in the world (sports) media's headlights once every 4 years should be enough. The rest of the time, NHL is rather nonexistent.
Basically we are talking about the one game for gold that gets widespread exposure once every four years and people that believe this has any significant effect on growing the game are not thinking clearly. The Superbowl probably gets similar global exposure every year and how has that gone for growing American Football outside of the US? For the most part the Olympics is about completely obscure sports that even sports fans don't care about 99% of the time. At least these obscure sports that generate next to no revenue outside of the Olympics get the benefit of the subsidies provided to them by revenue from Olympic Hockey, Basketball, etc.

Hockey as a whole would be way better off if the IIHF organized their own best on best tournament, but that probably won't happen soon.

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02-18-2013, 11:13 AM
  #237
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Originally Posted by Mr Kanadensisk View Post
Basically we are talking about the one game for gold that gets widespread exposure once every four years and people that believe this has any significant effect on growing the game are not thinking clearly. The Superbowl probably gets similar global exposure every year and how has that gone for growing American Football outside of the US? For the most part the Olympics is about completely obscure sports that even sports fans don't care about 99% of the time. At least these obscure sports that generate next to no revenue outside of the Olympics get the benefit of the subsidies provided to them by revenue from Olympic Hockey, Basketball, etc.

Hockey as a whole would be way better off if the IIHF organized their own best on best tournament, but that probably won't happen soon.
First of all, hockey is "slightly" bigger globally than American Football. Second, you forgot to add "sports fans in North America don't care". Cross country, biathlon, ski jumping, all big winter sports in Europe.

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02-18-2013, 01:20 PM
  #238
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Originally Posted by The CyNick View Post
I was all for the NHL-Olympics partnership, but the more I think of it, the more I think they NHL and PA should just form a World Cup of Hockey and can screw you to the IOC.

In a league that is looking to grow revenues, why not just do your own thing? Keep it in North America so it works for North American TV and just count the money.

Let the Olympic tournament be like soccer where its limited by age. Perhaps have the World Junior tourny suspended every four years, and let those kids play on the Olympic stage. Or let them get guys from the Spangler Cup.

How would a World Cup be more beneficial than the Olympics? The NHL would profit from a few game's gate receipts, but exposure would be next to nil. Who would pick it up on TV? Versus?
The exposure the NHL receives from the Olympics engulfs the meager profits a World Cup would provide.


Last edited by Hanji: 02-18-2013 at 02:17 PM.
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02-18-2013, 02:47 PM
  #239
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How would a World Cup be more beneficial than the Olympics? The NHL would profit from a few game's gate receipts, but exposure would be next to nil. Who would pick it up on TV? Versus?The exposure the NHL receives from the Olympics engulfs the meager profits a World Cup would provide.
They would make massive amounts of money from Canadian TV in rights fees for a World Cup. They would also get the games on major network TV in the US and would expose the game in the only place the NHL actually cares about growing the game: the USA.

Here's maybe a stupid question, sorry. But maybe someone knows this: If the IIHF held the hockey tournament during the summer oly's, could the NHl stop its players from going? If they said no, would it stand up to a legal challenge?

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02-18-2013, 03:17 PM
  #240
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Here's maybe a stupid question, sorry. But maybe someone knows this: If the IIHF held the hockey tournament during the summer oly's, could the NHl stop its players from going? If they said no, would it stand up to a legal challenge?
Technically yes - if the player is under contract.

The SPC prohibits a player from engaging in sports (including hockey) without the consent of the club. If the player did so, anyway, the team could suspend the player or even terminate the SPC for breach. In addition, if the player we're injured, he would be suspended w/o pay indefinitely untill he was physically able to play - and if it were a serious injury, the team could terminate the SPC and the player would be SOL.

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7. The Player and the Club recognize and agree that the Player's participation in other sports
may impair or destroy his ability and skill as a hockey Player. Accordingly the Player agrees
that he will not during the period of this SPC or during any period when he is obligated under
this SPC to enter into a further SPC with the Club engage or participate in football, baseball,
softball, hockey, lacrosse, boxing, wrestling or other athletic sport without the written consent of
the Club, which consent will not be unreasonably withheld.

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02-18-2013, 09:11 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
First of all, hockey is "slightly" bigger globally than American Football.
Do you mean that more people around the globe play hockey than football?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
Second, you forgot to add "sports fans in North America don't care". Cross country, biathlon, ski jumping, all big winter sports in Europe.
No I didn't. This might be news to you but most of the world's sports fans aren't from northern europe.

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02-18-2013, 10:28 PM
  #242
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No I didn't. This might be news to you but most of the world's sports fans aren't from northern europe.
You do realize that just because a sport isn't "big" in America, it doesn't mean that there isn't big money or tv ratings for it elsewhere? Like I've said before, biathlon and ski jumping are huge tv sports in Central Europe. Newsflash, sports world doesn't revolve around North America.

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02-18-2013, 11:33 PM
  #243
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You do realize that just because a sport isn't "big" in America, it doesn't mean that there isn't big money or tv ratings for it elsewhere? Like I've said before, biathlon and ski jumping are huge tv sports in Central Europe. Newsflash, sports world doesn't revolve around North America.
You're the one who brought up Europe and NA, I was speaking in global terms, sorry if that doesn't fit your stereotype of North Americans.

BTW please answer my question about the global popularity of American Football vs hockey. I assume you actually have some proof about the number of people participating in each sport or are we back to this eurocentric nationalism thing where you rate popularity depending on the number of countries the sport is played in.


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02-18-2013, 11:40 PM
  #244
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I never said it did. You're the one who suggested it revloved around northern Europe.

BTW please answer my question about the global popularity of American Football vs hockey. I assume you actually have some proof about the number of people participating in each sport or are we back to this eurocentric nationalism thing where you rate popularity depending on the number of countries the sport is played in.
Oh ffs, number of registered players worldwide, number of high level leagues, number of high level international teams. American football in basically the US and to a lesser extent Canada. Interest and tv viewership globally in Europe is much smaller.

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02-19-2013, 07:37 AM
  #245
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Oh ffs, number of registered players worldwide, number of high level leagues, number of high level international teams. American football in basically the US and to a lesser extent Canada. Interest and tv viewership globally in Europe is much smaller.
I'd love to see some numbers to back up this claim. Football is the number one team sport in a country of over 315 million people. Hockey is number one in Canada and Finland with a combined population of only 40 million. Even the population of Sweden, Russia, Czech and Slovakia combined is only 168 million and it is far from the most popular team sport in those countries. In the USA hockey is down around 4th or 5th in terms of team sports and pretty much everywhere else it is a fringe sport at best.

In terms of global participation and fan support (I'm talking about people here, not just those outside of North America) I'm not so sure that hockey is bigger than Football. Again if you have some numbers please share.


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02-19-2013, 08:49 AM
  #246
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I'd love to see some numbers to back up this claim. Football is the number one team sport in a country of over 315 million people. Hockey is number one in Canada and Finland with a combined population of only 40 million. Even the population of Sweden, Russia, Czech and Slovakia combined is only 168 million and it is far from the most popular team sport in those countries. In the USA hockey is down around 4th or 5th in terms of team sports and pretty much everywhere else it is a fringe sport at best.

In terms of global participation and fan support (I'm talking about people here, not just those outside of North America) I'm not so sure that hockey is bigger than Football. Again if you have some numbers please share.
Russia alone puts it above American football which is nonexistent in Europe. Based on your logic, baseball is bigger than hockey just because of the US. Yet, neither it nor American football are even Olympic sports.

You made the claim in the first hand, you're suppose to provide stats to back it up first.

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02-19-2013, 09:21 AM
  #247
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I guess I just don't believe that Olympic hockey viewership translates into NHL hockey viewership. Most Olympic viewers I know watch and enjoy all kinds of sports while the Olympics are on and fall in love with great athletic performances and then completely ignore those sports and athletes until the next Olympics. Why would hockey be any different?

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02-19-2013, 09:27 AM
  #248
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I guess I just don't believe that Olympic hockey viewership translates into NHL hockey viewership. Most Olympic viewers I know watch and enjoy all kinds of sports while the Olympics are on and fall in love with great athletic performances and then completely ignore those sports and athletes until the next Olympics. Why would hockey be any different?
Because NHL players and hockey is more available than curling, figure skating, short track skating or alpine or cross country events.

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02-19-2013, 10:57 AM
  #249
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Being in the world (sports) media's headlights once every 4 years should be enough. The rest of the time, NHL is rather nonexistent.
NHL has over 3 billion a year in revenues so I wouldn't say that is non-existent it is solidly in the big 4 of NA team sports leagues.

The debate here is how much is that media exposure for the gold medal game actually worth? Some people here claim it's basically priceless but that deserves some scrutiny, maybe it's difficult for us to quantify with little data but some NHL marketing execs certainly have put a value on it. Plus remember the value shifts from the the high end of being hosted in a major north american city (salt lake, vancouver) to the low end of obscure eurasian skiing villages. But how does it measure up to the costs which are real? The costs of the 2.5 week disruption, plus the revenue potential lost to playing for IOC (versus keeping it with a World Cup), you are prolly talking 50 million $ here at least.

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02-19-2013, 12:11 PM
  #250
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I guess I just don't believe that Olympic hockey viewership translates into NHL hockey viewership. Most Olympic viewers I know watch and enjoy all kinds of sports while the Olympics are on and fall in love with great athletic performances and then completely ignore those sports and athletes until the next Olympics. Why would hockey be any different?
Most "recent" hockey converts I've met had their first major exposure to the sport in 2010 with the Vancouver games. It did wonders for the sport here in the U.S.

There's no way in hell a World Cup of Hockey has any benefits for the sport/league besides a couple games of ticket revenue. There's a reason they stopped having the World Cup in the first place, nobody gave a ****. And for good reason. Even as a hockey fan, it's hard to have any interest in a tournament with no history that is heavily biased towards the North American teams. I prefer the World Championships much more than the World Cup. People like to complain about the WHC not being "best-on-best", but I'd rather watch a Team USA full of players who aren't "too good" for the national team just because they have good NHL contracts and no longer need to use the tournament to raise their value, while a guy like Patrick Kane spends his off-season getting plastered at Frat parties.

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