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Old
02-17-2013, 04:46 AM
  #26
wunderpanda
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I don't *hate* Ennis, but I don't like him much either. Didn't like him as a winger, like him even less as a centre.

There are players people don't like for whatever reason, Ennis and Stafford are the Sabres I most want traded.

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02-17-2013, 06:11 AM
  #27
gallagt01
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Originally Posted by wunderpanda View Post
I don't *hate* Ennis, but I don't like him much either. Didn't like him as a winger, like him even less as a centre.

There are players people don't like for whatever reason, Ennis and Stafford are the Sabres I most want traded.
Anybody who "wants" Ennis traded isn't doing it right. The guy is a gamer and a hell of a hockey player. He and VHP ARE the Sabres' offense.

I'd move him if it meant improving the team. I wouldn't actively pursue trading him.

Neither are a top-20 center, but moving forward, we're in damn good hands down the middle (if we can add a shutdown center with some offense (ROR) to Hodgson/Ennis/Grigorenko).

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02-17-2013, 07:17 AM
  #28
Mergus
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Originally Posted by Foligno and Barnes View Post
Briere was also producing at more than a PPG for us, can't really complain about defense when you're putting up elite numbers.

I do agree that the Ennis hate is unwarranted though, he's doing exactly what he was drafted to do. Blame Darcy for not acquiring a center that we can count on defensively, Ennis is more suited as a winger IMO, even though he has produced quite well as a center. No one should be complaining about Ennis' game so far though, he's been the most productive player outside of the top line.
Briere scored over a PPG in only two seasons during his entire career. Both were right after the lock out with different rules (2006,2007), one of those years he was injured for half the season, he was 28 and 29 years old respectively, and he played on an incredibly stacked team. The overrating of Briere is quite comical on this forum. I guess we just like to think of the good ole days.

I realize you were agreeing with the previous poster, just pointing out the facts about Briere. I also agree that the hate for Ennis is unreal. The kid is 22 and is putting up points at about a 37 point pace and scoring goals at a 27 goal pace. We are really complaining about that?

Then there are these ridiculous threads about trading Ennis+ for a guy who scored 55 points at the same age and who wants 4-5 million a season to do it.....

To boot, Ennis has shown a flair for showing up in the playoffs in his limited experience. Let him develop. He's doing a pretty good job being our 2nd line center. To put up 12 points in 15 games when your linemates are not finishing (combined shooting percentage of 3%), that is impressive.

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Old
02-17-2013, 08:14 AM
  #29
gallagt01
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Originally Posted by Mergus View Post
The overrating of Briere is quite comical on this forum. I guess we just like to think of the good ole days.


Briere is the best center the Sabres have had since LaFontaine. I'll leave it at that as to not derail the thread off topic.

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Old
02-17-2013, 11:54 AM
  #30
Timbo Slice
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ROR would be so perfect to balance this team out..... *droooool*

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02-17-2013, 12:16 PM
  #31
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ROR would be so perfect to balance this team out..... *droooool*
Overpayment is almost certain though. Man this is frustrating. Hecht isn't very useful anymore and it's really damaging.

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02-17-2013, 01:22 PM
  #32
joshjull
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Overpayment is almost certain though. Man this is frustrating. Hecht isn't very useful anymore and it's really damaging.
Also is the fact that Grigs isn't ready and is not a defensive center.

If we had a legit defensive center to go with Hodgson/Ennis we would be in much better shape.

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02-19-2013, 03:08 PM
  #33
JohnnyDrama21
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
Ennis being a sinkhole defensively is a myth. He'll never be a selke candidate, but he's not nearly as bad as people make it out.
Hodgson is far worse.

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02-19-2013, 03:25 PM
  #34
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Hodgson is far worse.
Far worse?

Far?

Prove it.

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02-19-2013, 03:29 PM
  #35
1972
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Also is the fact that Grigs isn't ready and is not a defensive center.

If we had a legit defensive center to go with Hodgson/Ennis we would be in much better shape.
As in a 9th place finish in the east? all getting a defensive center does take us away from a lottery pick and closer to a mid first rounder.

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02-19-2013, 03:32 PM
  #36
joshjull
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As in a 9th place finish in the east? all getting a defensive center does take us away from a lottery pick and closer to a mid first rounder.

So you agree. Thanks.

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02-19-2013, 03:55 PM
  #37
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Ennis and Hodgson are okay in their own end. I think we need to focus on how badly our defensemen play defense before we start worrying about our centers' defensive play.

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02-19-2013, 04:00 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by punkr0x View Post
Ennis and Hodgson are okay in their own end. I think we need to focus on how badly our defensemen play defense before we start worrying about our centers' defensive play.
Need to focus on both, actually. Defense works best as a 5-man unit.

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Old
02-19-2013, 04:00 PM
  #39
joshjull
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Originally Posted by punkr0x View Post
Ennis and Hodgson are okay in their own end. I think we need to focus on how badly our defensemen play defense before we start worrying about our centers' defensive play.
Actually both need to be focused on.

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02-19-2013, 04:02 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
Actually both need to be focused on.
.. You didn't get the super-secret moderator conspiracy memo? It's my turn!

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02-19-2013, 04:04 PM
  #41
Jacob582
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Need to focus on both, actually. Defense works best as a 5-man unit.
Defense only works as a 5-man unit.

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Old
02-19-2013, 04:05 PM
  #42
MLH
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Originally Posted by ZZamboni View Post
Far worse?

Far?

Prove it.
Well this year he's been far worse. You obviously can't "prove" it since it's an opinion and maybe you're just being intentionally pedantic as usual, but the objective numbers show that it hasn't been close this season.

Ennis' relative Corsi rating is 18.5 while Hodgson's is 5.4, Hodgson is taking 1.3 penalties per 60 minutes compared to 0.3 for Ennis, and Hodgson has been on the ice for 5.11 GA per 60 minutes compared to 2.57 for Ennis.

Ennis plays against significantly higher quality of opponents and starts in the defensive zone far more than Hodgson. Despite this, he finishes in the offensive zone far more than Hodgson.

Ennis has won 32 out of 60 face-offs in the defensive zone, while Hodgson has won 33 of 79.

So yeah, you can't prove something that is inherently unprovable, but it hasn't been anywhere near close.

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Old
02-19-2013, 04:21 PM
  #43
joshjull
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my bad

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Old
02-19-2013, 04:30 PM
  #44
Dubi Doo
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Originally Posted by punkr0x View Post
Ennis and Hodgson are okay in their own end. I think we need to focus on how badly our defensemen play defense before we start worrying about our centers' defensive play.
Ennis is ok in his own end. Hodgson is god awful. He's still young, though. It will come with time.

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