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Old
02-19-2013, 03:45 PM
  #26
Yashintangibles
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
Due to 1 part system, 1 part forward responsibility and 1 part effective forecheck keeping pressure off the defense.

Has very little to do with the quality of any individual defenseman on this team.
Last year's was worse and not close in my opinion. I've never seen the team playing better defence under Peter Deboer than during the 5 games winning streak a few games ago. They were literally kicking butts out of the defensive zone.

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02-19-2013, 03:54 PM
  #27
Peter Sidorkiewicz
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First, I think we have one of the better defenses in the NHL, it may lack star power but its got the right mix of skills required to move the puck and also more importantly to stop the opposition.

I tend to agree with most that Salvador is probably our biggest concern.

Zidlicky isn't great defensively but we need his skills on the PP. At even strength he is only getting third pairing minutes so he is used well. I don't think he will be re-signed as eventually Larsson should have a shot at PP time, although I said the same thing last season about thinking Salvador was not going to be re-signed.

I'm a fan of Volchenkov. The team needs his toughness, shot blocking skills for the PK. Again, I think he is managed well by the coaching staff to limit his minutes during even strength.

Greene and Fayne are very consistent and of course Larsson is a budding star of the future.

The odd player out is Tallinder, mainly due that the team is not going to trade or scratch its captain. I'm not sure what we can get for him but not playing him will obviously effect his trade value which why I think he has been re-inserted in the lineup lately for Fayne.

Harold is a perfect 7th defenseman and provides excellent depth in case of injuries.

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02-19-2013, 03:57 PM
  #28
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I tend to think of guys like Sal, Volch, and Zid as the role players. Sal, and Volch PK, Zid PP.

Larsson, Greene, and Fayne are all around players to me. Tallinder is probably closer to an all around guy, but a poor one at that.

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Old
02-19-2013, 04:04 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadDog172430 View Post
Greene-Larsson
Fayne-Salvador
Zidlicky-Volchenkov

Bring these pairings back and profit.
I like those top two pairings, but Zid/Volch still makes me uneasy. I'd be fine with sitting Zid for Harrold for a game or two and see how that goes, provided that means Fayne is back in for Tallinder.

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02-19-2013, 04:16 PM
  #30
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If our forwards don't slow the opposing winger down coming into the d zone, Volchenkov is in trouble nearly every time. He just cant handle speed coming down the wing at all. He is the weakest link in the group on top of that his "toughness" is vastly overrated. Who cares if you can hit hard if you're to slow and not agile enough to line anyone up?

Volchenkov plays well from the net to the corner, basically below the redline. That is a pretty limited skill set to be the highest paid defenseman on a team.

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02-19-2013, 04:17 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
If our forwards don't slow the opposing winger down coming into the d zone, Volchenkov is in trouble nearly every time. He just cant handle speed coming down the wing at all. He is the weakest link in the group on top of that his "toughness" is vastly overrated. Who cares if you can hit hard if you're to slow and not agile enough to line anyone up?

Volchenkov plays well from the net to the corner, basically below the redline. That is a pretty limited skill set to be the highest paid defenseman on a team.
True, but what do you do with Volch? Sitting him is a waste of the money he's being paid. Can he be traded? Not sure anyone would want him, and who would replace him?

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02-19-2013, 04:23 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by njdss4 View Post
True, but what do you do with Volch? Sitting him is a waste of the money he's being paid. Can he be traded? Not sure anyone would want him, and who would replace him?
Why not sit him? They sat Tallinder. Tallinder in his place and Fayne in is a more mobile and dynamic defense without giving up much of anything.

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02-19-2013, 04:24 PM
  #33
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At the start of the year I was hating on Volchankov bad. But, I always thought Salvador was not good either. I think our D is not that good of a group. Larsson, Green , and Fayne are our best by far. Also, Tallinder was playing fine before we sat him. In the last 3 games I watched Salvador not moving his feet when opposing forwards come into our zone. He gets caught flat footed way to much and it leads to scoring chances for the other team. I never really thought he was good,but in the playoffs he was amazing. But, I was not expecting him to carry that over into this season. We need to realize how slow our backend is too. Look why we have such a hard time playing against the Islanders. They are one of the fastest teams in the NHL. Our D can not keep up with them. But I must say we have gotten good at blocking shots which has helped out a lot.

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02-19-2013, 04:25 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
Why not sit him? They sat Tallinder. Tallinder in his plays and Fayne in is a more mobile and dynamic defense without giving up much of anything.
I guess... anything to get Fayne back in.

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02-19-2013, 04:35 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by njdss4 View Post
I like those top two pairings, but Zid/Volch still makes me uneasy. I'd be fine with sitting Zid for Harrold for a game or two and see how that goes, provided that means Fayne is back in for Tallinder.
Ya it isn't an ideal pair, but they haven't been terrible together, and it is worlds better then Volch-Sal.

Thing with Volch is we all know his contract is bad, its a dead horse at this point, he isn't worth what he is getting paid. He still has uses and can get things done if used and paired correctly. He has uses and you use what you have. Tally's use is that he is the most expendable D-man that is also tradeable. No one is taking Volch and giving us anything back with his contract.

Still one contract I'd love off the books over the summer.

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02-19-2013, 04:35 PM
  #36
Jack Griffin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
Due to 1 part system, 1 part forward responsibility and 1 part effective forecheck keeping pressure off the defense.

Has very little to do with the quality of any individual defenseman on this team.
Alright gotcha. Quality of defensemen has very little to do with how good a defense is. I learn something new everyday.

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02-19-2013, 04:35 PM
  #37
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Zidlicky is an offensive d-man. I'm not sure what you guys expect from him in our own zone. He's not great defensively because that's not his game, and although defense is important, that element of his game is not why he was brought here.

He's 3rd on the team in assists and 5th in points. He's played his role fine.

A year ago this defense literally carried the team to the Cup finals. They haven't forgotten how to play the game, and guys like Fayne, Greene, and Larsson have gotten even better. Salvador has regressed a bit, but pretty much the rest of them are exactly where they were last season.

The defense is not the problem at all. We're missing a top 6 winger, and as a result, we have several players playing one line higher than they should be.

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02-19-2013, 04:37 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by KovyLove View Post
Why not sit him? They sat Tallinder. Tallinder in his place and Fayne in is a more mobile and dynamic defense without giving up much of anything.
I'd give it a shot. I'm no fan of Tallinder but when both guys are playing well, Tallinder brings more to the table.

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02-19-2013, 04:41 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by CJ Richey View Post
Alright gotcha. Quality of defensemen has very little to do with how good a defense is. I learn something new everyday.
It's important to learn.

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02-19-2013, 04:48 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by njdss4 View Post
True, but what do you do with Volch? Sitting him is a waste of the money he's being paid. Can he be traded? Not sure anyone would want him, and who would replace him?
Try him at 1st line LW, everyone else has.

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02-19-2013, 04:48 PM
  #41
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Does anyone honesty think Lou would use an amnesty buyout this summer?

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02-19-2013, 04:48 PM
  #42
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Not sure who is/isn't being sarcastic in that back-and-forth between Jim and CJ, but it's 100% true that you don't need to have a single great d-man to have a great defense. Chemistry, trust, and a good system can go a long way.

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02-19-2013, 04:57 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperoreddy View Post
Tally's use is that he is the most expendable D-man that is also tradeable. No one is taking Volch and giving us anything back with his contract.

Still one contract I'd love off the books over the summer.
Is he tradeable? I keep wondering who would want him. Buyout, perhaps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by apice3 View Post
The defense is not the problem at all. We're missing a top 6 winger, and as a result, we have several players playing one line higher than they should be.
I still feel that Zid is more of a liability than he should be in his own zone, but I completely agree that the team is missing a top 6 winger. Combine that with the injuries to Zubrus, and now Carter and Clarkson, and the team is in trouble in the short term. I hope Lou can pull off more than a rental this year.

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Try him at 1st line LW, everyone else has.

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Old
02-19-2013, 05:00 PM
  #44
Yashintangibles
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apice3 View Post
Zidlicky is an offensive d-man. I'm not sure what you guys expect from him in our own zone. He's not great defensively because that's not his game, and although defense is important, that element of his game is not why he was brought here.

He's 3rd on the team in assists and 5th in points. He's played his role fine.

A year ago this defense literally carried the team to the Cup finals. They haven't forgotten how to play the game, and guys like Fayne, Greene, and Larsson have gotten even better. Salvador has regressed a bit, but pretty much the rest of them are exactly where they were last season.

The defense is not the problem at all. We're missing a top 6 winger, and as a result, we have several players playing one line higher than they should be.

It warms the heart when you know that you're not alone anymore.


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02-19-2013, 05:02 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TaiMaiShu View Post
Does anyone honesty think Lou would use an amnesty buyout this summer?
Maybe next Summer. I think he uses one at least. Maybe not two of them. Volchenkov is the likely candidate. If Tallinder stinks as bad as the Isles game too many more times, and he has no value I can see us using one on him. It won't hurt too much with just a year left.

Though I expect he'll try to trade Tallinder for whatever he can before that. Even if it's just a later round pick.

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Old
02-19-2013, 05:05 PM
  #46
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Volch just doesn't fit this system. I think he would be a great fit for the Rangers. The guy is not a bad defenseman. He's been toned down by the organization though and Marty doesn't like shots blocked. Those are his two biggest assets taken away. Of course he is going to look average.

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02-19-2013, 05:06 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Bleedred View Post
Maybe next Summer. I think he uses one at least. Maybe not two of them. Volchenkov is the likely candidate. If Tallinder stinks as bad as the Isles game too many more times, and he has no value I can see us using one on him. It won't hurt too much with just a year left.

Though I expect he'll try to trade Tallinder for whatever he can before that. Even if it's just a later round pick.
I'd be impressed if Lou found a way to get rid of Tallinder without having to retain any of his salary via that new CBA rule. Maybe get a 5th and a 7th rounder for him?

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Old
02-19-2013, 05:09 PM
  #48
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I think the Devils defense is very solid, DeBoer doesn't need to rely too much on just one or two pairings because all three can play. Sure, its missing that superstar number 1, but Larsson is getting there and Greene is honestly playing like a number 1. This is the best D the Devils have had in years. Compared to the Mike Mottau era, I'll take our current group every day of the week

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02-19-2013, 05:09 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oroku Saki View Post
Volch just doesn't fit this system. I think he would be a great fit for the Rangers. The guy is not a bad defenseman. He's been toned down by the organization though and Marty doesn't like shots blocked. Those are his two biggest assets taken away. Of course he is going to look average.
Yeah the system part is a lot of it I think. He's paid too much also is another big problem. I can't complain about him too much. He does some very stupid things, and then some very good things in the same game sometimes.

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Old
02-19-2013, 05:11 PM
  #50
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Yeah the system part is a lot of it I think. He's paid too much also is another big problem. I can't complain about him too much. He does some very stupid things, and then some very good things in the same game sometimes.
A lot of us are really hard on our guys. Watch some games around the league and check out some of the mistakes other players make on a nightly basis. They would be torched here. There is always going to be mistakes made.

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