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Gainey : We're down to plan D

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Old
07-11-2006, 07:39 PM
  #76
znk
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Agree 100%. To think all our young players will blossom (Grabovsky, Kostitsyn, Perez) IS irrational. This never happens. You have to support a young team with LEADERSHIP. We don't have it.
Well I think quite a few of our young guys blossomed last year. I dont see why it couldnt happen again.

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07-11-2006, 07:41 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
Here's a friendly word of advice from someone who's well aware that it's none of his business, drop it.

As son as I see 'people like' I tune out because I know it's about winning an arguement and little else. When kids fight, I make a point to not get involved in whose fault it is.

I believe that valid criticism is why we come here. I enjoy the discussion, some of my favorite posters seldom agree with me and vice versa, but there's this respect thing that keeps the world a pleasant place at times. When discussion gets ignorant and personal about posters and the people we discuss, I tend to not like it.

Every now and then I blow up, but I like to think Mom and Dad taught me better than that.
Agreed. I don't need people telling me I'm irrational, because until I see great improvement I will continue to look at this team critically. The team must do this also, and I'm sure they are.

There are good things on the horizon for sure, but for me, Gainey has failed (so far) to address the major needs of this team. Maybe he's trying, but he must come through.

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07-11-2006, 07:46 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Agreed. I don't need people telling me I'm irrational, because until I see great improvement I will continue to look at this team critically. The team must do this also, and I'm sure they are.

There are good things on the horizon for sure, but for me, Gainey has failed (so far) to address the major needs of this team. Maybe he's trying, but he must come through.
Still, I believe that if one player steps up big this year, it'll have a nice domino effect. It may be better not to make a 'reach' kind of deal out of frustration over not getting anything done yet.

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07-11-2006, 07:49 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Agreed. I don't need people telling me I'm irrational, because until I see great improvement I will continue to look at this team critically. The team must do this also, and I'm sure they are.

There are good things on the horizon for sure, but for me, Gainey has failed (so far) to address the major needs of this team. Maybe he's trying, but he must come through.
At what price?
Would you have been ready to offer a guy like Shanahan a 2-3 year contract to lure him to montreal?
The only guy I was ready to sign long term was Elias. None of the others interest me for long commiments because of the implications for our prospects and the crop of free agents next year.

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07-11-2006, 11:08 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by BigTimer View Post
Luongo got one. I don't know how much info about offer sheets are made available to the public since I don't remember a team being cited on the 8 million$ Luongo offer.
Roberto did not receive an offer sheet. Where are you getting your information?

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07-11-2006, 11:11 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
Roberto did not receive an offer sheet. Where are you getting your information?
Yeah...what the hell is he talking about.

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07-12-2006, 06:18 AM
  #82
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Gainey also said it`s been hard attracting players here. Then again he also said that he had a lot of demand of guys wanting to come here but they weren`t interested in them. So it`s 50/50.

Sure Bob. But the ones that want to come here are usualy one their last legs.

Plan D? Does that mean we`ll be struggling to make the playoffs yet again? I`m tired of this crap.

Trying to get RFAs from other teams is not a way to get players? How do you think Kevin Lowe got Pronger, he made the offer and St-Louis decided to make a trade. Why? Because Lowe has big b*lls and he`s no cowards. You think the Oilers have a better team than the Habs? I don`t think so. Most of them were average players and young players. There`s no moments that is too soon to be a Stanley Cup contender. Lowe made a gamble, got Pronger and it changed his team completly.

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07-12-2006, 08:44 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
At what price?
Would you have been ready to offer a guy like Shanahan a 2-3 year contract to lure him to montreal?
The only guy I was ready to sign long term was Elias. None of the others interest me for long commiments because of the implications for our prospects and the crop of free agents next year.
So last year, we looked to this year. This year to next year.

It's the same thing EVERY year.

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07-12-2006, 09:10 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
Gainey also said it`s been hard attracting players here. Then again he also said that he had a lot of demand of guys wanting to come here but they weren`t interested in them. So it`s 50/50.

Sure Bob. But the ones that want to come here are usualy one their last legs.

Plan D? Does that mean we`ll be struggling to make the playoffs yet again? I`m tired of this crap.

Trying to get RFAs from other teams is not a way to get players? How do you think Kevin Lowe got Pronger, he made the offer and St-Louis decided to make a trade. Why? Because Lowe has big b*lls and he`s no cowards. You think the Oilers have a better team than the Habs? I don`t think so. Most of them were average players and young players. There`s no moments that is too soon to be a Stanley Cup contender. Lowe made a gamble, got Pronger and it changed his team completly.
Of course it is some times frustrating that Bob don`t succeeded better to land some big UFA-players in Montreal. Is this a new situation? How many big UFA players Habs signed in last 10 years? Im also happy that we don`t have that "east coast syndrome". I mean look Bruins, Rangers and Flyers, every summer they sign big UFAs and still no cup in decades(except Rangers 94) and no major success in playoffs. I hope that Habs have right strategy right now and our prospects will bring back those glory days to Montreal and all habs-fans.

Edit:
Bob`s comment in Gazette:Detroit last season. Shanahan, according to reports, took less to sign with the Rangers than Montreal was offering.Suddenly, it appears Montreal has become the gulag of the NHL.
"I think you've taken a couple of hypotheses. Tell me if (Shanahan) is making more and then ask the question," the erudite Gainey said. "I don't have access to certain things in a person's mind, why they choose to sign with one team and not another.
"Why is it difficult to get doctors to outlying areas? Why won't they practise in the north? Players have the right to choose. We can't take it as a slap in the face. That's life. We're still a great team. This is a great city and Montreal's a great place to play. We'll find the right match."


Last edited by FinnHab: 07-12-2006 at 09:19 AM.
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Old
07-12-2006, 10:54 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
So last year, we looked to this year. This year to next year.

It's the same thing EVERY year.
Yeah but this year the habs made serious efforts to land one of Elias,Arnott,Shanahan. There will be more quality forwards next year so the odds will be better.

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07-12-2006, 11:26 AM
  #86
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Yeah...what the hell is he talking about.
The Panthers staff said that Roberto had received an offer sheet.

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07-12-2006, 11:41 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
Yeah but this year the habs made serious efforts to land one of Elias,Arnott,Shanahan. There will be more quality forwards next year so the odds will be better.
Great. I love odds. Let's go to Vegas.

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07-12-2006, 03:06 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by nittany View Post
So last year, we looked to this year. This year to next year.

It's the same thing EVERY year.
No, it gets better every year. Because last year's successes are returning and we have other successes waiting to happen.

I just think that blaming Gainey for not getting one of those UFA that snubbed us would be sort of like blaming Koivu for getting a stick in the eye. Shanahan signing with the Rangers is not a Gainey mistake - and upping the ante on Arnott or Elias would have been a Gainey mistake. So what should he have done?

Besides, let's not pass judgement until the season starts. There's plenty of time for trades and plenty of reasons why players should become available.

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07-12-2006, 03:13 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Nobak View Post
No, it gets better every year. Because last year's successes are returning and we have other successes waiting to happen.

I just think that blaming Gainey for not getting one of those UFA that snubbed us would be sort of like blaming Koivu for getting a stick in the eye. Shanahan signing with the Rangers is not a Gainey mistake - and upping the ante on Arnott or Elias would have been a Gainey mistake. So what should he have done?

Besides, let's not pass judgement until the season starts. There's plenty of time for trades and plenty of reasons why players should become available.
a post of reason, nittanny won't understand...he's one of 'them'

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07-12-2006, 04:12 PM
  #90
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I'm no bigtimer, but I would imagine a majority of NHL GM's would take Saku Koivu over Jason Arnott.

If you think on the open market Saku Koivu doesn't get a salary at least equal to Jason Arnott's, well, I guess trying to talk sense to you is going to be a real waste of time.
Koivu would garner at least $5 million on the open market.

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07-12-2006, 04:13 PM
  #91
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I can't believe he is interested in Sykora. I'd rather have Zednik.
i thought that i'm the only one who doesn't want sykora.....
i'm with you

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07-12-2006, 04:14 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by aymand View Post
The Panthers staff said that Roberto had received an offer sheet.
No, they didn't.

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07-12-2006, 04:26 PM
  #93
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Pedneault was the one who said Luongo had received an 8M$ offer sheet but Luongo himself refused to sign it.
I wouldn't believe Pednault if he said that hockey is played on ice, I would have to drive down to the Bell center and make sure it's not plastic myself, but maybe that's just me.

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07-12-2006, 04:35 PM
  #94
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As long as Plans H, U, E, and T work out for us, I would be comfortable with waiting until during the season to decide what our needs are and make a trade then. With the players we "really" wanted all having gone to other teams, I'd rather do that than settle for Sykora.

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07-12-2006, 04:55 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by sXe View Post
Pedneault was the one who said Luongo had received an 8M$ offer sheet but Luongo himself refused to sign it.
I wouldn't believe Pednault if he said that hockey is played on ice, I would have to drive down to the Bell center and make sure it's not plastic myself, but maybe that's just me.
It's nonsense, I assure you no club tabled an offer to Robert Luongo.

First of all, this would make a huge media splash - and a team making that offer would lead the charge.

It sends a huge message to the fans of the club that we want to win if your GM targets a top notch RFA and makes an offer... The notion this would happen secretly is hilariously niave.

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07-12-2006, 05:05 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
Gainey and co. identidied certain needs. I get the impression that they may be more interested in a LW than a C, if it came down to that. They weren't able to attract the players targeted. Too bad, from what I read, the offers were competitive, so forget the posts about Gainey being wise to save his $. He made generous offers to ufa's who decided they'd rather play somewhere else.

So, do you veer a bit off course and sign a Sykora or Samsonov ? Deal for a Lang ? I like the Lang idea that we've spoken about, but I think Carbo has a vision of an uptempo puck pressure style that may not suit him. otoh, Lang/Kovy could be a nice combination.

the trade chips aren't exciting anyone,Aebi,Zed, the ever present 2nd, we may just get a Lang from a team looking to take a step back on a contract, and move in some young guys.

With all the moves that have been made, I'm not sure who's better right now. The team needs a young player to graduate in terms of his role on the team in the way Higgins did in the 2nd halk. Kost ? Perez ? I don't know. One solid forward can make a difference though. Sykora wouldn't command the $ of Samsonov, could sign for a shorter term, could combine well with Kovy and whoever.
Nice post. Looking through the list of UFAs there are few names that jump out at you. Sykora is probably a better fit than Samsonov as he is the better 2 way player by virtue of his time in the Jersey swamp. From what I've heard here in Oilers-land Samsonov wants ridiculous money too.

Maybe this is a time to look at bonus-laden contracts for players who have fallen off the map a little? Guys with something to prove maybe? If we're looking to boost the offense a little what's the harm in throwing a low salary/high bonus contract at a guy like Petr Bondra? Or Viktor Kozlov (who plays the left side or centre)? Or take a chance on Eric Daze?

I shudder when all I see is guys wanting the big ticket guys. I'd rather see scoring depth than a couple of big guns. A lot of Montreal's offense is overly dependant on the Koivu-Kovalev connection; and while the younger guys can occasionally chip in, they lack the consistency that is needed when the first line gets shut down to pick up the slack.

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I'll take 3 guys who pot 15 goals a season over 1 guy who scores 40.

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Old
07-12-2006, 05:16 PM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
Koivu would garner at least $5 million on the open market.
I love Koivu as much as the next guy, but that is a little far fetched

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07-12-2006, 05:44 PM
  #98
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Of course he would. Thing is that Koivu is once again injured and probably wouldn't be signed at this point in time for that very reason. It's the story of his career and you just can't use a player like that to build your team around.
You use the term injury prone rather loosely. If someone stuck Arnott in the eye with a stick, would he suddenly be injury prone. That was nothing but a freak accident and has absolutely nothing to do with being injury prone.

Besides, you don't build a team around talent alone. If it could be done that way, the Rangers would have won seven consecutvie cups. Character is also an equally important trait. That is something that Arnott and some posters on seem to lack.

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