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Islanders for sale?

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Old
02-18-2013, 12:49 PM
  #51
Retail1LO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PenguinPower420 View Post
Wouldn't be surprised if Bettman would rather sell a team to some Russian Mafia goof than to a good, honest Canadian businessman.
Bettman doesn't decide who teams get sold to. The board of governors does. It's amazing how much power people think Bettman has. He's at the end of the strings. He's not the one holding them and moving them about.

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Old
02-18-2013, 01:02 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
Have people forgotten that the Islanders are moving to a non-hockey arena with terrible sight lines? I just can't get over how stupid Wang has been throughout all of this. Why didn't Wang have a contingency plan in place when the Islanders were getting nowhere with their half baked 3 billion dollar development scheme? He should have been talking to the developers about a lease agreement when the Barclays Center was in the design phase. And how stupid could one be to sign a 40 year lease in a non-hockey arena without at least holding an exhibition game first?
When Barclay's was being built, Wang was expecting his own arena in Nassau County.

Also, Bettman and Wang said at the Brooklyn presser, that Barclays will be getting 500-1000 extra seats.

NVMC has 31 luxury suites. The NY Times says the isles won't try to make their money off the cheap seats, but off the 100 luxury suites and premium seating, bringing in an additional $35m per. I'm guess it is those luxury suites that got Wang to sign.


Last edited by CREW99AW: 02-19-2013 at 12:53 PM.
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02-18-2013, 01:05 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retail1LO View Post
Bettman doesn't decide who teams get sold to. The board of governors does. It's amazing how much power people think Bettman has. He's at the end of the strings. He's not the one holding them and moving them about.
Nah, he just needs a supermajority to stop anything he does but he has no power.


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Old
02-18-2013, 01:19 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by DyerMaker66 View Post
Nah, he just needs a supermajority to stop anything he does but he has no power.
That's only for CBA negotiations. Bettman has no vote on franchise movement. He has a voice in the room, and certainly an influential ine, but no veto.

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02-18-2013, 02:12 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by MountainHawk View Post
That's only for CBA negotiations. Bettman has no vote on franchise movement. He has a voice in the room, and certainly an influential ine, but no veto.
That's sort of where I was going (I realize I was unclear):

He has a tonne of power whether he has an actual vote or not.

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Old
02-18-2013, 03:13 PM
  #56
silvercanuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
When Barclay's was being built, Wang was expecting his own arena in Nassau County.

Also, Bettman and Wang said at the Brooklyn presser, that Barclays will be getting 500-1000 extra seats.

NVMC has 31 lusury suites. The NY Times says the isles won't try to make their money off the cheap seats, but off the 100 luxury suites and premium seating, bringing in an addiational $35m per. I'm guess it is those luxury suites that got Wang to sign.
Wang is greedy, stubborn and stupid. It was clear as early as 2009 that the his mega development disguised as an NHL arena would never get govt approval yet he stubbornly continued tried to put his square peg in a round hole. This was well before ground broke at Barclays Center. He had time to change course.

The number of extra seats and boxes at is immaterial. Barclays Center is a re-purposed basketball arena. The ice sheet will be shifted towards one end and the sight lines will be absolutely horrible for hockey. Are people going to pay a premium for that? Time will tell but I wouldn't bet on it.


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02-18-2013, 08:41 PM
  #57
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Wang had a backup plan to the Lighthouse, it was the publically funded arena that got voted down in August 2011. Barclays and his eventual sale was plan C.

Wang may be a lousy owner but he's not a fool. He won't have to worry about what the team does when they get to Barclays because he doesn't intend on owning them there, at least not long nough for it to matter.

The islanders are only in Brooklyn to be a loss leader, and they'll only be that for the owners of the arena, not a tenant. Once that sale is complete, look for the arena to get some face lifts as well


Last edited by IceAce: 02-18-2013 at 08:47 PM.
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Old
02-18-2013, 09:33 PM
  #58
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This is great news for NYI and its fans if it comes true.

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Old
02-19-2013, 04:55 AM
  #59
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Hope this is true. They need to get a hockey guy in there to get the team back on track.

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02-19-2013, 07:29 AM
  #60
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For giggles, here are the New Jersey/Brooklyn Nets attendance numbers and rankings for the past 10 years:

2003: 15,184 (76.0%), 23rd
2004: 14,956 (74.8%), 26th
2005: 15,089 (75.5%), 26th
2006: 16,866 (84.4%), 19th
2007: 16,925 (84.7%), 19th
2008: 15,656 (78.3%), 21st
2009: 15,147 (75.8%), 25th
2010: 13,103 (69.1%), 30th
2011: 14,179 (80.6%), 28th
2012: 13,961 (75.5%), 30th
2013: 17,809 (94.5%), 16th

*Announced plans in 2005 to move to Brooklyn
**Prokhorov finalizes deal in 2009 to purchase Nets
***Temporarily moved to Prudential Center for 2011 and 2012
****Brooklyn's inaugural season in 2013

And here are regular season finishes to give those attendance figures some context:

2003: 8th
2004: 9th
2005: 17th
2006: 7th
2007: 14th
2008: 21st
2009: 20th
2010: 30th
2011: 25th
2012: 25th
2013: 9th

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Old
02-19-2013, 12:44 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
Wang had a backup plan to the Lighthouse, it was the publically funded arena that got voted down in August 2011. Barclays and his eventual sale was plan C.

Wang may be a lousy owner but he's not a fool. He won't have to worry about what the team does when they get to Barclays because he doesn't intend on owning them there, at least not long nough for it to matter.

The islanders are only in Brooklyn to be a loss leader, and they'll only be that for the owners of the arena, not a tenant. Once that sale is complete, look for the arena to get some face lifts as well
There was really no difference between plan A and plan B. Plan A was a 60 story mega development. Back up plan B was a 30 story mega development. It was impeccably clear back in 2009 that neither scheme was going to get approval from local govt, but Wang being Wang refused to back down until it was too late. Ground had not broken on Barcalys Center until 2010. Wang had time to work a deal out.

Wang may not worry about lease issues in the short term but the value of the Islanders franchise will be absolutely devalued because of that lease. Loss leader or not it will be difficult to sell all or part of the team.

As for renovations, I think one would have to be high to believe that they will resolve any of the basic issues with the building configuration. People seem to bring up the attendance as the main issue but they are not looking at the big picture. The sight lines are going to be horrible in Brooklyn. It will be apparent to anyone watching live or on TV.

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02-19-2013, 12:59 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
Wang is greedy, stubborn and stupid. It was clear as early as 2009 that the his mega development disguised as an NHL arena would never get govt approval yet he stubbornly continued tried to put his square peg in a round hole. This was well before ground broke at Barclays Center. He had time to change course.

The number of extra seats and boxes at is immaterial. Barclays Center is a re-purposed basketball arena. The ice sheet will be shifted towards one end and the sight lines will be absolutely horrible for hockey. Are people going to pay a premium for that? Time will tell but I wouldn't bet on it.

In the spring of 2011, Nassau County's exec proposed a plan for a publicly funded arena, that would be paid for with bonds. So, 2 yrs after the date you say Wang should have given up on his Lighthouse project, he and the County exec. were still working to find a way to keep the isles in Nassau County and in their own arena.

And while the number of premium seats and luxury suites may be ' immaterial' to you, I would guess that additional $35m per season, is not ' immaterial' to whoever owns the isles

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02-19-2013, 01:04 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crease View Post
For giggles, here are the New Jersey/Brooklyn Nets attendance numbers and rankings for the past 10 years:

2003: 15,184 (76.0%), 23rd
2004: 14,956 (74.8%), 26th
2005: 15,089 (75.5%), 26th
2006: 16,866 (84.4%), 19th
2007: 16,925 (84.7%), 19th
2008: 15,656 (78.3%), 21st
2009: 15,147 (75.8%), 25th
2010: 13,103 (69.1%), 30th
2011: 14,179 (80.6%), 28th
2012: 13,961 (75.5%), 30th
2013: 17,809 (94.5%), 16th

*Announced plans in 2005 to move to Brooklyn
**Prokhorov finalizes deal in 2009 to purchase Nets
***Temporarily moved to Prudential Center for 2011 and 2012
****Brooklyn's inaugural season in 2013

And here are regular season finishes to give those attendance figures some context:

2003: 8th
2004: 9th
2005: 17th
2006: 7th
2007: 14th
2008: 21st
2009: 20th
2010: 30th
2011: 25th
2012: 25th
2013: 9th

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/busines...zGNChiJgTIHGtI

The 6-foot-8-inch Nets owner has seen the value of his investment more than double since he bought the team two years ago, thanks to the move into the more financially friendly Barclays Center.

As the Nets gear up for the first season in the soon-to-be-completed Barclays Center, the team is now worth roughly $575 million, according to one sports investment banker. That’s 60 percent more than they were valued just last season by Forbes.
In addition, the team may post its first profit in a decade, The Post has learned


Last edited by Crease: 02-19-2013 at 01:07 PM. Reason: Fixed the quote for ya.
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Old
02-19-2013, 04:19 PM
  #64
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Isn't Barclays center supposed to get a major retrofit for the Islanders before the start of the 2015-2016 season? I assume thats why Wang has not pursued a buyout of the contract with Nassau County... At least that is my thinking.

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Old
02-19-2013, 10:52 PM
  #65
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Simply follow the trail and you will see who Wang may be selling to.

Quote:
The New York Islanders could be changing hands.

According to the New York Post, owner Charles Wang is trying to sell the team.

The Post reported Wang is in talks with Manhattan investment bank, The Raine Group, to sell the beleaguered franchise. But it will cost the bankers $300 million
http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.c...rs-up-for-sale

Quote:
Thus far, Raine has advised on several sports-related deals. Alongside Goldman Sachs, it advised the New Jersey Nets in September 2009 when it sold an 80% stake to Russia's Onexim Group for about $200 million. In August 2010, Raine advised the bankrupt Texas Rangers baseball team in its sale to a group led by baseball legend and Rangers' president Nolan Ryan and attorney Chuck Greenberg for about $608 million.

In June it advised hockey team the Atlanta Thrashers in its $170 million sale to Winnipeg, Manitoba-based True North Sport & Entertainment Ltd.

http://www.thedeal.com/content/priva...ate-equity.php

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Old
02-19-2013, 11:36 PM
  #66
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For Islanders fans, I hope he sells. While I can understand owners running teams as a business not for winning, it's just wrong for the fans. They deserve to see an owner put some money into the team.

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02-19-2013, 11:48 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
Have people forgotten that the Islanders are moving to a non-hockey arena with terrible sight lines? I just can't get over how stupid Wang has been throughout all of this. Why didn't Wang have a contingency plan in place when the Islanders were getting nowhere with their half baked 3 billion dollar development scheme? He should have been talking to the developers about a lease agreement when the Barclays Center was in the design phase. And how stupid could one be to sign a 40 year lease in a non-hockey arena without at least holding an exhibition game first?
It's a 25 year lease.

Wang never thought LI pols would be so clueless to not get a deal done.

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02-19-2013, 11:53 PM
  #68
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I hope they advise is the sale to Patty La! Wouldnt that be something...

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02-20-2013, 12:11 AM
  #69
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So if Wang was intending on selling the team all along, did he sign the deal with Barclays Center to screw LI or does that somehow make the team more valuable? Was he not intending on selling the team?

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02-20-2013, 07:28 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parker McDonald View Post
So if Wang was intending on selling the team all along, did he sign the deal with Barclays Center to screw LI or does that somehow make the team more valuable? Was he not intending on selling the team?
The team most definitely increases in value if it's playing in the City in a state of the art arena as opposed to a decrepit relic on suburban Long Island.

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02-20-2013, 08:02 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
The team most definitely increases in value if it's playing in the City in a state of the art arena as opposed to a decrepit relic on suburban Long Island.
But if he sells the team before they move to Brooklyn, would the value of the team go up just because they're going to move? The Nets' value didn't go up until after.

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02-20-2013, 11:17 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
The team most definitely increases in value if it's playing in the City in a state of the art arena as opposed to a decrepit relic on suburban Long Island.
That makes absolutely zero sense.

1. It's not a state of the art arena for hockey. It's a poorly configured basketball arena with bad sight lines and poor optics.

2. The franchise is no longer portable.

3. The franchise is tied to a long term lease that may or may not be favourable in the long run.

None of those conditions increase the value of a franchise to a potential owner. All of them in fact should lower the value.

The only thing this deal benefits is fans in the NY area because this basically assures that Islanders are not moving.

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02-20-2013, 12:03 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
That makes absolutely zero sense.

1. It's not a state of the art arena for hockey. It's a poorly configured basketball arena with bad sight lines and poor optics.

2. The franchise is no longer portable.

3. The franchise is tied to a long term lease that may or may not be favourable in the long run.

None of those conditions increase the value of a franchise to a potential owner. All of them in fact should lower the value.

The only thing this deal benefits is fans in the NY area because this basically assures that Islanders are not moving.
Or in other words the Islanders won't become the 8th Canadian NHL Franchise and that makes you

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02-20-2013, 12:24 PM
  #74
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But if he sells the team before they move to Brooklyn, would the value of the team go up just because they're going to move? The Nets' value didn't go up until after.
Per Forbes, the value has already gone up because of Brooklyn -

The value of the Islanders increased 4% over last year due to the team moving from the antiquated Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum to the new Barclays Arena for the 2015 season.


http://www.forbes.com/teams/new-york-islanders/

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02-20-2013, 12:38 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
That makes absolutely zero sense.

1. It's not a state of the art arena for hockey. It's a poorly configured basketball arena with bad sight lines and poor optics.

2. The franchise is no longer portable.

3. The franchise is tied to a long term lease that may or may not be favourable in the long run.

None of those conditions increase the value of a franchise to a potential owner. All of them in fact should lower the value.

The only thing this deal benefits is fans in the NY area because this basically assures that Islanders are not moving.
The value will go up because of marketability and revenue potential that NYC and related financial support brings. See above post for starters.

Why would a franchise need to be portable playing in the biggest city in North America? Why go anywhere else?

As for the sightlines, have you been there yet? I have and the sightlines are great even from the upper bowl. Perhaps that entire issue is HIGHLY overstated. While adding an upper level of luxury boxes, the Coliseum created hundreds if not thousands of obstructed seats in the last rows of their bowl. Views that are so bad, small screens hang off the upper level so that fans sitting in those last rows can watch the live event on TV! For whatever the reason though, most Islander fans have never complained about this.

Then thereís MSGÖ

NHL rinks are 200 ◊ 85 feet. They offer the narrowest dimensions of any of the major team sports played to be played on a rectangular surface. (by this Iím including soccer, football and hoops). MSG is shaped like cylinder. Fitting a 200◊85 rectangle into a circle leaves for incredibly poor sightlines. Yet Iíve never heard the Rangers, their fans, or the NHL complain.

If the lease allows NYI to increase in value half of what the Nets received from the move it will be incredible.

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