Who would you guys deal, Zibanejad or Silfverberg for O'Rielly if it came down to it.
Remember that Zibanejad and Landeskog are best friends since they were 9 so might play a role there.
Regardless, getting back one of the best 2 way centers in the game, who would you give up?
Extra question, who do you guys think will be better, Turris or O'Rielly?
I wouldn't give neither. One or the other, they'd be greedy and ask for a bit more. As they should, but Ottawa wouldn't want to pay the price.
Turris or O'Rielly? Tough one. I'd give O'Rielly the slight edge, but in 4-5 years with the right linemates, I think the production will be close from both.
I would trade Zibanejad for O'Reilly cause I think he has similar upside in terms of point production but ROR has an amazing 2 way game, is still young and can help us immediately. Wouldn't even care to add Wiercoch and a pick cause I think guys like Ceci and/or free agent signings can come in a few years and do similar things. Not to mention I think once Lundin shakes off the rust will fill his role fine.
No way I would trade Silf over Zib just cause our lack of potential top 6 wingers and decent centre depth.
You have a solid shut down man on each pairing, and an offensive guy. That's the way I think pairings work best. I know the positions may be wrong, but its semi-changeable. Then you have a back up in bingo to replace either a dfd or ofd.
I think if we come out of free agency with Streit, at least one top 6 winger, and if Alfie came back thats a legitimate contender.
You have a solid shut down man on each pairing, and an offensive guy. That's the way I think pairings work best. I know the positions may be wrong, but its semi-changeable. Then you have a back up in bingo to replace either a dfd or ofd.
I think if we come out of free agency with Streit, at least one top 6 winger, and if Alfie came back thats a legitimate contender.
So we're basing Havlat as a player on a 15 game sample size, and ignore the fact that he's never had a season in which he as under 0.73ppg since 2002?
And we'd rather keep a low-scoring grinder on a team full of low scoring grinders and not address the fact that we were thin in our top 6 even before Spezza and Michalek got hurt?
That's good talent assessment right there.
... Greening would be a pittance to pay for Havlat.
No, I am basing Havlat as a player on his while career, which is why I said he's the most one-dimensional player we've ever had, but just included his current production. His injury issues sort of go without saying, don't they? Obviously you are aware of that otherwise you likely wouldn't have gone for ppg numbers.
It was addition by subtraction when we traded him away. And presently he's not even bringing that one dimension. All the talent in the world, but no head to put it all together, and you'd trade a "low-scoring grinder" for a low-scoring, overpaid floater.
Completely unwilling to trade Silf until he's given a full season in Ottawa. He has a track record of starting off slow and once adapting, becomming a monster. He's slowly starting to get his groove in the Bigs, and while it might take a little longer than it did in the Swedish League or AHL, I want to see what he can do when he's had time to adjust.
Silf for RoR is completely off the table for me, as apart from what I wrote above, that would be trading a weakness (wingers) for a strength (centre) and makes no sense.
No, I am basing Havlat as a player on his while career, which is why I said he's the most one-dimensional player we've ever had, but just included his current production. His injury issues sort of go without saying, don't they? Obviously you are aware of that otherwise you likely wouldn't have gone for ppg numbers.
It was addition by subtraction when we traded him away. And presently he's not even bringing that one dimension. All the talent in the world, but no head to put it all together, and you'd trade a "low-scoring grinder" for a low-scoring, overpaid floater.
Well, if that's how you honestly see it, it's clear that what we have here is a fundamental difference in how we see Martin Havlat. If difference of opinions were measured in distance, one of us would be in the "Berkley" area of San Francisco, and the other in orbit around Neptune.
Honestly, we're probably so far from each others' opinion that it would be pointless to debate it further. We can just agree to disagree, and move on.
Well, if that's how you honestly see it, it's clear that what we have here is a fundamental difference in how we see Martin Havlat. If difference of opinions were measured in distance, one of us would be in the "Berkley" area of San Francisco, and the other in orbit around Neptune.
Honestly, we're probably so far from each others' opinion that it would be pointless to debate it further. We can just agree to disagree, and move on.
That's fair. I honestly thought Christmas came early when we traded him AND Smolinski.
Would the Avs take.... Smith, Wiercioch and Pick(not 1st) for ROR
Next year
Greening/Spezza/Michalek had success last year
Slifverberg/Turris/Alfredsson Playing well right now
Zibby/ROR/Stone Good young Line
Condra/O'brien/Neil
Method/Karlsson
Cowen/ UFA or trade
Phillips/ Gryba
I'd trade zib over silf for sure. Silf has pedigree and has shown he can score in various leagues. Zib has shown nothing and I think we picked him way to early at 6th overall
Right now it would seem to make sense to move Zibanejad over Silfverberg especially considering the talent coming back.
But most people on here are what have you done lately people, Zibanejad needs to develope more in the A he just came off 3 concussions... He shouldn't be up here right now.
Right now it would seem to make sense to move Zibanejad over Silfverberg especially considering the talent coming back.
But most people on here are what have you done lately people, Zibanejad needs to develope more in the A he just came off 3 concussions... He shouldn't be up here right now.
Right now it would seem to make sense to move Zibanejad over Silfverberg especially considering the talent coming back.
But most people on here are what have you done lately people, Zibanejad needs to develope more in the A he just came off 3 concussions... He shouldn't be up here right now.
I think you have to be realsitic about expectations. Silfverberg doesn't have Zibanejad's draft pedigree, but he has developed leaps and bounds since the draft. Even in his draft year he was viewed as a potential star, but there were a lot of questions. He gets better every year and he has shown the ability to dominate at various levels. (SEL -> AHL) He just takes time and is a slow starter (even in his MVP season last year he started pretty slowly). Every game you watch Silfverberg with Ottawa you can see that he is improving and catching onto things.
The biggest issue I have with Zibanejad is that I don't see improvement -- even from last year he looks like essentially the same player. I know he's had injury issues and problems, but I just don't see the elite upside in Zibanejad. He has never dominated any level of hockey (even the WJC...golden goal aside...he was outplayed by a lot of younger players where he should have had a big physical advantage).
Personally I don't think that Zibanejad has higher upside than a 2nd line winger. Maybe that's just me. If you can provide some kind of evidence that points elsewhere besides 'he has nice tools' that would really be encouraging.
I'm much more optimistic about our 1st round pick last year in Ceci. I think last year was just not a good draft year for us.
One in Sweden last year, one when he came to the AHL during the playoffs and never played(which may have been still from the firsts not really talked about) and one this year (but also may have been lingering from last year).
All I can tell you is there are 3 times separated by months at a time were he had concussion symptoms.
I think you have to be realsitic about expectations. Silfverberg doesn't have Zibanejad's draft pedigree, but he has developed leaps and bounds since the draft. Even in his draft year he was viewed as a potential star, but there were a lot of questions. He gets better every year and he has shown the ability to dominate at various levels. (SEL -> AHL) He just takes time and is a slow starter (even in his MVP season last year he started pretty slowly). Every game you watch Silfverberg with Ottawa you can see that he is improving and catching onto things.
The biggest issue I have with Zibanejad is that I don't see improvement -- even from last year he looks like essentially the same player. I know he's had injury issues and problems, but I just don't see the elite upside in Zibanejad. He has never dominated any level of hockey (even the WJC...golden goal aside...he was outplayed by a lot of younger players where he should have had a big physical advantage).
Personally I don't think that Zibanejad has higher upside than a 2nd line winger. Maybe that's just me. If you can provide some kind of evidence that points elsewhere besides 'he has nice tools' that would really be encouraging.
I'm much more optimistic about our 1st round pick last year in Ceci. I think last year was just not a good draft year for us.
Second line would be great IMO I'd be really happy. My point isn't that he's amazing it actually kind of coincides with what your saying.
Basically he hasn't been developing very well and has struggled through some bad head injuries.
We need to put him in the A like we did with all our prospects and leave him their until he starts getting better. It's becoming obvious that he is a bit of a project with good upside and should be treated as such.
