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Bruins-Flyers talking trade?

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Old
02-22-2013, 12:08 PM
  #76
Djp
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from Lyle Richardson---

CSNNE.COM: Joe Haggarty reports Boston Bruins GM Peter Chiarelli was in Pittsburgh on Wednesday watching the Penguins take on the Philadelphia Flyers, and spent the entire second intermission chatting with Flyers GM Paul Holmgren. The Flyers are believed in the market for a defenseman, while the Bruins would like to add depth on the wing. Haggarty wondered if Chiarelli had Flyers winger Ruslan Fedotenko or Penguins forward Tyler Kennedy in mind, or if Holmgren might be considering a bigger deal.

SPECTOR’S NOTE: The Bruins have the cap space (around $8 million) to add another player or two, but the Flyers (even with Chris Pronger on LTIR) are uncomfortably close to the cap ceiling, meaning Holmgren would have to either make a salary-for-salary deal, or shed more salary than he’s taking back. Should be worth keeping an eye on these two clubs in the coming weeks.

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Old
02-22-2013, 12:26 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by zaYG View Post
Not fair at all, but Seids is arguably our most important player come playoffs.
I hate when people say this and they say it more than I would think.

Seidenberg looks so good because he plays with Chara in the playoffs. Chara is the guy, not Seidenberg as much as I do like him. Chara makes Seidenberg look a lot better and it is Chara who is important to the Bruins.

With Chara, Seidenberg is a great #2 shutdown D, without Chara he is a very good #3D, who is the more important player? Chara is always a great #1 D.

Chara is the most important player to the Bruins, then Bergeron, then Rask, after that you can start arguing whether Seidenberg is more important than Lucic or Krejci or Marchand.

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02-22-2013, 12:42 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by nmbr_24 View Post
I hate when people say this and they say it more than I would think.

Seidenberg looks so good because he plays with Chara in the playoffs. Chara is the guy, not Seidenberg as much as I do like him. Chara makes Seidenberg look a lot better and it is Chara who is important to the Bruins.

With Chara, Seidenberg is a great #2 shutdown D, without Chara he is a very good #3D, who is the more important player? Chara is always a great #1 D.

Chara is the most important player to the Bruins, then Bergeron, then Rask, after that you can start arguing whether Seidenberg is more important than Lucic or Krejci or Marchand.
It's pretty safe to say that Seidenberg was leaps and bounds better than anyone else on the roster in the series against the Caps last year. I hate to say it, but as amazing as Chara still is, he isn't AS dominant as he was a few years back.

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Old
02-22-2013, 01:19 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by zaYG View Post
It's pretty safe to say that Seidenberg was leaps and bounds better than anyone else on the roster in the series against the Caps last year. I hate to say it, but as amazing as Chara still is, he isn't AS dominant as he was a few years back.
I don't agree with this at all, Seidenberg cannot be the player you are talking about without Chara, he is not the player you are talking about. Chara makes him into such a good player. Chara was better than Seidenberg against the Caps with a lot more responsibility and he is better than him now. Losing either player would hurt the team, but losing Chara is something they have no chance of recovering from. I thought last years regular season was pretty close to Chara's best season and it was statistically.

Seidenberg is half the player Chara is.

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02-22-2013, 01:51 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by nmbr_24 View Post
I don't agree with this at all, Seidenberg cannot be the player you are talking about without Chara, he is not the player you are talking about. Chara makes him into such a good player. Chara was better than Seidenberg against the Caps with a lot more responsibility and he is better than him now. Losing either player would hurt the team, but losing Chara is something they have no chance of recovering from. I thought last years regular season was pretty close to Chara's best season and it was statistically.

Seidenberg is half the player Chara is.
A tangent, based on your statement, if I may -

This is something other teams fans' need to be aware of with the Flyers, when alluding to why the Flyers may be struggling on the backend - including the Flyers fans, who criticize Holmgren for not "finding a suitable #1 D to replace knowing Pronger was done.". No matter what, contract aside, after Pronger went down permanently (after only a year and a half of playing), the Flyers lost any hope of being solid competitors. It takes years to recover from things like that. Even if Pronger wasn't the COMPLETELY dominant defenseman he was at 30 years old, he was still playing at an elite level as a top 5 d-man at 36, and would have been (much like Chara, Lidstrom) for at least a couple of more years.

And as such, if they go down, you just cannot replace them easiliy. Period. Everybody knew for the last 3 years that Lidstrom was on the verge of retiring. Even if he still was on the team, it was inevitable - so why haven't the wings in the last year just found a replacement - should be easy right? They had at least 3 years. Kronwall isn't a replacement, FYI.

Why? Because you can't replace those types of players, besides just their ability on the ice.

-

Regarding your post, I agree with you. Pronger made Carle look phenomenal - without him, he's just a middling defenseman. The elite players can do that - they can raise your "rank" 1-2 notches just by their presence alone.

Doesn't mean the players they play with are bad, or aren't great, they're just not as much so, and I don't think talent evaluators and GMs are fooled by such things. Few GM would consider Carle a top pairing d-man - he is what he is, a middle pair, decently reliable puck mover - but can fill in on the top pair if you have a dominant defenseman already there, to spread out your #2 onto the second pair (like the Flyers did with Timonen).

I'm not saying Seidenberg will be cheap, but I don't think he holds more than any other middle pairing d-man.

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02-22-2013, 02:49 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by thedjpd View Post
A tangent, based on your statement, if I may -

This is something other teams fans' need to be aware of with the Flyers, when alluding to why the Flyers may be struggling on the backend - including the Flyers fans, who criticize Holmgren for not "finding a suitable #1 D to replace knowing Pronger was done.". No matter what, contract aside, after Pronger went down permanently (after only a year and a half of playing), the Flyers lost any hope of being solid competitors. It takes years to recover from things like that. Even if Pronger wasn't the COMPLETELY dominant defenseman he was at 30 years old, he was still playing at an elite level as a top 5 d-man at 36, and would have been (much like Chara, Lidstrom) for at least a couple of more years.

And as such, if they go down, you just cannot replace them easiliy. Period. Everybody knew for the last 3 years that Lidstrom was on the verge of retiring. Even if he still was on the team, it was inevitable - so why haven't the wings in the last year just found a replacement - should be easy right? They had at least 3 years. Kronwall isn't a replacement, FYI.

Why? Because you can't replace those types of players, besides just their ability on the ice.

-

Regarding your post, I agree with you. Pronger made Carle look phenomenal - without him, he's just a middling defenseman. The elite players can do that - they can raise your "rank" 1-2 notches just by their presence alone.

Doesn't mean the players they play with are bad, or aren't great, they're just not as much so, and I don't think talent evaluators and GMs are fooled by such things. Few GM would consider Carle a top pairing d-man - he is what he is, a middle pair, decently reliable puck mover - but can fill in on the top pair if you have a dominant defenseman already there, to spread out your #2 onto the second pair (like the Flyers did with Timonen).

I'm not saying Seidenberg will be cheap, but I don't think he holds more than any other middle pairing d-man.
I agree completely and I think Seidenberg is a fantastic D, but Chara takes him to another level. That isn't meant to belittle Seidenberg at all, just to stress the reality of the situation.

Like you said, the Flyers with Pronger and the Flyers without Pronger are different teams just like the Bruins would be without Chara and while it would be difficult to replace Seidenberg, it is a heck of a lot easier than replacing a Chara or a Pronger.

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Old
02-22-2013, 03:35 PM
  #82
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I hope not. Rinaldo is developing into someone quite useful. Besides, the Bruins have enough tough guys.

I'd give you Briere in a heartbeat, though. Especially if, like others mentioned, a 1st rounder is coming back our way. I figure he is getting amnestied after the season anyway by the Flyers.
This might be the plan of the Bruins. Amnesty buy-out at season end. Bring him in as a rental.

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Old
02-22-2013, 09:27 PM
  #83
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Would Briere waive his NTC for Boston (even with the likelihood of him getting amnestied in the offseason)? He has a custody agreement and its always mentioned how involved he is as a Dad (as much as a pro athlete can be). Though he did spend half the year in Germany, so I suppose he'd manage.

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02-22-2013, 09:36 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by The Flin Flon Bomber View Post
Would Briere waive his NTC for Boston (even with the likelihood of him getting amnestied in the offseason)? He has a custody agreement and its always mentioned how involved he is as a Dad (as much as a pro athlete can be). Though he did spend half the year in Germany, so I suppose he'd manage.
He'd be an idiot not to want a buy-out. Briere would get 3-5 mil per season on a new contract depending on his performance. Add the cash balance of his current contract and it would be a huge net gain for him.

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02-22-2013, 09:38 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by ap3lovr View Post
He'd be an idiot not to want a buy-out. Briere would get 3-5 mil per season on a new contract depending on his performance. Add the cash balance of his current contract and it would be a huge net gain for him.
the question is does his ntc get voided if he's traded? Many of them do so the Bruins may not have to buy him out in that instance as he can be traded again in the off season.

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02-22-2013, 10:08 PM
  #86
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Fedotenko + Zolnierczyk

For

Ference


????

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Old
02-22-2013, 10:27 PM
  #87
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Fedotenko + Zolnierczyk

For

Ference


????
That is very fair value and would help the Bruins, but I don't think any Ference replacements are ready yet.

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Old
02-23-2013, 11:05 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Peso View Post
Fedotenko + Zolnierczyk

For

Ference


????
I'll give Ference to you for a cool looking rock this season...

But I do agree with cursed, unfortunately we don't exactly have anyone who's better than him in our system.

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Old
02-24-2013, 10:26 AM
  #89
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Briere+3rd+Wellwood/Zolnierzyk for Hamilton+1st

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02-24-2013, 10:27 AM
  #90
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Briere+3rd+Wellwood/Zolnierzyk for Hamilton+1st
The Flyers won't get a young player with the potential of Hamilton for Briere.


Last edited by PayItForward: 02-24-2013 at 10:35 AM.
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Old
02-24-2013, 10:30 AM
  #91
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Briere+3rd+Wellwood/Zolnierzyk for Hamilton+1st
I can't believe you added a first, as if Hamilton for that package wasn't brutal enough.

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02-24-2013, 10:36 AM
  #92
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Briere+3rd+Wellwood/Zolnierzyk for Hamilton+1st
I'll copy and paste my post

Why would boston do this let alone add a first?

Briere could definitely fetch a 1st + prospect himelf, but the 3rd + wellwood doesn't make up for Hamilton at all.

Wellwood is a dime a dozen player. Fast, okay hands, not great at anything but not glaringly bad at anything

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02-24-2013, 10:50 AM
  #93
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Most the Flyers should expect for Briere is a 1st and maybe a middling prospect. Probably a reclamation project.

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02-24-2013, 10:56 AM
  #94
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Most the Flyers should expect for Briere is a 1st and maybe a middling prospect. Probably a reclamation project.
I disagree. He's still a good scoring player especially in the playoffs. His defensive game is terrible and it just gets magnified with the flyers since the wingers he usually play with aren't the most defensively capable wingers. A team like the Bruins that plays a solid game all around would really benefit with him as a winger

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02-24-2013, 11:01 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
I'll copy and paste my post

Why would boston do this let alone add a first?

Briere could definitely fetch a 1st + prospect himelf, but the 3rd + wellwood doesn't make up for Hamilton at all.

Wellwood is a dime a dozen player. Fast, okay hands, not great at anything but not glaringly bad at anything
Looking at the flyers board he's been garbage this year, yet they want Dougie H ? There is only ONE player on that roster I would be willing trade Dougie for.

Briere will not fetch what flyers fans hope. A First ? No . Prospects ? Yes, and a middle of the road roster player.

You win championships with great defencemen ( I think Dougie is going to be a real good one ). Watching the Flyers and Pens games are fun but man they both stink in net and on D.

I say if the B's trade with the Flyers its for depth nothing more.

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Old
02-24-2013, 11:03 AM
  #96
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Looking at the flyers board he's been garbage this year, yet they want Dougie H ? There is only ONE player on that roster I would be willing trade Dougie for.

Briere will not fetch what flyers fans hope. A First ? No . Prospects ? Yes, and a middle of the road roster player.

You win championships with great defencemen ( I think Dougie is going to be a real good one ). Watching the Flyers and Pens games are fun but man they both stink in net and on D.

I say if the B's trade with the Flyers its for depth nothing more.
I agree. Fedetenko for a 3rd most likely

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Old
02-24-2013, 11:12 AM
  #97
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Looking at the flyers board he's been garbage this year, yet they want Dougie H ? There is only ONE player on that roster I would be willing trade Dougie for.

Briere will not fetch what flyers fans hope. A First ? No . Prospects ? Yes, and a middle of the road roster player.

You win championships with great defencemen ( I think Dougie is going to be a real good one ). Watching the Flyers and Pens games are fun but man they both stink in net and on D.

I say if the B's trade with the Flyers its for depth nothing more.
Briere would definitely grab at least a first especially in this market

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Old
02-24-2013, 11:22 AM
  #98
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Briere would definitely grab at least a first especially in this market
No sure if a market has been established yet. Time will tell.

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Old
02-24-2013, 11:24 AM
  #99
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Briere would definitely grab at least a first especially in this market
2 years left on his contract. Not likely he gets dealt this year and if he were to be dealt, it wouldn't be for a 1st + anything.

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Old
02-24-2013, 12:37 PM
  #100
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I disagree. He's still a good scoring player especially in the playoffs. His defensive game is terrible and it just gets magnified with the flyers since the wingers he usually play with aren't the most defensively capable wingers. A team like the Bruins that plays a solid game all around would really benefit with him as a winger
I was referring to the prospect. The prospect would be a reclamation project. Think everyone knows what they're getting in Briere; a defensive liability but an explosive scorer that amps his game when it counts.

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