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2014 Memorial Cup Location

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Old
02-21-2013, 11:09 AM
  #176
RayzorIsDull
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Originally Posted by aresknights View Post
Reading between the lines? Fair enough.

Maybe they bailed because they know the Spits have a cooked deal with the O? Maybe Mark has put the bid outta reach. Shouldnt he put his best bid forward?
Maybe Guelph bailed because they realize even having the Memorial Cup 11-12 years ago is still too small of a gap to bid again.

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02-21-2013, 11:20 AM
  #177
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Reading between the lines? Fair enough.

Maybe they bailed because they know the Spits have a cooked deal with the O? Maybe Mark has put the bid outta reach. Shouldnt he put his best bid forward?
They are fully within their rights to put together a bid that no one else can match. Considering the wealth of the Knights (richest in the league by far?) they can blow other teams out of the water every 3 years.
Is it right?...is it good partnership with the other teams?
I just think having 2 or 3 teams having a chance to win the bid because of wealth is just bad for the league. Imagine how teams and fans in OS, Erie or other small teams feel?
Does this mean the league should bring in a certain time frame between winning the bid and the next time they can bid?
I personally wouldn't want that but this may bring about such a rule.
Those are questions that we all may have different answers to but no one will be wrong.

Too bad having a host team and host city is one and same.

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02-21-2013, 12:44 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by Ward Cornell View Post
They are fully within their rights to put together a bid that no one else can match. Considering the wealth of the Knights (richest in the league by far?) they can blow other teams out of the water every 3 years.
Is it right?...is it good partnership with the other teams?
I just think having 2 or 3 teams having a chance to win the bid because of wealth is just bad for the league. Imagine how teams and fans in OS, Erie or other small teams feel?
Does this mean the league should bring in a certain time frame between winning the bid and the next time they can bid?
I personally wouldn't want that but this may bring about such a rule.
Those are questions that we all may have different answers to but no one will be wrong.

Too bad having a host team and host city is one and same.
Why did Kitchener get the host spot in 2008 instead of Oshawa?
$$$$$$$$$$
Yet the Hunters are jerks for submitting the highest bid? Isn't that the point? I'm sure Ottawa could guarantee more with a bigger city and arena.
Listen, I don't think London should get it, but why aren't teams like Oshawa, Kingston or even the Soo applying?

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02-21-2013, 01:21 PM
  #179
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Why did Kitchener get the host spot in 2008 instead of Oshawa?
$$$$$$$$$$
Yet the Hunters are jerks for submitting the highest bid? Isn't that the point? I'm sure Ottawa could guarantee more with a bigger city and arena.
Listen, I don't think London should get it, but why aren't teams like Oshawa, Kingston or even the Soo applying?
Kitchener got the hosting job through nothing but dollars, huh? Right...

I wish Oshawa and/or Kingston had bid, but they obviously felt they weren't in a position to ice a competitive team (which is legit in Oshawa with the players they'll graduate) or to present a competitive bid.

Smaller centres in the Q and W are awarded the hosting duties, and I'd bet they're not guaranteeing the massive returns the OHL does. If London gets the Memorial Cup in 2014, we might as well make hotel arrangements for Ottawa in 2017 and London again in 2020. They'll be the only two places that are deemed acceptable by the effed up OHL.

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02-21-2013, 02:18 PM
  #180
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http://www.guelphmercury.com/news/lo...t-memorial-cup

“There’s a process involved that you have to follow very strictly and diligently in preparing a bid and we’re not going to go any further,”

Hoyle said finances were part of the Storm’s decision not to proceed, but not the only reason. He declined to discuss those other reasons.

“That’s internal with the OHL,” Hoyle said.


Hoyle was asked if the financial realities of hosting the Memorial Cup put small and mid-market teams like Guelph with smaller arenas behind the eight ball when looking to host it.

“They’re not automatically excluded, but the odds aren’t in your favour,” he said.

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02-21-2013, 02:55 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Kitchener got the hosting job through nothing but dollars, huh? Right...

I wish Oshawa and/or Kingston had bid, but they obviously felt they weren't in a position to ice a competitive team (which is legit in Oshawa with the players they'll graduate) or to present a competitive bid.

Smaller centres in the Q and W are awarded the hosting duties, and I'd bet they're not guaranteeing the massive returns the OHL does. If London gets the Memorial Cup in 2014, we might as well make hotel arrangements for Ottawa in 2017 and London again in 2020. They'll be the only two places that are deemed acceptable by the effed up OHL.
Probably not the only reason but you have to admit it was the main reason. Just like why Mississauga got it in 2011 instead of Windsor. Oshawa was the favourite with the new arena and the superstar in Tavares, but the Rangers ended up hosting.

Kingston has the talent, and the trading pieces, to have a strong team next year. I think the only thing missing from Kingston's potential bid is fan support. Although that didn't kill Missy's chances. So it must be the cheap owner. Too bad

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02-21-2013, 03:42 PM
  #182
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Just like why Mississauga got it in 2011 instead of Windsor.
I think part of it was because the league wanted to try to showcase junior hockey to a struggling junior hockey market. Basically..."this is the best of the best. Come see!!" If you can't market junior hockey in a major metropolis when the best teams are involved, you won't market it, period.

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02-21-2013, 03:52 PM
  #183
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Probably not the only reason but you have to admit it was the main reason. Just like why Mississauga got it in 2011 instead of Windsor. Oshawa was the favourite with the new arena and the superstar in Tavares, but the Rangers ended up hosting.
Oshawa was the favourite going in, but from what I understand, their presentation was a total bleepshow. It may have been theirs to lose, and they did. I'm sure they learned a lot from that experience (same as Kitchener did in 2005) and could put together an attractive bid this time around.

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02-21-2013, 04:18 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Oshawa was the favourite going in, but from what I understand, their presentation was a total bleepshow. It may have been theirs to lose, and they did. I'm sure they learned a lot from that experience (same as Kitchener did in 2005) and could put together an attractive bid this time around.
Exactly...usually teams or cities will do an initial application for the Memorial Cup or Olympic Games not really expecting to win but just to learn from the experience. Of course, no team will turn down a successful initial application.

ps....and yes from what I recall from the remarks at the time the Generals/Oshawas presentation was a total bleepshow.

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02-21-2013, 05:05 PM
  #185
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Don't think London should get it either based on fairness. let's not forget that Kitchener hosted twice in 9 years and 3 times in total...no one else has even hosted twice if I'm not mistaken so I don't see how this is the Hunters' problem if their rink is bigger, team is better and other teams aren't putting in bids.

If you're going by fairness, since only 3 teams are bidding, this should be Barrie's for the taking.

If you're going by guaranteed money (with no help from their crook of a mayor Joe Fontana) and quality of team compared to the other teams submitting bids, it should be London's.

Just wish other teams would bid at this point. I mean if Shawinigan could host last year, anyone could host.

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02-21-2013, 05:22 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Ward Cornell View Post
They are fully within their rights to put together a bid that no one else can match. Considering the wealth of the Knights (richest in the league by far?) they can blow other teams out of the water every 3 years.
Is it right?...is it good partnership with the other teams?
I just think having 2 or 3 teams having a chance to win the bid because of wealth is just bad for the league. Imagine how teams and fans in OS, Erie or other small teams feel?
Does this mean the league should bring in a certain time frame between winning the bid and the next time they can bid?
I personally wouldn't want that but this may bring about such a rule.
Those are questions that we all may have different answers to but no one will be wrong.

Too bad having a host team and host city is one and same.
I agree, it would be best to spread it around, as much as possible. If there are any credible bids le tthem have it, no worries here.
I was responding as much for the pompous jerks comment. I feel MArk if bidding has to put his best foot forward is all. Is that pompous/ Not sure
Im not sure it was garaunteed money from London that caused Guelph to bail. As eluded to in the article Razor poated- other reasons-internal with OHL. Im still thinking they bailed because its a forgone conclusion barring anything unforeseen at this point. And not neccessarily for London Well see how it plays out.

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02-21-2013, 05:25 PM
  #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aresknights
Reading between the lines? Fair enough.

Maybe they bailed because they know the Spits have a cooked deal with the O? Maybe Mark has put the bid outta reach. Shouldnt he put his best bid forward?



Quote:
Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
Maybe Guelph bailed because they realize even having the Memorial Cup 11-12 years ago is still too small of a gap to bid again.
I have to figure theyd a known that prior to starting the process. Are you suggesting they didnt?

I still think it has to do with the league already having a plan and they felt it wasnt worth the bother oncce they got the inside scoop. But hey maybe your right, hehy just forgot they recently hosted

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02-21-2013, 06:47 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
I was told by somebody in 2003/2004 who's very close to the selection process that the very reasons you mentioned is the reason why an american team will not host the cup.
(THIS POST IS NOT DIRECTED AT YOU RAYZOR, IT IS DIRECTED AT THOSE WHO CHOOSE THE MEMORIAL CUP HOST)

Why doesn't the CHL get rid of the American teams they have then and ban American players from coming into a league that plays Canada's game, which no one else should be allowed to play by the way. Small market teams don't have a shot at hosting already, now you the CHL wants to exclude more teams? This is just f**ked up in my opinion.

I'll apologize on behalf of all Americans for taking an interest in Canada's game. We should be so foolish to try and enjoy or play it.

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02-22-2013, 12:43 PM
  #189
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if you've ever been to the Sault you'd almost want the memorial cup here once....hahhaha

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02-22-2013, 10:57 PM
  #190
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Normally, a team shouldn't be hosting twice in 9 years. But I think London can put forth, by far, the best bid.

So there were 4 teams that submitted their letters of interest (Guelph, Barrie, Windsor and London). Guelph apparently has chosen not to bid.

Windsor would be ideal, since their fans seem to think they got snubbed in 2010, but will Branch think they can ice a team that can compete with the best of all three leagues? On paper, they have a couple of nice returning players but IMO, not nearly the best lineup (if they do get the hosting gig, they'll likely land a couple of players). They've missed the playoffs two years in a row as well. I'm not convinced they have the team to do it. Otherwise, they would be the most deserving ($$$, coaching, arena and facilities).

I think this is between London and Barrie. Barrie will lose Scheifele, Beyers and Camara. They'll return AA and Hall. I think a couple of players will step up for next year, but they look like a one-line team for new year (upon first glance).

London returns Stolarz, who I think will (and is showing to be already) be a very capable goaltender. On defence, Hughes and Harrington are gone. That's a big loss, but we return Maatta, Zadorov, Liberati, Mermis and likely Sefton. One of Di Lorenzo and Centorame will come up the ranks. They return their forwards, unless Griffith sticks in the AHL.

So yeah, I think either London or Barrie gets it. I don't agree with a team getting it twice in 9 years, but I think London has the best bid.

Could be wrong, though

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02-22-2013, 11:48 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Snippit View Post
Normally, a team shouldn't be hosting twice in 9 years. But I think London can put forth, by far, the best bid.

So there were 4 teams that submitted their letters of interest (Guelph, Barrie, Windsor and London). Guelph apparently has chosen not to bid.

Windsor would be ideal, since their fans seem to think they got snubbed in 2010, but will Branch think they can ice a team that can compete with the best of all three leagues? On paper, they have a couple of nice returning players but IMO, not nearly the best lineup (if they do get the hosting gig, they'll likely land a couple of players). They've missed the playoffs two years in a row as well. I'm not convinced they have the team to do it. Otherwise, they would be the most deserving ($$$, coaching, arena and facilities).

I think this is between London and Barrie. Barrie will lose Scheifele, Beyers and Camara. They'll return AA and Hall. I think a couple of players will step up for next year, but they look like a one-line team for new year (upon first glance).

London returns Stolarz, who I think will (and is showing to be already) be a very capable goaltender. On defence, Hughes and Harrington are gone. That's a big loss, but we return Maatta, Zadorov, Liberati, Mermis and likely Sefton. One of Di Lorenzo and Centorame will come up the ranks. They return their forwards, unless Griffith sticks in the AHL.

So yeah, I think either London or Barrie gets it. I don't agree with a team getting it twice in 9 years, but I think London has the best bid.

Could be wrong, though

Correction Windsor has not missed playoffs 2 years in a row,its only this year

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02-23-2013, 12:04 AM
  #192
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Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
Also the people that mention they don't want a Saskatoon situation blowing up in their faces the Blades have now won 11 in a row and have taken over 1st place in division for 2nd seed in the conference. I doubt those same people are saying this about Saskatoon now.
Saskatoon isn't really a comparative for Windsor. Beyond the fact that they had a winning record and made the playoffs last year, the winning streak has been a function of trade deadline deals. They traded away four picks at the deadline, including their '13 and '15 first rounders to bulk up their roster. This is after trading their '14 first rounder and two 3rd rounders earlier this season. Since:

a) The Spits are not going to have the base that Saskatoon had at the end of the season,
b) You can't trade a first rounder in the OHL,
c) Even if you could, the Spits don't have them anyway to trade,

contemplating that Windsor might somehow be able to replicate the feat is somewhat laughable.

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02-23-2013, 12:25 AM
  #193
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Windsor International Airport is served by Air Canada, Porter and WestJet so there would be no difficulties at all for people trying to Windsor from all over Canada. Many Americans prefer to fly out of Windsor to Canadian destinations rather than use Detroit airports. And a cup-winning team at a Windsor tournament may even consider flying out of Windsor on Sunwing to party in locales such as Cuba or Mexico.
I know Windsor has an international airport. I've flown there, and every other international airport in Canada Thunder Bay and East. Here's the thing, there aren't many CHL fans in Cuba. It won't matter so much for the actual teams, I presume they can charter a plane directly to Windsor. For fans and media however, you are much better off flying to Pearson and driving to Barrie than you are flying to Windsor. Why? Because in all likelyhood you'll have to connnect through Pearson anyway. Look at couple teams that may contend for the various titles next season:

Edmonton: Minimum 7+ hours to Windsor International, more likely 12+. Barrie would be less than 5 including the drive.

Halifax: 5-6 hours, compared to 3:15 for Barrie including the drive.

Plus you have the hassle of a connection in both cases to Windsor. Also, there is the cost factor. The only option is Air Canada. In most cases you're going to have a West Jet option to Pearson as well (very few West Jet options to Windsor). Halifax to Windsor would run you ~ $615 if you booked today over Memorial Cup weekend (that's without the demand that would be created if the Memorial Cup were actually in Windsor this year). Halifax to Toronto you could get for ~ $500.

For the above reasons, I think the GTA teams (+Barrie, Guelph) have a travel advantage for fans and media over London and Windsor. As I mentioned in my OP, I can also tell you that Mississauga presented it as an advantage in their bid in 2011. How much of advantage it actually was or will be this year, that I'm less sure of.

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02-23-2013, 12:28 AM
  #194
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Smaller centres in the Q and W are awarded the hosting duties, and I'd bet they're not guaranteeing the massive returns the OHL does. If London gets the Memorial Cup in 2014, we might as well make hotel arrangements for Ottawa in 2017 and London again in 2020. They'll be the only two places that are deemed acceptable by the effed up OHL.
With Kitchener having an outside shot. They should absolutely look at a minimum number of years between bids. Most professional leagues do it with the All-Star game for example...

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02-23-2013, 01:03 AM
  #195
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Saskatoon isn't really a comparative for Windsor. Beyond the fact that they had a winning record and made the playoffs last year, the winning streak has been a function of trade deadline deals. They traded away four picks at the deadline, including their '13 and '15 first rounders to bulk up their roster. This is after trading their '14 first rounder and two 3rd rounders earlier this season. Since:

a) The Spits are not going to have the base that Saskatoon had at the end of the season,
b) You can't trade a first rounder in the OHL,
c) Even if you could, the Spits don't have them anyway to trade,

contemplating that Windsor might somehow be able to replicate the feat is somewhat laughable.
I have to respectfully disagree. If you want to say that Saskatoon is better last year than Windsor is this year that's fine I won't discuss that. To say Windsor doesn't have the base Saskatoon had would be incorrect in my mind. Going into this year Saskatoon had.

Stransky 6th round pick
Nicholls 7th round pick
Sutter 2nd round pick
Thrower 2nd round pick
Dietz 5th round pick
Siemens 1st round pick

Players acquired this year for a run

McColgan 5th round pick
Ferland 5th round pick


Windsor for next year

Sieloff 2nd rounder
Koekkoekk 1st rounder
Vail 4th rounder
Johnson 3rd rounder
Ebert 7th rounder
Rychel 1st or 2nd round pick this year

I fail to see how Saskatoon was some great contender for this year and Windsor can't host the Memorial Cup.

Windsor has 2 1st round import picks this year both which should be top 20 picks. Throw in Ho-Sang who should be a top pick in the 2014 draft. I don't see how the Saskatoon base is any better.

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02-23-2013, 01:06 AM
  #196
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Kitchener got the hosting job through nothing but dollars, huh? Right...

I wish Oshawa and/or Kingston had bid, but they obviously felt they weren't in a position to ice a competitive team (which is legit in Oshawa with the players they'll graduate) or to present a competitive bid.

Smaller centres in the Q and W are awarded the hosting duties, and I'd bet they're not guaranteeing the massive returns the OHL does. If London gets the Memorial Cup in 2014, we might as well make hotel arrangements for Ottawa in 2017 and London again in 2020. They'll be the only two places that are deemed acceptable by the effed up OHL.
Exactly what I am pointing at. Who would want to bid in the OHL for future Memorial Cups if it is all big market teams. OHL will be losing out on a lot of money if that is the case.

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02-23-2013, 01:17 AM
  #197
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Exactly what I am pointing at. Who would want to bid in the OHL for future Memorial Cups if it is all big market teams. OHL will be losing out on a lot of money if that is the case.
Have several teams not bid after Kitchener hosted in '75 and '84?

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02-23-2013, 05:01 AM
  #198
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Have several teams not bid after Kitchener hosted in '75 and '84?
I believe they have. I believe Barrie has bid for almost every one since they entered the league. They've bid on 99, 11, and 14 for sure. Kingston and Windsor (at least twice) have also bid. Obviously Oshawa, SSM, Peterborough, Ottawa, Guelph and London have also bid since 84, as they have been hosts since then. Since 75, Barrie and Kingston may be the only teams to have bid and not been awarded a cup.

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02-23-2013, 05:28 AM
  #199
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Originally Posted by RayzorIsDull View Post
Windsor has 2 1st round import picks this year both which should be top 20 picks. Throw in Ho-Sang who should be a top pick in the 2014 draft. I don't see how the Saskatoon base is any better.
It's not just the NHL potential, it's how good they are now. Aren't you the guy whow was arguing for Ellis over Pietrangelo in the 2010 final? Maybe not. It's also about their age. The Blades are an older team now than the Spits will be - some of their drafted players are already overagers. Will the Spits have drafted overagers? It's not looking that way.

At the end of the day, it comes down to these facts: The Blades achieved more with the pieces they had during their bid year than the Spitfires, AND they had more assets to trade in the offseason/the following season to make themselves better. The Spitfires look like they're going to finish out of the playoffs (maybe in the bottom three) and they have limited picks/young players to improve themselves.

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02-23-2013, 07:50 AM
  #200
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Saskatoon is currently on a 14 game winning streak. Saskatoon also made the playoffs last season with a 40 win season. End of discussion.

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