What could we get by eating some of our losses and moving Connolly, Kommasarek, Liles and Gardiner? You're mistaken if you think Carlyle wants easy to play against D in his lineup. You don't win Stanley Cups with D like Gardiner/Liles. Maybe Colorado believes they can? Been awhile since they've been around in June. All 4 of the above for ROR? Lol
No thanks, i'd rather offer sheet ROR and let the chips fall.
Phaneuf was a better defenseman at O'Reilly's age than O'Reilly is a center.
How many Norris trophies has Phaneuf won since he was a finalist? How many times as he been in the top 3? How about Mike Green in Washington? Nick Backstrom must surely be the best center in the game since he had 88 points as a 21 year old and 101 points as a 22 year old.
It is great that 21 and 22 year olds always get better as 23 and 24 year olds. Progressive improvement is guaranteed. Well that is the theory I'm hearing.
2007-2008 Norris Trophy Voting
1. Nicklas Lidstrom, DET 1313 (127-5-1-1-0) 2. Dion Phaneuf, CGY 561 (2-38-37-26-12)
3. Zdeno Chara, BOS 486 (3-38-23-21-12)
4. Sergei Gonchar, PIT 370 (1-24-21-21-24)
5. Brian Campbell, S.J. 333 (1-18-16-31-24)
6. Andrei Markov, MTL 156 (0-4-15-11-20)
7. Mike Green, WSH 84 (0-1-7-10-12)
8. Chris Pronger, ANA 56 (0-2-5-5-2)
9. Brian Rafalski, DET 25 (0-1-1-2-7)
10. Scott Niedermayer, ANA 22 (0-2-1-1-0)
11. Duncan Keith, CHI 19 (0-0-2-0-9)
12. Brent Burns, MIN 14 (0-0-2-1-1)
13. Mark Streit, MTL 11 (0-1-0-1-1)
14. Mathieu Schneider, ANA 9 (0-0-1-1-1)
15. Ed Jovanovski, PHX 8 (0-0-1-1-0)
16. Wade Redden, OTT 3 (0-0-0-1-0)
17. Joe Corvo, CAR 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Jassen Cullimore, FLA 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Tomas Kaberle, TOR 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Mike Komisarek, MTL 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
John-Michael Liles, COL 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Andrej Meszaros, OTT 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Kimmo Timonen, PHI 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Shea Weber, NSH 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Sergei Zubov, DAL 1 (0-0-0-0-1)
Don't have to look far to see that progression isn't linear.
Just because O'Reilly has a blip in one year doesn't mean he's going back there again.
As soon as Stajan was given the ice time in Toronto, after playing behind a HOF center, and Antropov he put up the points. Could he have done it as a 22 year old? We don't know because he never had that opportunity or was given that ice time.
At age 20, in the NHL Stajan scored 14 goals while playing 11:00 a game. He got 0:33 seconds on the PP per game.
At age 22, in the NHL Stajan scored 15 goals while playing 11:37 a game. He got 0:37 seconds on the PP per game.
At age 21, in the NHL O'Reilly scored 18 goals while playing 19:31 a game. He got 2:21 of PP time per game.
Stajan is a December baby, O'Reilly a February boy. There was no NHL when Stajan was 21.
As is normal for centers, Stajan's best seasons were based on assists.
He had a 55 and a 57 point season where he scored 15 and 19 goals respectively. He scored 14, 15, 10, and 16 goals in other seasons. Stajan scored 33 and 34 goals in 2 different junior seasons. O'Reilly never scored over 19 goals in any junior season.
By all means if they can land O'Reilly for a reasonable price and the expectation is that he's going to be your 2nd./3rd. line center there should be no disappointment.
I don't give a damn about ROR and his goal totals.
What i see is a play making C with above average defencive ability's and by the look of our wing composition, that fits in here very well.
IMO, Bozak has to be resigned, he's impressed this season, and merits staying, Grabbo is the odd man out, he's the centre that needs to be traded because he has value and can garner a respectable return. Packaged with Kulemin + or Liles ++ might get the Leafs a true #1 centre?
I don't agree with the premise "has to be resigned".
If it's not going to be a good contract for us, then boot his ar$e
Toronto absolutely should not be trading for pending UFAs like Clowe, Morrow, etc.
Toronto should be trading the following:
Liles: He has far higher value at the deadline than the off-season. Dreger podcast rumoured he could be on the way to Carolina. Mirtle podcast rumoured of a player with 3 years left on his deal was on the move till the GM pulled out at the 11th hour, then the host joked about it being Liles and Mirtle all but officially confirmed it.
Connolly: Should still bring in a 3rd or 4th round pick like Lombardi/Wolski have returned.
CMac: Only useful in a scoring role but 3 of those spots are already accounted for. Makes to much for what he can bring to the Leafs. Most likely returns a 2nd.
Steckel: Lost his spot once McClement came along. Should return anywhere from a 4th to a 6th rounder.
Komisarek: Nobody probably wants. Will have to wait till off-season where we most likely buy him out. But he could start next season with the Leafs if someone gets injured, etc. Decision on him can be made in the off-season.
Kostka/Bozak: We should reink if we can get them on fair deals. If both leave though it isn't the end of the world.
The cap is decreasing for the 1st time since it came into place. Cap space is going to be king this off-season and the Leafs can put them into a position to have lots.
Picks/prospects/young players are always in demand. I see a lot of trade going down this off-season like the ones Chicago made after they won the cup and had to move out Ladd, Buff, Versteeg. Everyone of those trades involved picks/prospects.
Carlyle is playing two offensive lines, but they are not 1st., and 2nd., they are 1st. and 3rd., with the 2nd. line being the shutdown line.
IMO, ideally, O'Reilly would be on that shutdown line.
I like the ideal of acquiring ROR and I'm sure Nonis has talked to the Avs, but we should be setting the price, not overpaying. If the Av's are looking for one of our top youngsters like Kadri, Gardiner, or Reilly, hangup the phone.
Bozak and a decent prospect like Percy or Blacker, maybe the extra 4th rounder we got for Lombardi could be included. Thats as high as I would go.