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The Luongo Thread - Aka "The Salesman"

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:06 PM
  #26
Bleach Clean
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dado View Post
I don't like the insinuation that "salesman" means "phoney". That's actually pretty insulting to a whole lot of non-elite-athlete type folks.


What does being a "salesman" as it pertains to an athlete actually mean? That's the heart of the matter here. Is there a natural negative connotation to the descriptor? Is Luongo being duplicitous in his nature? As in not genuine?


The word is meant to imply something on Luongo's character above and beyond the usual descriptions attributed to pro athletes.

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02-23-2013, 12:07 PM
  #27
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This remains Kypreos' best on-air moment ....been downhill ever since
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Old
02-23-2013, 12:09 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
What does being a "salesman" as it pertains to an athlete actually mean? That's the heart of the matter here. Is there a natural negative connotation to the descriptor? Is Luongo being duplicitous in his nature? As in not genuine?


The word is meant to imply something on Luongo's character above and beyond the usual descriptions attributed to pro athletes.
Maybe he was complementing Luongo? Suggesting he's good at bringing in revenue by selling tickets and jerseys?

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:12 PM
  #29
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Quick .946
Thomas .940
Niemi .910
Fleury .908
Osgood .930
Giguere .922
Ward .920
Khabibulin .933
Brodeur .934
Hasek .920

Those are the last 10 Stanley cup winners.

.891
.914
.895
.914
.941

These are Luongo's playoff numbers. I feel like people are forgetting what got us to this point.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:15 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Quick .946
Thomas .940
Niemi .910
Fleury .908
Osgood .930
Giguere .922
Ward .920
Khabibulin .933
Brodeur .934
Hasek .920

Those are the last 10 Stanley cup winners.

.891
.914
.895
.914
.941

These are Luongo's playoff numbers. I feel like people are forgetting what got us to this point.
So on 3 occasions he was good enough to win the Stanley Cup?

Are you also suggesting that we would be trading away Henrik Lundqvist right now if he were on our team instead of Luongo?

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:15 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Maybe he was complementing Luongo? Suggesting he's good at bringing in revenue by selling tickets and jerseys?
Did you see the SNET clip? http://www.sportsnet.ca/video/latest...les-job/page/3


He says things like "not impressed" or "not buying there's an actual change in persona". Basically, things are not as they appear. They are manufactured and formulated to better facilitate a trade. How then can Kipper view Luongo's demeanor as genuine. That seems like a contradiction to me, although I'm not sure what he's trying to say anymore to be honest...

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:17 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Did you see the SNET clip? http://www.sportsnet.ca/video/latest...les-job/page/3


He says things like "not impressed" or "not buying there's an actual change in persona". Basically, things are not as they appear. They are manufactured and formulated to better facilitate a trade. How then can Kipper view Luongo's demeanor as genuine. That seems like a contradiction to me, although I'm not sure what he's trying to say anymore to be honest...
To be honest I don't understand why people take Nick Kypreos seriously. He's the prime example of what happens when you let players go out there and play after having a concussion. His analysis of Luongo is amusing.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:18 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Quick .946
Thomas .940
Niemi .910
Fleury .908
Osgood .930
Giguere .922
Ward .920
Khabibulin .933
Brodeur .934
Hasek .920

Those are the last 10 Stanley cup winners.

.891
.914
.895
.914
.941

These are Luongo's playoff numbers. I feel like people are forgetting what got us to this point.
This guy really doesn't belong on this list. Yes, he had a 'great post-season' that Cup winning year; but that team doesn't even make the playoffs if "the other goalie" doesn't get the majority of starts during that regular season.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:18 PM
  #34
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So is the vibe in here... keep Luongo trade Schneider?

Lu won't be going anywhere this season and will be pushing 35 next season too.

I think Schneider is the way to go is it not?

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:19 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barney Gumble View Post
This guy really doesn't belong on this list. Yes, he had a 'great post-season' that Cup winning year; but that team doesn't even make the playoffs if "the other goalie" doesn't get the majority of starts during that regular season.
It should be noted that he also "lost his starting job" in those playoffs too.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:19 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Lu's playoff track record is more impressive than Henrik Lundqvist. Are you suggesting we would be trading him too?
.931
.917
.908
.909
.924
.835

Career .917 for Henrik and .916 for Lu

Lu is still benefitting from a gaudy save percentage 6 years ago. He's been very underwhelming since.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:20 PM
  #37
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The Canucks fans could be watching the very same movie in a few years but with a different cast of characters. Schneider become the leading man and Luongo goes on to star in a different picture. A standby like Lack or Cannata stars in every appearance he makes and the same plot unfolds with the understudy pushing the star for the leading role.

Perhaps Gillis is waiting for Lack to return to assess his abilities following his long layoff with hip injury. As we saw with Luongo, lower body injuries can be (or perceived to be) hell on lateral movement for a goalie. But if Lack comes back with the same promise he had in previous years and Cannata makes Arniel seem like a dolt by playing lights out in Kalamazoo what does Gillis do? It is generally conceded the Canucks can get a better return for Schneider than Luongo.

What's a general manager to do? His future hangs on his decision.

I don't like the idea of letting either go, but I know that isn't realistic long term. It could work for this season though, so let it play out and see what the off season brings.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:20 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
Quick .946
Thomas .940
Niemi .910
Fleury .908
Osgood .930
Giguere .922
Ward .920
Khabibulin .933
Brodeur .934
Hasek .920

Those are the last 10 Stanley cup winners.

.891
.914
.895
.914
.941

These are Luongo's playoff numbers. I feel like people are forgetting what got us to this point.

With all of those meltdowns, Lu still got to game 7 of the SCF. His losses may have been more dramatic, but a loss is a loss. Our team still started 2-0 in every series on the 10-11 playoffs. When he's on, he can reach a very special level. Just look at game 5 of the SJ series. 54 saves, i think. He can shut it down. I still think he has finally matured and gets it now. I believe Lu is on a mission this season and that we'd be making a big mistake to trade him for some garbage.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:20 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marty111 View Post
So is the vibe in here... keep Luongo trade Schneider?

Lu won't be going anywhere this season and will be pushing 35 next season too.

I think Schneider is the way to go is it not?
Luongo is the better goalie, and if Schneider brings back better assets in a trade then you gotta move him.

Honestly I haven't been impressed by Schneider this season at all.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:21 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Did you see the SNET clip? http://www.sportsnet.ca/video/latest...les-job/page/3


He says things like "not impressed" or "not buying there's an actual change in persona". Basically, things are not as they appear. They are manufactured and formulated to better facilitate a trade. How then can Kipper view Luongo's demeanor as genuine. That seems like a contradiction to me, although I'm not sure what he's trying to say anymore to be honest...
I'm with Y2k. I can't be bothered to take time to listen or watch Kypreos talk hockey.

Haven't watched the interview you're linking and won't bother to.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:22 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
.931
.917
.908
.909
.924
.835

Career .917 for Henrik and .916 for Lu

Lu is still benefitting from a gaudy save percentage 6 years ago. He's been very underwhelming since.
Oh great another stats without context debate.

Cool. Cool, cool, cool.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:23 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
So on 3 occasions he was good enough to win the Stanley Cup?
On 3 of 5 occasions Lu was good enough to win on the two best teams of the last 10 years. Only one of 5 years the goaltending has been good enough to win with an average Stanley Cup team.... and that was 6 plus years ago.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:23 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
.931
.917
.908
.909
.924
.835

Career .917 for Henrik and .916 for Lu

Lu is still benefitting from a gaudy save percentage 6 years ago. He's been very underwhelming since.
So....would we be trading Lundqvist? I mean, by your standards he's had his share of meltdowns too. Just look at him blowing the Washington series in 09 after taking a 3-1 series lead. Look at his series against the Devils this year.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:23 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Luongo is the better goalie, and if Schneider brings back better assets in a trade then you gotta move him.

Honestly I haven't been impressed by Schneider this season at all.
Kane broke Schneider in Europe. He hasn't had the same swagger since.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:25 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
On 3 of 5 occasions Lu was good enough to win on the two best teams of the last 10 years. Only one of 5 years the goaltending has been good enough to win with an average Stanley Cup team.... and that was 6 plus years ago.
Okay, now compare the offensive support Luongo got. Especially in 2011...and compare that to the offensive support these other goalies got.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:26 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barney Gumble View Post
This guy really doesn't belong on this list. Yes, he had a 'great post-season' that Cup winning year; but that team doesn't even make the playoffs if "the other goalie" doesn't get the majority of starts during that regular season.
I'm not passing judgement on any of them. There is a clear trend to the level of goaltending needed to win the Stanley Cup and we haven't been getting it consistently.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:28 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurr View Post
I'm not passing judgement on any of them. There is a clear trend to the level of goaltending needed to win the Stanley Cup and we haven't been getting it consistently.
Did you see Luongo's numbers at the end of game 2 of the SCF in 2011? He was our Conn Smythe candidate at that point. Then a couple massively bad games where the team absolutely quit ballooned his SVP a bit. Hardly see how that shouldn't be considered. As arsmaster stated: stats without context.

You still haven't answered my question about Lundqvist.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:28 PM
  #48
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Look what you've done Bleach.

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Old
02-23-2013, 12:29 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Okay, now compare the offensive support Luongo got. Especially in 2011...and compare that to the offensive support these other goalies got.
Irrelevant to the topic unless you think scoring more would make Lu play better. That doesn't make much sense given Lu is clearly better in low event games.

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02-23-2013, 12:30 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marty111 View Post
So is the vibe in here... keep Luongo trade Schneider?

Lu won't be going anywhere this season and will be pushing 35 next season too.

I think Schneider is the way to go is it not?

Nah. Will still be Luongo. It's great that Luongo is playing lights out, but the long-term plan hasn't changed IMO.


Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
I'm with Y2k. I can't be bothered to take time to listen or watch Kypreos talk hockey.

Haven't watched the interview you're linking and won't bother to.

Fair enough. I found it interesting because you could first tell the disdain Kypreos has for Luongo, and next you could hear the heated exchange between Garrett and Kypreos in the podcast (Feb22HC). It made for a good topic about the perceptions of players.

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