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Old
02-23-2013, 11:14 PM
  #101
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yes, because clearly all teams who make it to the ECF, win the eastern conference, finish with the 2nd most points in franchise history, and come within 2 wins of making it to their first stanley cup finals in nearly 20 years, give up on their coach a dozen games into the season.

i mean, its crystal clear and totally obvious.

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02-23-2013, 11:15 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by vstk View Post
90% of hockey organizations and fan bases usually want the coach to go first. Somehow, the Rangers fan base is different. We should trade our entire roster before our coach. Yesterday, someone said he would want to trade Lundqvist for some good trade picks and prospects.

At this point, it seems that only non-tradeable players are Nash, Callahan, McDonagh and Hagelin.

For me personally, its Nash, Kreider, McDonagh and Lundqvist.

Nash only because he just started here.

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02-23-2013, 11:16 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
yes, because clearly all teams who make it to the ECF, win the eastern conference, finish with the 2nd most points in franchise history, and come within 2 wins of making it to their first stanley cup finals in nearly 20 years, give up on their coach a dozen games into the season.
Or trade the player who was the 3rd best goal scorer in the whole league.

Great logic, but works both ways.

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02-23-2013, 11:16 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
yes, because clearly all teams who make it to the ECF, win the eastern conference, finish with the 2nd most points in franchise history, and come within 2 wins of making it to their first stanley cup finals in nearly 20 years, give up on their coach a dozen games into the season.

i mean, its crystal clear and totally obvious.

To be fair, its not as if as a franchise we've historically tore up the league either.

The biggest catalyst for our success last year was Lundqvist, hands down, and he covers up a lot of the flaws.

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02-23-2013, 11:21 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by vstk View Post
Or trade the player who was the 3rd best goal scorer in the whole league.

Great logic, but works both ways.
are you implying that I want the Rangers to trade Gaborik?

if you are, you really should pay attention to my posts more.

I dont want the Rangers to trade Gaborik.

I dont want the Rangers to fire Torts.


What I want? I want them to play better. I don't think the team needs a huge shake up. I think this team has the pieces, has the coach, and has the system. They just need to wake the eff up.

you know what this team needs? A few bag skates. And I think Benching Richards AND Gaborik for a game or 2 would send a message, and I would totally support it.

Bench, but don't trade. Wake them up, don't get rid of them.

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02-23-2013, 11:23 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by Heyoooo View Post
To be fair, its not as if as a franchise we've historically tore up the league either.

The biggest catalyst for our success last year was Lundqvist, hands down, and he covers up a lot of the flaws.
the biggest catalyst for Henrik Lundqvists success last year was the defensive system in front of him. That would be Tortorellas system which stresses playing strong defensively and limiting chances in the high quality areas.

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02-23-2013, 11:25 PM
  #107
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Has not logged a point since the islanders game.


Not ok

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Old
02-23-2013, 11:25 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
are you implying that I want the Rangers to trade Gaborik?

if you are, you really should pay attention to my posts more.

I dont want the Rangers to trade Gaborik.

I dont want the Rangers to fire Torts.


What I want? I want them to play better. I don't think the team needs a huge shake up. I think this team has the pieces, has the coach, and has the system. They just need to wake the eff up.

you know what this team needs? A few bag skates. And I think Benching Richards AND Gaborik for a game or 2 would send a message, and I would totally support it.

Bench, but don't trade. Wake them up, don't get rid of them.

I am with you on this myself, but somethings gotta break at some point. They will both last the full year but everything depends on how we finish.

Honestly, im one of the posters that probably appreciates Gaborik most for what hes done for us, but im starting to think he would probably do better elsewhere, so long as Tortorella is here running the show. Kinda like when Burke traded Bryzgalov to give him a better chance, I wouldnt be against sending Gaborik somewhere he would be able to play to his strengths instead.

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02-23-2013, 11:26 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
are you implying that I want the Rangers to trade Gaborik?
No, I wasn't. It was meant to be as a big generalization, like my original post.

Quote:
Bench, but don't trade. Wake them up, don't get rid of them.
I agree. I think Tortorella needs to change his game plan or make sure the players learn (or follow 100%) to play this game plan. The way they are playing now is unacceptable.

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02-23-2013, 11:26 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
are you implying that I want the Rangers to trade Gaborik?

if you are, you really should pay attention to my posts more.

I dont want the Rangers to trade Gaborik.

I dont want the Rangers to fire Torts.


What I want? I want them to play better. I don't think the team needs a huge shake up. I think this team has the pieces, has the coach, and has the system. They just need to wake the eff up.

you know what this team needs? A few bag skates. And I think Benching Richards AND Gaborik for a game or 2 would send a message, and I would totally support it.

Bench, but don't trade. Wake them up, don't get rid of them.
I'm not trying to be argumentative, but what exactly will that do? Neither one of those guys are very good along the boards and never will be.

Benching Gabs/Richards isn't going to turn them into grinding forwards. They(more in case of Gabs) are what they are...

Richards is playing with Ryan Callahan and Krieder. Cally has ZERO chemistry with Richards, and Krieder is young/hesitant.

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02-23-2013, 11:30 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
the biggest catalyst for Henrik Lundqvists success last year was the defensive system in front of him. That would be Tortorellas system which stresses playing strong defensively and limiting chances in the high quality areas.
Didnt do much for Biron.

The defense was certainly part of it, probably the second reason, but Lundqvist was still the main cog for the entire team.

We go/went as Lundqvist goes/went.

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02-23-2013, 11:32 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Blueshirt Believer View Post
I'm not trying to be argumentative, but what exactly will that do? Neither one of those guys are very good along the boards and never will be.

Benching Gabs/Richards isn't going to turn them into grinding forwards. They(more in case of Gabs) are what they are...

Richards is playing with Ryan Callahan and Krieder. Cally has ZERO chemistry with Richards, and Krieder is young/hesitant.
i'm not sure i understand what you're talking about?

who cares how good they are along the boards and who has chemistry with who?

Marian Gaborik scored 40 goals last year in this system.

Marian Gaborik scored 40 goals 3 years ago in this system.

Brad Richards was scoring at a higher pace than Evgeni Malkin for several months towards the end of the season last year playing in this exact system.

What point are you trying to make here?

Benching them is sending them a message. You are going to play the guys who are going to give you the best chance to win. If that's not you Richards, if that's not you Gaborik, you aren't playing. It's a kick in the ass, both guys need it. Gabby can play some awfully good hockey when he's moving his legs...he hasn't been for most of the season... Richards is making DUMB plays out there... i've never seen such a smart player play so effing dumb. It's unbelievable.

Both of these guys are elite players, and i have absolutely ZERO doubts that about how they will play going forward, they are going to be dominant forced once again...what they need is a wakeup call, I think a good benching would do just that.

if not, so be it, but benching gabby for the 3rd period tonight, imho, was the right call. i dont care about the penalty, he looked so damn lazy out there....Gabby get's lost out there, that's his game, i've defended him ad nauseum here, and i will till the day i die, but when a guy is lazy, you can tell. Gabby wasnt willing to take a few extra strides to get to loose pucks tonight, he just sorta watched as the play went the other way instead of moving his legs and going after the puck.

he DESERVED to be benched. as does richards. but you don't trade guys like those. no, you get them to play up to their potential.

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02-23-2013, 11:33 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Heyoooo View Post
Didnt do much for Biron.

The defense was certainly part of it, probably the second reason, but Lundqvist was still the main cog for the entire team.

We go/went as Lundqvist goes/went.
Didn't do much for Biron because, to be honest, Biron sucks. Shoot 5-hole on him, and you'll score. He's very good up high, and he tracks pucks really well, and has a good glove hand, but everyone knows you go 5-hole on him.

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02-23-2013, 11:33 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
are you implying that I want the Rangers to trade Gaborik?

if you are, you really should pay attention to my posts more.

I dont want the Rangers to trade Gaborik.

I dont want the Rangers to fire Torts.


What I want? I want them to play better. I don't think the team needs a huge shake up. I think this team has the pieces, has the coach, and has the system. They just need to wake the eff up.

you know what this team needs? A few bag skates. And I think Benching Richards AND Gaborik for a game or 2 would send a message, and I would totally support it.

Bench, but don't trade. Wake them up, don't get rid of them.
I needed that laugh tonight!

He's all that is wrong with this team; he's lost this team. His system is the biggest joke I have ever seen. Dump and chase, with no offense! It is working real ******* well this year, huh?

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02-23-2013, 11:35 PM
  #115
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i'm not sure i understand what you're talking about?

who cares how good they are along the boards and who has chemistry with who?

Marian Gaborik scored 40 goals last year in this system.

Marian Gaborik scored 40 goals 3 years ago in this system.

Brad Richards was scoring at a higher pace than Evgeni Malkin for several months towards the end of the season last year playing in this exact system.

What point are you trying to make here?

Benching them is sending them a message. You are going to play the guys who are going to give you the best chance to win. If that's not you Richards, if that's not you Gaborik, you aren't playing. It's a kick in the ass, both guys need it. Gabby can play some awfully good hockey when he's moving his legs...he hasn't been for most of the season... Richards is making DUMB plays out there... i've never seen such a smart player play so effing dumb. It's unbelievable.

Both of these guys are elite players, and i have absolutely ZERO doubts that about how they will play going forward, they are going to be dominant forced once again...what they need is a wakeup call, I think a good benching would do just that.

if not, so be it, but benching gabby for the 3rd period tonight, imho, was the right call. i dont care about the penalty, he looked so damn lazy out there....Gabby get's lost out there, that's his game, i've defended him ad nauseum here, and i will till the day i die, but when a guy is lazy, you can tell. Gabby wasnt willing to take a few extra strides to get to loose pucks tonight, he just sorta watched as the play went the other way instead of moving his legs and going after the puck.

he DESERVED to be benched. as does richards. but you don't trade guys like those. no, you get them to play up to their potential.

This system was not in place Gaborik's first year he scored 40+. At least defensively speaking. Their identity didnt really come until last year.

Remember, his first year it was "safe is death." The first 7 games with Gaby and DZ we won, then after that it was up and down. He thought he had the talent then but didnt. He does now though, so theres no point in continuing such a "jam" system.

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02-23-2013, 11:36 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Heyoooo View Post
This system was not in place Gaborik's first year he scored 40+. At least defensively speaking. Their identity didnt really come until last year.

Remember, his first year it was "safe is death." The first 7 games with Gaby and DZ we won, then after that it was up and down. He thought he had the talent then but didnt. He does now though, so theres no point in continuing such a "jam" system.
The Rangers have played this exact system since the day Torts got here. Ask Bleeds Rangers Blue, he's been on my ass since the first day about how Torts didn't so squat to get this team going offensively and instead focused on defense.

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02-23-2013, 11:37 PM
  #117
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The Rangers have played this exact system since the day Torts got here. Ask Bleeds Rangers Blue, he's been on my ass since the first day about how Torts didn't so squat to get this team going offensively and instead focused on defense.

Flat out.

No they havent.

This system is the result of Tortorella adjusting starting 09-10 which wasnt really bought into completely until last year.

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02-23-2013, 11:39 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by McSauer View Post
I needed that laugh tonight!

He's all that is wrong with this team; he's lost this team. His system is the biggest joke I have ever seen. Dump and chase, with no offense! It is working real ******* well this year, huh?
Yeah, it's worked real effing well this year huh? i mean, who cares that last year we made it to the ECF and won the East outright....no, the system suddenly stopped working, and we suck ass because our coach has a system that's impossible to win with...

it couldn't be that, maybe, last year, our best players were...OUR BEST PLAYERS...whereas this year, our best players SUCK (outside of Rick Nash, who is injured right now....)...Henrik Lundqvist wasn't all that good to start the season, Ricahrds has sucked, and Gaborik has sucked.

When your horses don't score, your team ain't winning.

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02-23-2013, 11:40 PM
  #119
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Flat out.

No they havent.

This system is the result of Tortorella adjusting starting 09-10 which wasnt really bought into completely until last year.
They've been a defense first, grind it out team since day 1 bro.

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02-23-2013, 11:41 PM
  #120
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Gaborik decided he would buy into what was asked of him, and he ended up with 40 goals. If you want to get technical, and classify them, some were 'garbage' goals, which count the same as a gorgeous passing play goals.

I don't get where people are coming from. When I see a Ranger around the opposition's net these days, quite often it is Gaborik or Hagelin.
So Gaborik is not scoring? Nobody else is either. You don't see effort? I do see effort. You want to slam Gaborik for not being able to deke a defenseman and break around him for a breakway? He never did that, why would he suddenly start being good at it now?
You want to say he does not work hard? Bullcrap, he is working harder than most players on the team. Hagelin works like a dog too, but there is a big dropoff after that.

I don't understand posters here. Crapping all over the wrong players.

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02-23-2013, 11:41 PM
  #121
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Yeah, it's worked real effing well this year huh? i mean, who cares that last year we made it to the ECF and won the East outright....no, the system suddenly stopped working, and we suck ass because our coach has a system that's impossible to win with...

it couldn't be that, maybe, last year, our best players were...OUR BEST PLAYERS...whereas this year, our best players SUCK (outside of Rick Nash, who is injured right now....)...Henrik Lundqvist wasn't all that good to start the season, Ricahrds has sucked, and Gaborik has sucked.

When your horses don't score, your team ain't winning.

Its more than that. Our bottom six isnt as good/not as deep and our defense started out the year all over the place.

Its been an entire team effort, and by Torts saying "we dont have a full team" he means the team isnt all playing at once. The team was on the same page night in/out last year. Theres no cohesion this year.

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02-23-2013, 11:43 PM
  #122
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They've been a defense first, grind it out team since day 1 bro.

No they havent.


Tortorella started out an uptempo style and aside the first 7 games of 09-10, they were terrible at it, partly because that team was basically just Gaborik and Lundqvist. It took all of 09-10 for him to figure it out and adjust.


Can I get anyone else around here to back me up on this?


Why do you think everyone said we didnt have an identity until last year?

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02-23-2013, 11:45 PM
  #123
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Its more than that. Our bottom six isnt as good/not as deep and our defense started out the year all over the place.

Its been an entire team effort, and by Torts saying "we dont have a full team" he means the team isnt all playing at once. The team was on the same page night in/out last year. Theres no cohesion this year.
i agree, the team just isn't playing well, on any given night you have 75% of the team playing like crap...and it's not the same guys night in and night out...

I'm willing to be a lot more patient, and forgiving than most of you guys. To me though, if Gabby and Richards are going to keep playing like garbage, and Nash is going to miss games due to injuries, this team ain't winning. You can fire torts, you can fire sather, it won't change a damn thing, because if your best players can't score, they are 21 million dollar anchors holding the entire team down, whether its because of stupidity (Richards), a multitude of reasons in Gaborik (laziness sometimes, can't score on his shot anymore, no puck luck, etc), or injuries (Nash)...it doesn't matter. If your big guys aren't your big guys, then you're a team with nothing but support players...that's exactly the way you'd describe a team like teh Columbus Blue Jackets.

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02-23-2013, 11:46 PM
  #124
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No they havent.


Tortorella started out an uptempo style and aside the first 7 games of 09-10, they were terrible at it, partly because that team was basically just Gaborik and Lundqvist. It took all of 09-10 for him to figure it out and adjust.


Can I get anyone else around here to back me up on this?


Why do you think everyone said we didnt have an identity until last year?
Agree to disagre, but to me, theres nothing that has changed with the playing style except last year, they won.

2 years ago, Gabby sucked, and they didn't win. 3 years ago, Gabby didn't suck, and they won.

As the stars go, so go the Rangers. Right now, the stars ain't going.

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02-23-2013, 11:46 PM
  #125
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Inferno I usually agree with your posts (even as a lurker) but I definitely disagree here about this specific topic.


Tortorella trying out the "safe is death" uptempo aggressive in your face system Gaborik's first year is ingrained in my brain.

The team didnt have the talent to keep up with that.

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