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Old
02-23-2013, 10:03 PM
  #951
jacketsfan77
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i am not a fan of this although it doesnt really matter because i dont think the PA will approve.

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02-23-2013, 10:31 PM
  #952
Fred Glover
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If this new proposal holds true, I love it! better travel for the team. I am not scared of Pitt, Philly, NYR etc. Pick your poison, I say. This year, Chicago, Vancouver, St. Louis is no piece of cake either. Let Jarmo draft talent and develop it, and we will be fine. The NHL is tough, no matter where they put you. It is therefore up to you to draft and develop the players to win, no matter what conference you are in

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02-23-2013, 10:42 PM
  #953
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Originally Posted by jacketsfan77 View Post
i am not a fan of this although it doesnt really matter because i dont think the PA will approve.
Just an FYI, this format is being worked on simultaneously by both the NHL and NHLPA.

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02-23-2013, 10:44 PM
  #954
Matthew
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I welcome our new Pennsylvania hockey team overlords.

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02-23-2013, 10:45 PM
  #955
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I don't like a 16 and 14 team conference setup. I don't like the disparity of playoff chances. I think its ridiculous that Detroit (who is north of Columbus) is rumored to be in a conference with the 2 Florida teams.

The Cincinnati Reds will play 30 games on the road with 8 pm or later start times. I really don't get all the concerns about an NHL team having a dozen or so late starts a year.

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02-23-2013, 10:59 PM
  #956
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Originally Posted by IBleedUnionBlue View Post
I don't like a 16 and 14 team conference setup. I don't like the disparity of playoff chances. I think its ridiculous that Detroit (who is north of Columbus) is rumored to be in a conference with the 2 Florida teams.

The Cincinnati Reds will play 30 games on the road with 8 pm or later start times. I really don't get all the concerns about an NHL team having a dozen or so late starts a year.
It's not the late starts that are the primary concern, it's all the travel. Unlike baseball, where the Reds play 3 game series, NHL teams travel far more, have to clear customs more, and yes the late starts do factor into tv ratings.

And all signs point to expansion in the near future, so the two 8 team conferences will even out pretty quickly.

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02-23-2013, 11:02 PM
  #957
Matthew
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The NHL expanding before the NBA and MLB seems pretty silly.

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02-23-2013, 11:51 PM
  #958
IBleedUnionBlue
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Originally Posted by Tafkak View Post
It's not the late starts that are the primary concern, it's all the travel. Unlike baseball, where the Reds play 3 game series, NHL teams travel far more, have to clear customs more, and yes the late starts do factor into tv ratings.

And all signs point to expansion in the near future, so the two 8 team conferences will even out pretty quickly.
Expansion is a terrible idea. The talent is already watered down, I cant imagine 46 or so more AHL players playing in this league. There are teams struggling to fill arenas. Contraction would be better. But thats an altogether different conversation. Also, expansion would be a minimum of 3 years away, probably longer.

And the primary issues are travel and start times. I don't know which one is primary or secondary, seems to me they are hand in hand. But with the league realigning by time zones, its clear start times are a big issue.

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02-23-2013, 11:58 PM
  #959
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That plan seems like its made for two new teams coming in. Ultimately helps the Jackets travel, but it would make sure we never make the playoffs for a long long time (if they go with that top 4 teams from each eastern/west conference make it).

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02-24-2013, 12:44 AM
  #960
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Originally Posted by IBleedUnionBlue View Post
I don't like a 16 and 14 team conference setup. I don't like the disparity of playoff chances.
I don't care, makes zero difference to me. If you can't get into the top 8 in any conference that is your problem. 14 or 16 teams.

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02-24-2013, 01:33 AM
  #961
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It would be tough, especially for the next few years, but would be really good for us. Good teams and we wouldn't have as many late games.

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02-24-2013, 01:35 AM
  #962
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Well, I do like the better travel.
Nationwide Arena is gonna be invaded a lot by rival fans, isn't it?

So, what happens if someone from the west moves to Quebec City? Does Detroit get shoved into the Western side? Or would it be us?

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02-24-2013, 01:47 AM
  #963
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Well, I do like the better travel.
Nationwide Arena is gonna be invaded a lot by rival fans, isn't it?

So, what happens if someone from the west moves to Quebec City? Does Detroit get shoved into the Western side? Or would it be us?
They'd **** us over before they'd **** Detroit over.

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02-24-2013, 01:53 AM
  #964
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Also, I'm gonna be so happy that travel to the west coast is gonna be heavily reduced.
I can't justify staying up late during the regular season, and it also means whenever we make playoffs(), that we won't have late starts for that either!
(I need to go to sleep, I'm getting delusional)
(Oh, I guess that means we're gonna start hating on Nash, doesn't it? Makes you wonder if that's one of the reasons we got in that division)

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02-24-2013, 02:12 AM
  #965
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Consider that of the three prime relocation / expansion locations (Seattle, Markham(Toronto), and Quebec City), two are in the East. Any move by the Blue Jackets to an Eastern Conference could be temporary and we will go back westwards. I don't think such an expansion is unlikely— with a lower cap many more teams will be profitable and Canadian teams can be massively profitable.

My other consideration (already stated) is that we have rivalries going now in the Norris Division (Central) and we might as well keep them. In that setup no team is more than one time zone away, so no super late starts.

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02-24-2013, 08:29 AM
  #966
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Any proposal that has the CBJ in the East is probably a win.

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02-24-2013, 10:09 AM
  #967
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Originally Posted by major major View Post
Consider that of the three prime relocation / expansion locations (Seattle, Markham(Toronto), and Quebec City), two are in the East. Any move by the Blue Jackets to an Eastern Conference could be temporary and we will go back westwards. I don't think such an expansion is unlikely— with a lower cap many more teams will be profitable and Canadian teams can be massively profitable.

My other consideration (already stated) is that we have rivalries going now in the Norris Division (Central) and we might as well keep them. In that setup no team is more than one time zone away, so no super late starts.
I also think Portland is a sleeper candidate. If not for expansion, then for relocation of a franchise like Florida.

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02-24-2013, 11:19 AM
  #968
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Originally Posted by IBleedUnionBlue View Post
Expansion is a terrible idea. The talent is already watered down, I cant imagine 46 or so more AHL players playing in this league. There are teams struggling to fill arenas. Contraction would be better. But thats an altogether different conversation. Also, expansion would be a minimum of 3 years away, probably longer.
Let's say that the NHL decides to contract. Where do you think Columbus falls on that priority list?

Are you willing to lose this team simply to satisfy some crap argument about "watered-down talent" (which in itself is a load of garbage)?

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I also think Portland is a sleeper candidate. If not for expansion, then for relocation of a franchise like Florida.
On what basis would Florida be moving? Because of where they're located?

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02-24-2013, 11:35 AM
  #969
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Let's say that the NHL decides to contract. Where do you think Columbus falls on that priority list?
Not quite in the bottom 2.

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Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
Are you willing to lose this team simply to satisfy some crap argument about "watered-down talent" (which in itself is a load of garbage)?
This presupposes your assumption that Columbus would be contracted, in which I believe you are wrong. And as smart as you are, you can't seriously propose that adding 46 more players with AHL skills is a good thing for the NHL. We've watched a last place team for the last couple years. Do you really want to add the equivalent of 2 more rosters with less skill then the Blue Jackets to the NHL?

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Old
02-24-2013, 11:47 AM
  #970
Mayor Bee
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Not quite in the bottom 2.
I'm not sure what that would be based on. Nor do I want to know what a league looking at contraction would look at.

Quote:
This presupposes your assumption that Columbus would be contracted, in which I believe you are wrong. And as smart as you are, you can't seriously propose that adding 46 more players with AHL skills is a good thing for the NHL. We've watched a last place team for the last couple years. Do you really want to add 2 more rosters with less skill then the Blue Jackets to the NHL?
Your assumption is that two new teams would be scraping the bottom of the barrel as far as talent goes, which wouldn't be the case. There are easily two full rosters of actual NHL players currently in the AHL or in Europe (or in the NHL press box) who could step right in and produce under those circumstances.

I'll give you someone like Andrew Brunette, who couldn't crack the Capitals roster on a regular basis despite being productive in short bursts. Expansion came, and he ended up in Nashville, then Atlanta, then Minnesota. He was thought to be a Quad-A type of player; too good for the AHL, not good enough for the NHL. He just retired a few months ago, having played over 1,100 games and putting up over 250 goals and 700 points.

Look at someone like Martin St. Louis or Marc Savard, who couldn't do anything on a bad Flames team. St. Louis is closing in on 1,000 games and 900 points, Savard will probably finish with 800 games and 700 points. Neither of them would have gotten good opportunities in the absence of a need to fill rosters.

In a contracted league, versatility takes priority. No team wants to have players who have good offensive skills but poor defensive ones, or good defensive skills but poor offensive ones. It becomes this catch-all middle ground, where everyone is average at everything and a very select few are actually excellent at anything. Expansion changes that; it forces players whose skillset is slightly more lopsided into the NHL. Geoff Sanderson was thought to be useless; he came to Columbus and scored more goals in his first year than in his previous three combined. Slava Kozlov was thought to be washed-up; he went to Atlanta and had 70 points in a season four times. And the caliber of goaltending...look at how many actual NHL starters are out there buried on their team's bench behind an incumbent starter.

No, expansion wouldn't do what it did in 1991 and 1992, creating two absolute abominations of teams that need years to actually do anything.

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02-24-2013, 11:53 AM
  #971
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No, expansion wouldn't do what it did in 1991 and 1992, creating two absolute abominations of teams that need years to actually do anything.
Unlike the 2000 expansion that produced those instant and sustained powerhouses the Minnesota Wild and the Columbus Blue Jackets?

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02-24-2013, 11:59 AM
  #972
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Why does this have to be so difficult? If all teams played each other (home and home) that would be 58 games. Then divide the teams into 6 divisions based on proximity for rivalries and fan viewing convenience and play these teams an additional 2-3 times (10-15 games) and then play 2 or 3 other divisions (like the NFL) an additional game (10-15 games). The divisions played would rotate yearly. This would total 83 games. We could eliminate a preseason game which both fans and players dislike and give the owners 1 more game to increase revenue. Then it doesn't matter who enters the league as these guidelines could still be employed.

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02-24-2013, 11:59 AM
  #973
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Seems good to me.

Expect... Markham/Toronto 2 and/or Quebec are coming in few years. Seems like there's no plan for that.

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02-24-2013, 12:08 PM
  #974
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I know they would never do it, because it would mean giving up revenue, but I still think they should play less games and have more time off in between games. I think that could help with the level of play if guys are more rested. Also, it might mean less injuries, so level of play would be better with regulars playing a higher % of their teams games.


Last edited by RDriesenUD: 02-24-2013 at 01:20 PM.
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Old
02-24-2013, 12:22 PM
  #975
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Does anyone remember Rimers realignment plan? I know that he has brought it up. I believe it involved three 10 team conferences, and he had the play-off format all worked out. Why wouldn't that work? Why are they set on 2 conferences with 2 divisions in each?

Also, don't think for one minute Bettman, and the owners would not consider expansion. Those expansion fees bring in big bucks for all the teams, and they aren't going to pass that up even if there are plenty of reasons not to expand.

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