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Could a team try to get both Drouin and MacKinnon?

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Old
02-24-2013, 06:18 AM
  #76
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Originally Posted by TheTechNoir View Post
If by some chance Florida were to accomplish this... Drouin/MacKinnon/Huberdeau is one heck of a first line. They have experience playing together too.

Drouin's chemistry with MacKinnon isn't to be underrated... MacKinnon benefits from playing with Drouin just as much as vise versa.
Even if that were to happen I see no guarantee that this would be a good line. Many players were great in the minors. I am not high on MacKinnon at all. I saw that the Russian Valery is now ranked above Drouin and Lindolm and Barkov are gaining steam.

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02-24-2013, 05:51 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by BigFatCat999 View Post



They have 3 1sts, a high need for forward, no need for Jones, and they would be a good fit for the Jackets.


Mathmatically hard they would need LAK or NYR to not make the playoffs. (Based on the choices LAK since they were an 8th seed riding Quick. If both were to miss CBJ fans would wet themselves.)

Also draft wise the Jackets could draft 1 and 3 let #2 draft Jones and then they would have their 1st line.
I don't think there's a team in the NHL with no need for a potential franchise D man.

Columbus sucks, they need anyone and everyone.

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02-24-2013, 06:40 PM
  #78
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If the Avs stink it up this year, one would have to think Oreilly could be a real enticing piece to start talks for the Avs to get another Top 3 pick if there own pick is already top 3.

Although the Avs really need Defense, and Jones would be optimal. If they could get both Drouin and MacKinnon they should IMO.

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02-24-2013, 06:47 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
I don't think there's a team in the NHL with no need for a potential franchise D man.

Columbus sucks, they need anyone and everyone.
Pretty unnecessary shot at Columbus..

Obviously they would love to have Seth Jones, but elite scoring is what they need more than anything. I think that's what he was trying to say..

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02-24-2013, 07:59 PM
  #80
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Montreal will finish in the bottom 5 so they could trade a few veterans like Gionta, Cole, Markov and rack up picks.
heh.

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02-24-2013, 08:07 PM
  #81
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Pretty unnecessary shot at Columbus..

Obviously they would love to have Seth Jones, but elite scoring is what they need more than anything. I think that's what he was trying to say..
Not unnecessary at all. That franchise is a walking punch line. They would be foolish to disregard Jones if they had the opportunity to draft him.

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02-24-2013, 08:37 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
I don't think there's a team in the NHL with no need for a potential franchise D man.

Columbus sucks, they need anyone and everyone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nitz View Post
Not unnecessary at all. That franchise is a walking punch line. They would be foolish to disregard Jones if they had the opportunity to draft him.
I really ought to be used to the terminal cluelessness about the CBJ that abounds around here. But no. It's still irritating.

Watch a couple games sometime. Right now the only thing of real significance stopping us from being competitive in most games is lack of scoring talent. As of tonight, we've lost 8 one-goal games.

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02-24-2013, 08:53 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by BROOKLYnKNIGHTS View Post
Even if that were to happen I see no guarantee that this would be a good line. Many players were great in the minors. I am not high on MacKinnon at all. I saw that the Russian Valery is now ranked above Drouin and Lindolm and Barkov are gaining steam.
This is a ridiculously uninformed post...

First of all, watch them play. Following draft projections won't get you anywhere as far as giving real opinions goes. MacKinnon is a dynamic forward who creates offense whenever he's on the ice. He has strength, huge speed, and great hands and shot. Off the ice he's got poise and a team-first mentality that reflects on his interactions with his teammates (trust me speaking as a teenager in Halifax). He'll be a first line centre at least, and a superstar at best.

The only reason Drouin was slipping in rankings were issues about his size and how much of his success was based on MacKinnon. He's proved that neither of those hold him back from dominating. The way he's taken over the QMJHL is comparable to a better Radulov without a threat of bolting. His hands are by far the best in the draft, and his passing is stunning to watch. On top of that, he's proven over and over again that he can battle in the corners, take hits, and stay strong on the puck.

Together, and you're excused for never having seen it because they wasted them at the World Juniors, they have amazing chemistry that comes from their skillsets complementing eachothers' perfectly. They've built up a rhythm of excellence that draws equally from both of their talents, and on a team like Columbus this chemistry could develop for years on a second and then first line unit.

EDIT: I'd like to point out that the Kane-Gagner comparison ignores the fact that both Drouin and MacKinnon are considered potential 1st overall talents, something Gagner never was.

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02-24-2013, 08:58 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by JackFr View Post
This is a ridiculously uninformed post...

First of all, watch them play. Following draft projections won't get you anywhere as far as giving real opinions goes. MacKinnon is a dynamic forward who creates offense whenever he's on the ice. He has strength, huge speed, and great hands and shot. Off the ice he's got poise and a team-first mentality that reflects on his interactions with his teammates (trust me speaking as a teenager in Halifax). He'll be a first line centre at least, and a superstar at best.

The only reason Drouin was slipping in rankings were issues about his size and how much of his success was based on MacKinnon. He's proved that neither of those hold him back from dominating. The way he's taken over the QMJHL is comparable to a better Radulov without a threat of bolting. His hands are by far the best in the draft, and his passing is stunning to watch. On top of that, he's proven over and over again that he can battle in the corners, take hits, and stay strong on the puck.

Together, and you're excused for never having seen it because they wasted them at the World Juniors, they have amazing chemistry that comes from their skillsets complementing eachothers' perfectly. They've built up a rhythm of excellence that draws equally from both of their talents, and on a team like Columbus this chemistry could develop for years on a second and then first line unit.

EDIT: I'd like to point out that the Kane-Gagner comparison ignores the fact that both Drouin and MacKinnon are considered potential 1st overall talents, something Gagner never was.
Well said.

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02-24-2013, 08:59 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Newfie9 View Post
Pretty unnecessary shot at Columbus..

Obviously they would love to have Seth Jones, but elite scoring is what they need more than anything. I think that's what he was trying to say..
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
I really ought to be used to the terminal cluelessness about the CBJ that abounds around here. But no. It's still irritating.

Watch a couple games sometime. Right now the only thing of real significance stopping us from being competitive in most games is lack of scoring talent. As of tonight, we've lost 8 one-goal games.
It's not a shot at Columbus. I don't even dislike the Jackets, I think they have an underrated team actually. I'm just trying to illustrate my point as to how valuable Jones actually is. I don't really think Columbus is in a position to say they couldn't use him and what he brings. They don't have an elite D-man, they have a collection of solid D-men. Murray hasn't proved anything yet, for all we know he might just be a second pairing guy. Even if he ends up being a top pairing player, a D-core of Johnson, Murray and Jones would be legendary and cup contender worthy in its prime.

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02-24-2013, 08:59 PM
  #86
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Comparing them to current NHLers...would MacKinnon be similar to Marleau and Drouin similar to Datsyuk?

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02-24-2013, 09:02 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
It's not a shot at Columbus. I don't even dislike the Jackets, I think they have an underrated team actually. I'm just trying to illustrate my point as to how valuable Jones actually is. I don't really think Columbus is in a position to say they couldn't use him and what he brings. They don't have an elite D-man, they have a collection of solid D-men. Murray hasn't proved anything yet, for all we know he might just be a second pairing guy. Even if he ends up being a top pairing player, a D-core of Johnson, Murray and Jones would be legendary and cup contender worthy in its prime.
I also want to add: this is similar to the Oilers situation last season. Would it have made more sense for them to take Murray over Yak, because their D is putrid? Yes, of course. But the BPA is the player that should be drafted. You take an elite guy like Jones even if he doesn't fit your teams needs and then move the Erixons and Tyutins for help upfront or wherever you need it.

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02-24-2013, 09:04 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Mats86 View Post
Comparing them to current NHLers...would MacKinnon be similar to Marleau and Drouin similar to Datsyuk?
Drouin's certainly not Datsyuk. His defensive game could get better, but Datsyuk is a benchmark that all danglers dream to reach. I don't see Selkes in Drouin's future, but I think his offensive potential exceeds Datsyuk's. Honestly Radulov with more drive and better passing is the best one I can think of right now.

MacKinnon as Marleau is an intriguing one. I don't see Marleau enough to make a conclusive comparison, but the speed is definitely similar.

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02-24-2013, 09:10 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
It's not a shot at Columbus. I don't even dislike the Jackets, I think they have an underrated team actually. I'm just trying to illustrate my point as to how valuable Jones actually is. I don't really think Columbus is in a position to say they couldn't use him and what he brings. They don't have an elite D-man, they have a collection of solid D-men. Murray hasn't proved anything yet, for all we know he might just be a second pairing guy. Even if he ends up being a top pairing player, a D-core of Johnson, Murray and Jones would be legendary and cup contender worthy in its prime.
Even though I think that the first overall pick will come down to what a team needs, people need to understand that stacking a defence doesn't automatically make a championship-quality team. The example of the Predators is an easy one, as even with "legendary" defence, elite goaltending, and great coaching, their lack of offensive talent did them in.

If Columbus got MacKinnon and Drouin, suddenly you're looking at:

Anisimov - MacKinnon - Drouin
Johansen
Jenner

Murray - Johnson

As a foundation for a team, that's pretty balanced. Look at champions like the Kings or the Bruins, they had an elite defenceman surrounded by talent, on rosters with strong offensive talent.

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02-24-2013, 09:12 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mats86 View Post
Comparing them to current NHLers...would MacKinnon be similar to Marleau and Drouin similar to Datsyuk?
I see MacKinnon as somewhere between Seguin and Stamkos.

Drouin is similar to Kane, maybe alittle bit of Briere aswell.

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02-24-2013, 09:16 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by JackFr View Post
Even though I think that the first overall pick will come down to what a team needs, people need to understand that stacking a defence doesn't automatically make a championship-quality team. The example of the Predators is an easy one, as even with "legendary" defence, elite goaltending, and great coaching, their lack of offensive talent did them in.

If Columbus got MacKinnon and Drouin, suddenly you're looking at:

Anisimov - MacKinnon - Drouin
Johansen
Jenner

Murray - Johnson

As a foundation for a team, that's pretty balanced. Look at champions like the Kings or the Bruins, they had an elite defenceman surrounded by talent, on rosters with strong offensive talent.
I'm not sure how not drafting Jones results in drafting both MacKinnon and Drouin, but in my argument I'm talking strictly first overall. If Jones is the best player, he should go first, using a top pick for need is a recipe for disaster.

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02-24-2013, 09:23 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
I'm not sure how not drafting Jones results in drafting both MacKinnon and Drouin, but in my argument I'm talking strictly first overall. If Jones is the best player, he should go first, using a top pick for need is a recipe for disaster.
My bad.

Still, I think MacKinnon and Jones are equal, and drafting a defenceman first overall hasn't turned out well since... Chris Phillips.

Seth Jones will be a #1 defenceman IMO. But the difference between him and MacKinnon is negligible, and in cases like this,

a.) the forward is the safer pick (Tavares/Hedman, Stamkos/Doughty)
b.) taking a player who actually fits your team isn't rearing for a disaster, it's making a smart pick that will balance your team

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02-24-2013, 09:27 PM
  #93
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My bad.

Still, I think MacKinnon and Jones are equal, and drafting a defenceman first overall hasn't turned out well since... Chris Phillips.

Seth Jones will be a #1 defenceman IMO. But the difference between him and MacKinnon is negligible, and in cases like this,

a.) the forward is the safer pick (Tavares/Hedman, Stamkos/Doughty)
b.) taking a player who actually fits your team isn't rearing for a disaster, it's making a smart pick that will balance your team
I guess you're right. This just stems from my arguments last year for the Oilers to draft Yak as the BPA rather than Murray as the sensible option. But if it's a coin flip, yeah, it makes sense to go for need.

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02-24-2013, 09:45 PM
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I guess you're right. This just stems from my arguments last year for the Oilers to draft Yak as the BPA rather than Murray as the sensible option. But if it's a coin flip, yeah, it makes sense to go for need.
I'll never understand why they didn't try and trade down to 2nd, and have part of the deal be Columbus can't take Murray... Edmonton gets a player they actually need, as well as the extra from Columbus trading up.. wouldn't have been much, perhaps a 3rd, but it's still something.

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02-24-2013, 09:50 PM
  #95
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I'll never understand why they didn't try and trade down to 2nd, and have part of the deal be Columbus can't take Murray... Edmonton gets a player they actually need, as well as the extra from Columbus trading up.. wouldn't have been much, perhaps a 3rd, but it's still something.
We didn't want Murray and he isn't what we need. We need a strong, physical top pairing D man; Murray is not that.

He's essentially Klefbom, whim some scouts said is actually better than Murray. Besides, what did Columbus even have at the time? Average NHLers and OK prospects? Imagine if Washington had traded down and drafted Cam Barker, a smooth skating D-man out of the WHL.

Our top prospects are Marincin, Klefbom, Musil. After Hall, RNH and Eberle we have zip for scoring. Reider is our top forward prospect and he's a fourth round pick.

The Oilers suck(ed) enough that they needed everyone and anyone, like I mentioned earlier in the thread.

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02-24-2013, 09:52 PM
  #96
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Comparing them to current NHLers...would MacKinnon be similar to Marleau and Drouin similar to Datsyuk?
I've had a lot of comparisons for them, but the more I watch them (and the NHL) I see ...

MacKinnon - Seguin
Drouin - Pat Kane

MacKinnon is a great goal scorer, and will be, don't get me wrong, but I see a lot of potential setting guys up as well ... I don't know if he will reach a Stamkos level of scoring (who will), but I see similar physical attributes, skating and offensive abilities in Seguin and Nate.

Drouin has the hands that would draw a Datsyuk comparison, but not the effort on defense ... Which is why Kane is a better player to liken him to ... Great moves, and will be a perennial 40+ assist player IMO.

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02-24-2013, 09:55 PM
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My bad.

Still, I think MacKinnon and Jones are equal, and drafting a defenceman first overall hasn't turned out well since... Chris Phillips.

Seth Jones will be a #1 defenceman IMO. But the difference between him and MacKinnon is negligible, and in cases like this,

a.) the forward is the safer pick (Tavares/Hedman, Stamkos/Doughty)
b.) taking a player who actually fits your team isn't rearing for a disaster, it's making a smart pick that will balance your team
I agree that Nathan should still get strong consideration for #1, but Jones isn't those guys ... I don't know if GM's are really thinking about pasty #1 D picks, because Jones is a different player on his own ..

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02-24-2013, 09:55 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
It's not a shot at Columbus. I don't even dislike the Jackets, I think they have an underrated team actually. I'm just trying to illustrate my point as to how valuable Jones actually is. I don't really think Columbus is in a position to say they couldn't use him and what he brings. They don't have an elite D-man, they have a collection of solid D-men. Murray hasn't proved anything yet, for all we know he might just be a second pairing guy. Even if he ends up being a top pairing player, a D-core of Johnson, Murray and Jones would be legendary and cup contender worthy in its prime.
What has Jones proven?

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02-24-2013, 09:59 PM
  #99
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What has Jones proven?
He's quite obviously the top prospect in this draft, probably the best D prospect to come around in a while.

Watching both live in the WHL, I can say with confidence he is definitely better than Murray, if that's what you're talking about.

Otherwise, I'm not sure what your point is and how it disproves my BPA theory.

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02-24-2013, 10:00 PM
  #100
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What has Jones proven?
I guess I could also ask, what have Mackinnon and Drouin proved? What makes anyone think they will be the answer to Columbus' scoring woes?

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