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Ryan O'Reilly Headed to Offer Sheet or Trade (Part 4)

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Old
02-25-2013, 11:05 AM
  #351
Qward
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Ottawa fans value Silf more, not sure about management. Personally, I'd rather keep our two guys. We don't need RoR, with Turris on the roster. Our strength is centres, our weakness is skilled wingers. What's the point of increasing our strength and weakening our weakness?

If we trade Silf + 1st for RoR, I'll burn Scotia Bank Place to the ground.
I will supply the gas and an alibi.

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02-25-2013, 11:06 AM
  #352
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I will supply the gas and an alibi.
ill be the wheel man.

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02-25-2013, 11:08 AM
  #353
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Originally Posted by JetsWillFly4Ever View Post
I don't see how the Avs have an advantage by waiting, the longer you wait, you're going to get less and less in a package imo. Why would a GM pay more in a year from now then they would now?
because in the summer you get 80 games out of his 4 year right now its worth 20+ games.

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02-25-2013, 11:24 AM
  #354
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Originally Posted by JetsWillFly4Ever View Post
I don't see how the Avs have an advantage by waiting, the longer you wait, you're going to get less and less in a package imo. Why would a GM pay more in a year from now then they would now?
If he doesn't play this season, he has 4 more years of restricted free agency left. I can't see how his value will be any lower over the summer, in fact it might even be a tad bit higher at the draft when a team desperate to make a splash comes calling (e.g. Columbus or every year NYI claim to be looking for someone like O'Reilly for their top 5 pick).

Now if we're talking 20 games into the 2013-14 season, I would tend to agree his value will begin to decrease at that point.

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02-25-2013, 11:26 AM
  #355
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because in the summer you get 80 games out of his 4 year right now its worth 20+ games.
That is a good point, didn't think about that.

To the other poster, how would it increase it? If you set a price and no one is willing to pay it for this season, why is someone going to pay it in the off season?
EDIT: Fair enough about someone wanting to make a splash at the draft or something along that lines, but idk I just don't see O'Reilly as the player that gets overpaid for at the draft in this type of situation.

I mean I know I would have offered more for O'Reilly coming off his great year last year than after a year long hold out, wouldn't you? I'm not saying don't wait for the right offer, but if you let this thing go beyond this off season you're getting less value for O'Reilly than you would have this season.

I appreciate the responses, not trying to troll or anything I just don't agree that the Avs have all the leverage to wait him out.

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02-25-2013, 11:28 AM
  #356
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Atrocious.

Little + Trouba

for

O'Reilly + 2nd

It's about where I stand in regards to potential trades with Winnipeg. Understandably, I doubt Jets fans wish to give up Trouba, but I respectfully would argue this is perhaps more than fair for both sides if O'Reilly were indeed a Winnipeg target.


Last edited by Lonewolfe2015: 02-25-2013 at 11:40 AM.
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Old
02-25-2013, 11:30 AM
  #357
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Originally Posted by JetsWillFly4Ever View Post
That is a good point, didn't think about that.

To the other poster, how would it increase it? If you set a price and no one is willing to pay it for this season, why is someone going to pay it in the off season?

I mean I know I would have offered more for O'Reilly coming off his great year last year than after a year long hold out, wouldn't you? I'm not saying don't wait for the right offer, but if you let this thing go beyond this off season you're getting less value for O'Reilly than you would have this season.
Because those teams know how good he is compared to majority of the Eastern fans here who've only seen less than 5 games of him and basing his skill on stats.

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02-25-2013, 11:33 AM
  #358
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Originally Posted by JetsWillFly4Ever View Post
That is a good point, didn't think about that.

To the other poster, how would it increase it? If you set a price and no one is willing to pay it for this season, why is someone going to pay it in the off season?

I mean I know I would have offered more for O'Reilly coming off his great year last year than after a year long hold out, wouldn't you? I'm not saying don't wait for the right offer, but if you let this thing go beyond this off season you're getting less value for O'Reilly than you would have this season.
What teams need an excellent young top 2 Center who can become a selke winning top line center and captain for you can be different around the draft, or after the initial wave of big FA signings can be very different from the teams that'll be looking to bring him in right now during a shortened season where they're burning one of his RFA years on like 20 games + playoffs. Plus some of the teams that are interested right now could be more prepared to shake up their teams in the offseason when there'll be plenty of time to integrate ROR, replace any holes made by getting him, and you won't be facing a compacted schedule where taking a couple weeks to find chemistry can knock you way down in the playoff hunt.

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02-25-2013, 11:37 AM
  #359
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I for one am happy the Avs are holding the line. That's better for all the teams.

As for Winnipeg they did give Kane a long term deal after his ELC, but they gave Bogo a bridge the year earlier. So we're 1 and 1 so far I guess. Burmistrov is up next and I would guess he gets a bridge deal as well. But you never know.
When you draft a guy like Kane, a bridge contract is probably unnecessary. Tavares and Hedman also got big second contracts. Duchene probably would have too, if not for last season's injuries.

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02-25-2013, 11:40 AM
  #360
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What teams need an excellent young top 2 Center who can become a selke winning top line center and captain for you can be different around the draft, or after the initial wave of big FA signings can be very different from the teams that'll be looking to bring him in right now during a shortened season where they're burning one of his RFA years on like 20 games + playoffs. Plus some of the teams that are interested right now could be more prepared to shake up their teams in the offseason when there'll be plenty of time to integrate ROR, replace any holes made by getting him, and you won't be facing a compacted schedule where taking a couple weeks to find chemistry can knock you way down in the playoff hunt.
Thanks for a clear response.

I didn't think of it in that way and you are definitely correct. You can have a lot more teams interested in the off season who wouldn't have been during this season who may value ROR higher than the teams interested now.

I will have to agree with the poster earlier then, beyond this off season his value will decrease.

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02-25-2013, 11:41 AM
  #361
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What teams need an excellent young top 2 Center who can become a selke winning top line center and captain for you can be different around the draft, or after the initial wave of big FA signings can be very different from the teams that'll be looking to bring him in right now during a shortened season where they're burning one of his RFA years on like 20 games + playoffs. Plus some of the teams that are interested right now could be more prepared to shake up their teams in the offseason when there'll be plenty of time to integrate ROR, replace any holes made by getting him, and you won't be facing a compacted schedule where taking a couple weeks to find chemistry can knock you way down in the playoff hunt.


If Sherman truly believed this then he should play nice with O'Reilly and pay him 5 million a year ......and then trade Stasny.

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02-25-2013, 11:42 AM
  #362
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Originally Posted by JetsWillFly4Ever View Post
Thanks for a clear response.

I didn't think of it in that way and you are definitely correct. You can have a lot more teams interested in the off season who wouldn't have been during this season who may value ROR higher than the teams interested now.

I will have to agree with the poster earlier then, beyond this off season his value will decrease.
Yeah, I think that's the case as well. If this drags on throughout the summer and still isn't resolved when teams are breaking from the their training camp, the Avs will start seeing weaker and weaker offers.

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02-25-2013, 11:43 AM
  #363
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If Sherman truly believed this then he should play nice with O'Reilly and pay him 5 million a year ......and then trade Stasny.
I'm beginning to wonder if fans remember that we just had an unnecessary lockout, one that was fueled by Money.

The value of the 2nd Contract became VERY important during the lockout, there's nothing wrong with a "Prove It" contract.

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02-25-2013, 11:43 AM
  #364
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Originally Posted by Lonewolfe2015 View Post
Atrocious.

Little + Trouba

for

O'Reilly + 2nd

It's about where I stand in regards to potential trades with Winnipeg. Understandably, I doubt Jets fans wish to give up Trouba, but I respectively would argue this is perhaps more than fair for both sides if O'Reilly were indeed a Winnipeg target.
Understandably, I would want Trouba too, but that really is a pipe dream for the Avs. Trouba is 100 % Chevy's guy. He won't trade him for anything less than an overpayment.

If Trouba were to be going he other way, JETS add a 2nd and the Avs 2nd becomes a 1st in my opinion. No way do I trade him without a 2013 1st coming back because like Chevy, I like Trouba too much to include him for just ROR.

Just my view on the matter.

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02-25-2013, 11:43 AM
  #365
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Originally Posted by Joe Sakic View Post
ROR for Little, 2nd 2013?
We have 3 second rounders this year, I think it makes sense for both sides. I just want a player like ROR on the Jets so bad. Old Zhamnov likes to try and fleece other orgs' top young guys haha.

Seriously though, I would do it.

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02-25-2013, 11:45 AM
  #366
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Originally Posted by Lonewolfe2015 View Post
If he doesn't play this season, he has 4 more years of restricted free agency left. I can't see how his value will be any lower over the summer, in fact it might even be a tad bit higher at the draft when a team desperate to make a splash comes calling (e.g. Columbus or every year NYI claim to be looking for someone like O'Reilly for their top 5 pick).

Now if we're talking 20 games into the 2013-14 season, I would tend to agree his value will begin to decrease at that point.
Actually, the NY press says Snow wants 1 player, who's upside is similar to the prospects he's passing up.

Is ROR's upside similar to McKinnon/Jones/Drouin/Barkov or whichever youngster is available when Snow drafts?

I do agree that 4 full seasons of holding ROR's rights, is preferrable to a little more them 3 and 1/3 seasons.

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02-25-2013, 11:47 AM
  #367
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ROR for Little, 2nd 2013?
I want no part of Little, he's a solid 2nd line player and our top 6 is filled with 2nd line players.

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02-25-2013, 11:51 AM
  #368
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Ideally a mid level prospect that's expendable would be best to give up for the Jets to add to Little for ROR. Unfortunately we have a massive gap between Scheifele, Trouba and the rest of the relative junk ASG left us outside of the NHL. Lowry is literally the only guy that's in between gold and dirt (not top six or top 4) in our system.

So one of the 2nds is really the only thing that fits value wise because even for ROR we can't afford to give up anyone extra from the NHL roster.

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02-25-2013, 11:52 AM
  #369
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If Sherman truly believed this then he should play nice with O'Reilly and pay him 5 million a year ......and then trade Stasny.
Should, but Sherman's not the only one making this decision. There's a lot of people being childish on both sides of this. It's really annoying cause it's so obvious that it would go this way. Avs are insistent on using bridge contracts with their young players and are deadset on proving to their other youngsters that they won't **** around if you try to strong arm them. So they were always going to be very firm on giving a 2year deal around 4 a year.

Ryan meanwhile is a very proud guy who knows he's not going to get that big contract if he doesn't get to play a top 2 role where he can put up numbers, and so was concerned the Avs would use him the way they did his first two years when both Staz and Dutchy got better minutes and wingers than he did, including all of the PP time, and so wanted to get the Avs to either give him his long term deal now, or pay him so much that they were forced to either use him as a top 2 C or trade him to someone who would.

And in the negotiations apparently some things were said that offended Ryan's pride after his agents put together a 10 page letter making the case that Ryan is one of the best defensive forwards of the past 25 years...yeah, not even joking on that one...and now we are were we are. When you have two sides so stubbornly entrenched and feelings get hurt, it's gunna take a long time.

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02-25-2013, 11:54 AM
  #370
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Actually, the NY press says Snow wants 1 player, who's upside is similar to the prospects he's passing up.

Is ROR's upside similar to McKinnon/Jones/Drouin/Barkov or whichever youngster is available when Snow drafts?

I do agree that 4 full seasons of holding ROR's rights, is preferrable to a little more them 3 and 1/3 seasons.
I would trade the #5 pick for O'Reilly if the Avs held it and I were as familiar with Ryan as I am right now.

He's got the offensive potential in him to be a #1b center in his prime and he's got the defensive prowess to win a couple Selkes. He's also so incredibly disciplined I'd be surprised if he doesn't get nominated for a Byng during his peak offensive years.

Quite simply put, any team that gambles on him now will win in the end most likely. The Avs are very unlikely to get a trade which equals his potential worth even if we get some of the packages we've brought up in these threads. He's got the drive to turn a winning franchise around, that's how dedicated he is.

So yes, I would not be surprised if Snow came calling in the offseason offering up his 1st for O'Reilly... depending on where his opinion of your prospects up the middle stands.

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02-25-2013, 11:55 AM
  #371
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I want no part of Little, he's a solid 2nd line player and our top 6 is filled with 2nd line players.
I'm with you. Little would be a good fit next to Landy and Staz, but if we're trading Ryan away that's the centerpiece coming back the trade will have been a failure for us. This trade needs to bring back someone who can play with EJ, or will be able to soon, or a very dynamic forward prospect, not a great fit for our second line.

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02-25-2013, 11:58 AM
  #372
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I want no part of Little, he's a solid 2nd line player and our top 6 is filled with 2nd line players.
ROR has potential to be one of the top 5 #2C's in the league...but lets be reasonable here. No one is going to give up a blue chip future 1st liner or an established one. Colorado can afford to be patient, but that doesn't mean that someone is going to offer you a package greater than ROR when everyone knows his value to Colorado on the ice going forward is nil.

Burmistrov has more potential than Little, but he could also not produce as much offensively if he doesn't progress a lot. I'd heard you guys need defense more than anything though. we dont have anyone thats the right value, so if you guys go a different route that's cool too.

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02-25-2013, 11:59 AM
  #373
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ROR+O'Byrne for Little+2013 1st (top 5 protected)

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02-25-2013, 12:03 PM
  #374
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When is the deadline for him to sign a contract if he wants to play in the nhl this season? Or is there not one this year?


Last edited by hurricanedave: 02-25-2013 at 12:12 PM.
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02-25-2013, 12:05 PM
  #375
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ROR+O'Byrne for Little+2013 1st (top 5 protected)
No chance the JETS consider that.

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