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Reasons as to why Samsonov + Johnson + rookie >> Zednik + Bulis + Sundstrom

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Old
07-17-2006, 11:21 AM
  #26
Mike8
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I think you bring up a good point with your analysis on the passing. Montreal will be a very good puck possession team that will move the puck quickly and effectively. Zednik and Bulis were breakdowns in the puck possession process, while Johnson and especially Samsonov will bolster Montreal's system and mentality.

One problem I do have with your analysis is that Sundstrom had lost his spot on the club. I do not see any rookie replacing him in any substantial way since Sundstrom had become the 14th forward (Koivu, Kovalev, Samsonov, Ribeiro, Johnson, Higgins, Plekanec, Ryder, Perezhogin, Begin, Bonk, Murray, Downey being the top 13)

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07-17-2006, 12:12 PM
  #27
toshiro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by type_v View Post
What about defensively?
Johnson is not better than Bulis (maybe a little worse) in his own end. Samsonov is an offense first forward like Zednik so about par. No rookie to crack the lineup will have the positioning and smarts of Sundstrom.

The new group will most definitely be better, but not in every single aspect of the game.
Johnson plays a good 2 way game.

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07-17-2006, 12:47 PM
  #28
Psycho Papa Joe
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The plain and simple truth is that among Samsonov, Johnson, Bulis and Zednik, the Habs ended up with the two best players and an upgrade in draft position. Great job by Gainey.


Last edited by Psycho Papa Joe: 07-17-2006 at 01:36 PM.
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Old
07-17-2006, 01:25 PM
  #29
Pere Noel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
I think you bring up a good point with your analysis on the passing. Montreal will be a very good puck possession team that will move the puck quickly and effectively. Zednik and Bulis were breakdowns in the puck possession process, while Johnson and especially Samsonov will bolster Montreal's system and mentality.

One problem I do have with your analysis is that Sundstrom had lost his spot on the club. I do not see any rookie replacing him in any substantial way since Sundstrom had become the 14th forward (Koivu, Kovalev, Samsonov, Ribeiro, Johnson, Higgins, Plekanec, Ryder, Perezhogin, Begin, Bonk, Murray, Downey being the top 13)
In someways, it crossed my mind that if they were to play Zednik on the other side of Ovechkin... Oveckin may end up with less scoring opportunities

But I don't think Washington will let that happen

As for Sundstrom, he did lose his spot, but not after playing a total of 55 games... Those 55 games will be given to a blend of rookie and second year rookies... hence an overall increase in our number of goals and points over the course of the season.

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07-17-2006, 01:40 PM
  #30
Pere Noel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
The plain and simple truth is that among Samsonov, Johnson, Bulis and Zednik, the Habs ended up with the two best players and an upgrade in draft position. Great job by Gainey.
No doubt about it.

Gainey knew that he could replace Bulis.

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07-17-2006, 01:49 PM
  #31
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I don't care on how many points Zed will get with Ovechkin. Their team isn't enough good to make the playoff and with these move we'll not clinch our spot wwith 2-3 to play. Our team is better on paper, we've a better chemistery and we draft earlier. We lose some defensive play? Not really I think Johnson is better then Bulis in his zone. Nobody can be bad as Zednik in the D zone and Sundstrom was excelent but he just can play in short handed. When he's on th ice their team can't score but our team too so...

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07-17-2006, 02:27 PM
  #32
Pere Noel
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Originally Posted by kostitsyn1489 View Post
I don't care on how many points Zed will get with Ovechkin. Their team isn't enough good to make the playoff and with these move we'll not clinch our spot wwith 2-3 to play. Our team is better on paper, we've a better chemistery and we draft earlier. We lose some defensive play? Not really I think Johnson is better then Bulis in his zone. Nobody can be bad as Zednik in the D zone and Sundstrom was excelent but he just can play in short handed. When he's on th ice their team can't score but our team too so...
I think Philadelphia is a team that will have to start worrying about us ...

As for Washington, that will take more than Pothier to make them a defensive powerhouse

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07-17-2006, 02:44 PM
  #33
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That was a excellent analysis.

I recently read some comments from Samsonov's agent about his signing with Montreal. Gainey was on the phone with him from 12 noon of the first day of free agency. There were 4 teams in the running, and some were offering him longer (4 year) deals. The Canadiens' offer was the most appealing, as Samsonov liked the idea of having two good seasons in Montreal, then testing the free agency waters again at age 29.

Read the details starting near the bottom of this article [registration required, but it's free]:

http://www.boston.com/sports/hockey/...ophers/?page=2
http://www.boston.com/sports/hockey/...ophers/?page=3

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07-17-2006, 03:23 PM
  #34
Pere Noel
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Originally Posted by habscout View Post
That was a excellent analysis.

I recently read some comments from Samsonov's agent about his signing with Montreal. Gainey was on the phone with him from 12 noon of the first day of free agency. There were 4 teams in the running, and some were offering him longer (4 year) deals. The Canadiens' offer was the most appealing, as Samsonov liked the idea of having two good seasons in Montreal, then testing the free agency waters again at age 29.

Read the details starting near the bottom of this article [registration required, but it's free]:

http://www.boston.com/sports/hockey/...ophers/?page=2
http://www.boston.com/sports/hockey/...ophers/?page=3
Thanks Habscout for the links.

I found the following particularly interesting:
Speedy and devilishly clever, the hard-working Samsonov has yet to find that one, true fit for a center. But he also has never had anyone like Koivu, 32 this November, as a skate-and-shoot partner. Could this finally be the guy? Perhaps. Of the bunch -- Samsonov, Koivu, and Kovalev -- none of them ever has had a 100-point season. All three, in some sense, have been looking for just that right fit.
Interesting that a team which had Thornton on its roster... look at Koivu as being a better fit for Samsonov.

Now all that being said, we all know that Koivu had been putting Thornton in his back pocket a few times come playoff times.

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07-17-2006, 03:56 PM
  #35
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Well here's the question then -- is there going to be a Samsonov-Koivu-Kovalev line?

The assumption based on Carbo's comments was that Sammy would go with Ribs and Kovalev. Meanwhile he has a reasonable facsimile of the Finnish #1 line going with Lethinen's role rather ably filled by Higgins, Selanne's more or less handled by Ryder (at least the scoring part!) and Saku Koivu's role being filled by, well, Saku Koivu. They were excellent even with Ryder hurting, and they will be tough to break up.

Nevertheless the uber-line has definite potential; all three of these guys are fast, skilled, good puck handlers and surefire first-liners; Kovalev would find himself with two hard-working guys he would have to follow; and Koivu can provide defense for that line; it could be a dominant trio. Meanwhile Ribeiro has been successful in the past with Ryder, and Higgins may be a good it as a scorer and defensive conscience.

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Old
07-17-2006, 05:29 PM
  #36
Pere Noel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Well here's the question then -- is there going to be a Samsonov-Koivu-Kovalev line?

The assumption based on Carbo's comments was that Sammy would go with Ribs and Kovalev. Meanwhile he has a reasonable facsimile of the Finnish #1 line going with Lethinen's role rather ably filled by Higgins, Selanne's more or less handled by Ryder (at least the scoring part!) and Saku Koivu's role being filled by, well, Saku Koivu. They were excellent even with Ryder hurting, and they will be tough to break up.

Nevertheless the uber-line has definite potential; all three of these guys are fast, skilled, good puck handlers and surefire first-liners; Kovalev would find himself with two hard-working guys he would have to follow; and Koivu can provide defense for that line; it could be a dominant trio. Meanwhile Ribeiro has been successful in the past with Ryder, and Higgins may be a good it as a scorer and defensive conscience.
From Carbo's comment it sounded like Ribeiro would play with Samsonov and Kovalev.

The mention of Samsonov playing with Koivu was from a remote Boston's analyst.

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